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Original poster

Zero tolerance schools and slant techniques for send - good, okay or terrible

283 replies

Zerotolerancetofun · 24/03/2023 23:46

Dd is starting secondary next year. The school has a zero tolerance behaviour policy so very strict about everything (uniform, homework, behaviour etc). They are also bringing in this new teaching technique called slant that the kids are meant to follow - about how they sit/pay attention/look at the teachers - it sounds very Draconian.

Dd has ASD and significant levels of anxiety and I am concerned how this environment will work for her. I think she will be terrified of making a mistake and getting detention for minor mistakes, but of course if this approach stops bullying etc then that is a good thing for her.

I'd love to know how other people's DC have got on with this type of school. Particularly if they have ASD, but also NT children too.

OP posts:
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HeBeaverandSheBeaver · 24/03/2023 23:48

I think this sounds awful

My dd has adhd and anxiety and she would be very stressed in such an environment

I'd would Be re considering my choice of school if I'm honest.

OxygenthiefexH · 24/03/2023 23:50

It is a study on disability discrimination. The school will have to make reasonable adjustments and whilst some neaurodiverse children benefit from very very clear rules and routines, to others, this is the 9th circle of hell.

I think it sounds utterly dickish.

discobrain · 24/03/2023 23:54

That sounds like something from that godawful woman Katharine Birbalsingh's Michaela school playbook. She's HORRIBLE.

Original poster
Zerotolerancetofun · 24/03/2023 23:54

@HeBeaverandSheBeaver The only other local school is part of the same academy trust so has the same approach 😭. It is a significant drive to another school and not really an option for us.

OP posts:
Amiable · 24/03/2023 23:56

My 17 year old is autistic and went to a strict school. It was horrendous.

Due to their increasing anxiety and ensuing school refusal they ended up having a terrible few years, lost friends, went from being predicted 10 grade 9 GCSEs to scraping 4, and their mental health suffered enormously.

If I could do it again I would move house to enable them to go to a more caring, nurturing school that prioritises well-being over qualifications.

saraclara · 25/03/2023 00:03

My daughter is an anxious perfectionist. She would have been SO stressed in a school like this. With no reason to be because she was always a model pupil. But she'd still have been terrified of accidentally breaking a rule. And it would have made her even more rule bound and ultra-confirming than she already is. And that's not a good thing imo.

Fairydustandsparklylights · 25/03/2023 00:14

It’s a good thing. General behaviour in lessons in schools like these are so much better. No loss of learning and no silly behaviour. The teachers will know the send needs of their pupils and will work with the child and help them to develop this behaviour over time. They tend to be much calmer environments with clear rules and consequences. They are also less chaotic and so benefit send children.

Fairydustandsparklylights · 25/03/2023 00:17

It’s also not zero tolerance to fun like your username suggests. It’s zero tolerance to rude and disruptive behaviour which impact a child’s progress.

turbulented · 25/03/2023 00:23

My DS discovered his neurodiversity (ASD/ADHD and SPLD) by going to a school like this. It was a terrible experience for him. Increasingly anxious, paranoid even, much more rule bound. We are working on an escape for him but most of the local schools are like that. I feel so bad he's been so traumatised.

XelaM · 25/03/2023 00:24

discobrain · 24/03/2023 23:54

That sounds like something from that godawful woman Katharine Birbalsingh's Michaela school playbook. She's HORRIBLE.

Have you seen the documentary on her school called Britain's strictest headmistress on ITVX? I actually thought a lot of what she said made sense and the kids seemed happy.

My daughter would hate a strict school though as she's a but of a rebel 🤦‍♀️

AmyandPhilipfan · 25/03/2023 00:25

I can't comment on Slant but I sent my two foster sons to a very strict school because they respond well to the security of rules. The oldest one I think is possibly autistic, though the traits are put down to attachment issues, and I really worried about his transition to secondary but he has been fine. In Year 10 now and no major problems. Whereas his best friend from Year 6 at primary who was quite similar in many ways and struggled academically as he does went to a more permissive secondary school and has had all sorts of problems and is now in a behaviour unit part of the school.

My younger boy I worried about even more as he struggled massively in holiday clubs and places where he was meant to have fun because he couldn't control himself and his behaviour always went too far because he didn't know where the boundary was. So this school is perfect for him because, for example, he knows without a doubt that if he doesn't do his homework he will get a detention.

This works for some children but probably not all. Some might find it very oppressive, though I must say I've always found the teachers friendly and caring - they just are quick to crack down on any breaking of a school rule.

saraclara · 25/03/2023 00:27

Fairydustandsparklylights · 25/03/2023 00:17

It’s also not zero tolerance to fun like your username suggests. It’s zero tolerance to rude and disruptive behaviour which impact a child’s progress.

The person who initiated SLANT had changed his mind about it and no longer favours it himself.
He's changed hi recommendations now

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/the-big-interview-doug-lemov/

So is when you visit the school I'd ask if they're going to amend their policy from the one that he more discredits himself, to one that's less prescriptive ( he now had an amended version called STAR) I'd also ask how they manage the needs of neuro diverse pupils within their rules..

The big interview: Doug Lemov

The first two editions of Teach Like A Champion by Doug Lemov have had huge influence. But now he explains why he is rethinking his approach to behaviour advice…

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/the-big-interview-doug-lemov

saraclara · 25/03/2023 00:27

Sorry about the typos. Bedtime

turbulented · 25/03/2023 00:29

@Fairydustandsparklylights yes, my son would have found being in a school with a lot of chaos and disruption just as hard. But the rules are enforced with fear and punishment, so it does feel really oppressive.

Even now with all his conditions recognised by school and all the reasonable adjustments applied, there's nowhere near consistent handling of his SEN from all teachers.

MrsJaxTeller3 · 25/03/2023 00:30

Zerotolerancetofun · 24/03/2023 23:54

@HeBeaverandSheBeaver The only other local school is part of the same academy trust so has the same approach 😭. It is a significant drive to another school and not really an option for us.

My child whilst no formal diagnosis ticks every box for add/adhd and she is struggling with slant. Really really struggling. 7 months into secondary school and I'm crazy enough to be considering home school because of this. She has been 'sent' to sanctions four times in two weeks, they cannot manage her effectively, she cannot regulate in the environment and as she has other health challenges, one of which is bladder related she walked out of three lessons last week when she was refused a toilet visit. School know everything and yet expect her to conform.
I will not allow them to break her. She is headstrong, opinionated, very strong and beautifully loyal to her beliefs and I simply won't allow the education system to bend another of my children until they break.
Travel to the other school. Unfortunately we don't have that luxury, it's the school she's at or home school where we live. And if I home school I will pull all of them from mainstream.

HeBeaverandSheBeaver · 25/03/2023 08:07

In that case Op all you can do is try it and see how she is. If she get very anxious or school refuses tho I'd definitely look at other options. Don't let it fester for years

My dd went to a caring school but was undiagnosed until recently and she is really struggling in sixth form.

School have been good but school is hard for kids with ADHD. I'm hoping collage might work better for her if she does drop out.

Original poster
Zerotolerancetofun · 25/03/2023 08:15

I'm sorry to hear from those of you whose child have had bad experiences in these types of school 💐. Was there any allowances made for these rules due to send? Even if there is I think this whole culture will spark her anxiety.

The things I've read on slant are very mixed and the article from the ADHD foundation seems to ring true. I can imagine my daughter being so focused/worried about doing all this that it will distract her from learning anything!

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Chilloutsnow · 25/03/2023 08:16

Perfect my NT, academic child who wants to learn but gets annoyed at the constant disruption from other children in the class with their “needs”. Unfortunately those children who have genuine special needs are now lumped into the SEMH/behavioural umberella and before you know it, you’ve only got 50 percent of the class who want to engage but are struggling to do so.

Personally I would think twice about this school if my child did havs SEN, however my son goes to a school like this and is thriving. They have an ethos which rewards good behaviour with lots of reward trips for good kids. About time really. I have heard on the grapevine how it probably ticks a few inclusive boxes but in practice it very much doesn’t and I’m fine with that.

MadamNoo · 25/03/2023 08:33

We sent ds to a school like this, not without misgivings but it was a new school and we felt the ordered classroom without disruption or bullying and the clear rules would be a reassuring framework. It was OK for year 7 but deteriorated rapidly after that, and the fundamental issue was that they continued punishing him for the same behaviour that they were ostensibly supporting him for because of the ‘no excuses’ discipline. He ended up wanting to be put in the isolation room in order to escape from the classroom environment so that wasn’t very successful.. we eventually took him out of school in year 10 and wish we had sooner, but by then his mental health was very poor and he hasn’t successfully gone back to school since.

MadamNoo · 25/03/2023 08:35

And echoing what people have said about choices, these techniques appear to be the current fashion in education and even the non-academy schools in the area are introducing more detentions, uniform rules etc

Chilloutsnow · 25/03/2023 08:39

@MadamNoo

They are attempting to regain some control and order that has been dissolved over the last decade, for that I can’t blame them. I wouldn’t particularly say that was a fashion, I would say it was much needed. I suspect parents will moan about this, but then also moan when behaviour standards dip and the school is just anarchy.

Littlecamellia · 25/03/2023 08:41

discobrain · 24/03/2023 23:54

That sounds like something from that godawful woman Katharine Birbalsingh's Michaela school playbook. She's HORRIBLE.

On the other hand, her pupils are happy and they get excellent results. I am not sure how many SEN pupils there are, though. It doesn't sound the right atmosphere for an anxious child.

alyceflowers · 25/03/2023 08:45

My NT (and generally well behaved/eager to please) child tolerates this approach and gets on fine.
My NNT child is now home educated.

Untitledsquatboulder · 25/03/2023 08:48

We have a local school like this. We did not consider it because it would not suit ds as he is autistic and anxious (v well behaved but terrified of being " in trouble").

The school does however have a higher than average proportion of neurodiverse students- many parent seek them out specifically for their children with autism or ADHD. Sometimes it works, sometimes it's a disaster. I guess the very rigid but predictable rules, absence of low level disruption, large amount of structure (including lunch and breaks) and things like quiet corridors work well for some autistic children - at least compared to other schools on offer.