DH says he won’t honour my wishes re death.

[Chocchops72]

So all this is theoretical as (touch wood) I’m in my 50s and in good health.

i haven’t completely researched this yet, but I am very keen not to have my life extended if I descend into either a debilitating and terminal illness or develop dementia, to the extent where I am bedridden, incontinent, unable to communicate and I want to put in place whatever paperwork I can to ensure this.

DH is refusing to support me in this and says he would not enact it, for two reasons.

one, we watched a Ted talk recently which talked about ‘future selves’ and how people genuinely do change their minds about big decisions / beliefs they have, as they age. So people that have signed an advanced directive, setting out the circumstances where they wish to be allowed to die, may genuinely change their minds about this as they get older. I agree with this to an extent, but I don’t think a decision made when in full control of one’s faculties (ie now) should necessarily overrule a change of heart that might theoretically come once the person has lost the capacity to make a decision. DH has taken it totally at face value though, probably connected to the second reason.

two, his mum is currently in a nursing home. She has Parkinson’s, dementia and severe osteoporosis. She is almost totally immobile, incontinent, cannot speak, communicate or feed herself. She basically lies in a chair or lies in a bed, is fed / washed / toileted, and talked at. Or left in a room with inane cartoons blaring at her. Or being jollied along by nurses / carers. FIL visits daily: he has made these visits the sole focus of his life, his duty / responsibility and expects everyone else to think the same way. If he can’t make it, he insists that SIL (who already visits 2-3 times a week) to take his place, and he calls her every night to ‘update’ her on her mothers (unchanging) condition, which she finds very hard. DH (because we live abroad) get roped into weekly zoom calls, where he basically talks to his dad and sister while his mum sleeps through the whole thing or makes random mumbled comments. Yet because she is cared for she might live in this half-existence for years and years to come.

i have absolutely zero desire to live like this. Or for him and our two DSs to end up caring for me or binding their daily lives to me, or feeling guilty because they don’t. But DH takes it as a great insult when I says this, as if I’m suggesting his mum would be better off dead and that they (FIL and SIL in particular) are stupid for making her so much the focus of their lives.

My experience of MILs situation is that the spouse generally gets asked what the patients wishes are, and I don’t know if medical staff would go actively against the wishes of a spouse. Even if they didn’t match what the patient has written down previously.

what do you think? AIBU to expect DH to enact my stated wishes, even if they don’t accord with his beliefs?

I think he should try to follow your wishes but I also think medical staff should and will listen to him not what you have written down years earlier. But why are you thinking so hard about it, when you are only in your 50s and in good health.

To get him on board you could discuss writing an advanced directive that’s valid for say 5 years, so you have to rewrite it every 5 years, then he can’t use the ‘you’ll have changed your mind!’ Argument. But also, you can give a close friend, other family or your children your medical power of attorney, and add a statement as to why you are doing this into the document before they sign it. Then they would get the actual say I think; you could check with a lawyer if you wanted. I have my husband as medical power of attorney in the event I’m not capable and then if he’s not available/capable (I forget the exact set up) 3 family members.

I think you can write a living will with these kinds of wishes. I really do t know if that would over ride a spouse though. It's sad he's not listening to you. I hope he won't change his mind after a few years of pain/cartoons/boredom.

The thing is if you do become like your MIL through dementia for example, you will need to be looked after i.e. there's no just 'letting you die' legally allowed. Maybe in the future the law will change but doesn't look to be the case for now.

Obviously your DH should be willing to enact your wishes as much as possible though. My DP is similar in his views around illness/death/dying to your DH whereas my views more align with yours, however DP will go along with what I want when the time comes

No unreasonable

but neither is he if he simply doesn’t feel capable of doing this

This is something that troubles me greatly. I have elderly parents who are so fearful of ending up like your MIL, not least because of the debilitating cost of care when they would rather not be around. I don’t know the answer but I feel the same as you.

i haven’t completely researched this yet

how about you bother researching it then before you have a discussion with your DH about it

DH takes it as a great insult when I says this, as if I’m suggesting his mum would be better off dead and that they (FIL and SIL in particular) are stupid for making her so much the focus of their lives.

It’s not a surprising reaction at all. I think that - whilst I agree with you wholeheartedly for myself on the principle and would want my wishes followed - you are probably being somewhat insensitive to how difficult this subject is for him to even contemplate right now.

You’ve made your wishes known to him. Make an advance directive etc if you want to. Tell your children if appropriate (old enough). Then drop the subject entirely.

I guess it depends what the law is where you live. In England you can appoint whoever you want as Medical/care power of attorney, however it only means that they will listen to your preferences. It helps more for choosing nursing homes, so is useful to have, and better than having to go to court. Ultimately the doctors will decide what is best for you, but would discuss it with your dh/ power of attorney.

You’re not going to be in the same kind of state his mother is in the next five years. Let him deal with that before making things about you.

I can see where you are coming from but I think you're bring insensitive in bringing it up while this is actually happening to a family member of his right now. I think most people would hear what you're saying as "your mum would be better off dead" in his position.

I also don't understand what you would like done differently for you. His mum's situation sounds awful but I didn't think there was any way, legally, to stop providing care which keeps her alive. What exactly are you asking him to do?

Also - you sound as if you think your FIL can do something differently in terms of his wife’s life.

He can’t.

Perhaps he’s not handling it well, but that’s different.

Your MIL is being cared for in a home. She’s not being kept alive in a situation where there’s another option to choose.

You should try to accept that something like this could happen to you even if you have a signed expression of wishes and your loved ones are on board with that. Voluntary euthanasia is not legal currently.

I think you're being a bit of a...I don't know, a rude word anyway, about his mum.
I think his family sound amazing and that it says a lot about them and his mum that they all take such good care of her.

You're being entirely sensible to think about this and the PP said you shouldn't is being ridiculous. We should all plan ahead for the worst - it doesn't mean we wont live a long, long life.
I think your DH is BU and you are wise to think about what you want in this situation. And he should follow your wishes. Everyone should set up Power of Attorney for health and finances. And have a will. They will give you peace of mind and will have absolutely no impact on when you die or become incapacitated.

If you are referring to me, I haven’t said she shouldn’t think about it. I was wondering why she is thinking quite so hard about it and by sounds of it making such an issue of it right now. Right now when it is not on the horizon and when her husband is dealing with his mother going through similar.

Your husband doesn't feel he can support you with ending your life? He doesn't want to be without you regardless of what capacity that is?

Thank goodness DNAR are not something relatives can dictate and are written medical decisions that complete strangers decide based on more than what a patient or their relatives want.

You sound like you begrudge the zoom call that your DH makes to support his father and mother.
This is what your DH is reacting to, I think.

Be kind nd respectful of the feelings for MIL and for their choices.
You can write your choices down and research more but you have many years to do this. Don't make it a huge issue when the last thing your spouse wishes to concentrate on is you being as ill as his mother.

OP you are being very unkind about your Husband’s Mum.

No one knows what she is aware of, or not.

Euthanasia in UK isn’t yet legal, I would prefer euthanasia for myself if I became unaware, but no one will end a life because It’s been requested.

DNR is a different thing.
( Do not resuscitate).

Exactly..
Op comes across as almost jealous of the care her husband has for his Family.

I really don't think it's an appropriate topic of conversation when his mother is in a nursing home in the condition she's in. I think you need to be a bit more sensitive to what he's going through and park it completely for now.

I also think you're being a little naive about end of life care and the reality of long-term, debilitating illnesses like dementia.

Of course the vast majority of us don't want to end up like your MIL, but realistically what choices do you think people actually have when it comes to this kind of thing?

Unless you're in hospital on life support, or your heart stops during surgery and you've requested a DNR - doctors can't just end your life for you. It's not how it works.

You need a health and Welfare power of attorney.

You should write your wishes. Bit don't expect your husband can deal with this now. In time you can talk to your children.

Your husband is in a very difficult position and effectively you are saying his mum should be dead. How can he hear that?

I'm with you in your wishes. But please understand why he can't engage in this discussion at this time. Don't fight with him about it. Jist put your thought into a living will that has a DNR.

But a DNR wouldn't be relevant if OP ended up like her MIL anyway.

My dm is pretty certain my df will not follow her end of life requests.
She has asked myself and my dsis to ensure that they are followed.
She has left a passworded document on her iPad and has given us details as to where to find and access it.

This

I think you are being utterly insensitive, patronising and very uncaring towards DH as his Mum is in the exact situation you describe that YOU don't want to be in

I'm appalled at your insensitivity

My parent is in a Nursing Home.

Palliative end of life care.

All medicines stopped on Doctors advice.

My parent is kept comfortable, warm and as fed and hydrated as possible (not very possible as parent doesn't want to eat or drink)

The Doctor says my parent could die today or in 5 years

It breaks my heart. What would you have me do, OP? Hmmmm? Put a pillow over parent's face when I visit today?

I suggest that you THINK before you post and then do some bloody decent research 🙄