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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Would you be a SAHP to pre-schoolers if you were financially independent?

267 replies

Kitchenette · 10/03/2023 08:20

Not super-rich but say you had enough capital to pay yourself an income for life equal to your full time earnings.

I’m always interested in SAHP threads on here and the various very reasonable objections people raise to it- that you’re making yourself vulnerable financially while also putting too great a strain on the paid working partner. But say we took money out of it- would you prefer to stay at home or go to work? For the purposes of the poll it’s a binary choice (of course IRL the best answer for many of us would be to work PT).

YABU- I would prefer to be in paid employment
YANBU- I would prefer to be a SAHP

Me- I’ve had periods of SAHM, FT and PT work since my children were born. Binary choice with pre-school children and no money worries-I’d be at home, no question.

OP posts:
Thepeopleversuswork · 10/03/2023 17:22

Twizbe · 10/03/2023 16:56

My mum was a working mum and I'm a SAHM so bang goes that theory.

What has stuck though is the expectations on my husband. My dad was incredibly hands on. The only thing he didn't do was breastfeed us. He also did his fair share of household chores. Now a days he cooks more than mum does (and he is a really good cook)

From the moment I moved in with DH I was clear I wasn't doing it all and that adulting would be shared. What that has looked like has changed and evolved for sure. DH is very much an active parent and partner. I might be a SAHM but we work as a team together.

I hope my children see that and take that example forward as well.

Btw my daughter wants to be a doctor with a big house and a 100 million children. My son wants to be an engineering teacher and live in a flat and then stay home to raise his babies .....

Well your case is an N of 1 so a single anecdote doesn't cancel out a dataset with thousands of points.

But good that you have high standards of your husband! That's the last frontier of sexism and in many ways is even harder to crack than getting more women into good jobs.

Twizbe · 10/03/2023 17:24

Botw1 · 10/03/2023 17:10

@Twizbe

So you can see the obvious correlation with having a working mum and showing the benefits of equal parenting?

But you think the theory is worthless?

Anacdata doesn't trump data.

Correlation does not mean causation.

My mum working did not cause my dad to be very involved. He was very involved because that's who he is.

I saw the team work and have worked to create that dynamic in my family.

I've been a full time working mum and a SAHM, I much prefer staying home.

Dachshund · 10/03/2023 17:27

I’ve been a SAHM for 7 years, and I’ll be returning to work in Sept when DD2 starts school. I have absolutely loved it and I’m honestly feeling exceptionally sad about having to return to work. I’ve never enjoyed a job and I’m a real homebody so it has suited my personality to be home with my children. I’m also grateful that we were able to afford it as a couple because it’s what I really wanted and I got to have those precious first years with my children. We spent at least 95% of the time together and I was well aware how lucky I was

If money was no issue I’d be a SAHM forever!

Botw1 · 10/03/2023 17:31

@Twizbe

I certainly agree that not making yourself the default parent is the way to go

Much easier to do that if you're not a sahp.

Awumminnscotland · 10/03/2023 17:34

You can be a role model of behaviour by demonstrating or living different life skills like resilience, hard work, commitment to your values, self-respect,ability to make choices about your life and follow them through. Also by discussing why different families prioritise different things in their lives and sometimes at different times. This can all be done without me going out to work. I have had a career and that is discussed in our family as well as why I don't currently work. Many people have many varied experiences of working, academia,being at home parents. The ones that don't work are not necessarily giving lesser life lessons to gheir children.
What my child gains from me being at home is unique and beneficial to her. What your child gains and benefits from you working is unique to them, along with all the other values and life support you give them. It's just all different.

RidingMyBike · 10/03/2023 17:36

Amusingly, one of the reasons I was determined never to be a SAHM was because my own mum was one and I really wish we'd been put in childcare instead!

Botw1 · 10/03/2023 17:38

@Awumminnscotland

I don't disagree

None of that invalidates the research

Twizbe · 10/03/2023 17:39

Botw1 · 10/03/2023 17:31

@Twizbe

I certainly agree that not making yourself the default parent is the way to go

Much easier to do that if you're not a sahp.

Again, totally have not found that. But then we started with the equal division way before children were on the scene I never set myself up as the default adult in our home.

AlwaysLatte · 10/03/2023 17:42

I've been a SAHM since I was pregnant 15 years ago and I love being around to take them to school and collect them, and be around for all the school holidays and sickness days. I wouldn't change it unless I had to.

tiggergoesbounce · 10/03/2023 17:46

Thepeopleversuswork · 10/03/2023 16:51

Well, the Harvard research seems pretty definitive and its based on a pretty big sample. From the report:

"what this research says to us is that not only are you helping your family economically—and helping yourself professionally and emotionally if you have a job you love—but you're also helping your kids. So I think for both mothers and for fathers, working both inside and outside the home gives your kids a signal that contributions at home and at work are equally valuable, for both men and women. In short, it's good for your kids."

It can work either way though. My mum was a SAHM and hated it. She loved us but was bored, frustrated and financially trapped and was endlessly trying to relaunch her career and stumbling because she had been out of the workforce too long. If anything having a mother who hated at being at home made me even more determined that it wasn't going to happen to me.

In developed countries, employed women in two-parent households report that they spend an average of 17.7 hours per week caring for family members, while employed men report devoting about 9, according to the researchers. At the same time, women report spending an average of 17.8 hours per week on housework, while men report an average of 8.8 hours

It is showing that women are still doing more of the caring, women are still doing more of the housework whilst still working full time - im not sure this is a great thing to aspire to.

"It didn't matter to us if she worked for a few months one year, or worked 60 hours per week during your whole childhood," McGinn says. "We weren't interested in whether your mom was an intense professional, but rather whether you had a role model who showed you that women work both inside and outside the home. We wanted to see how that played out."

This is ridiculous, so their research classed a working mum the same as if it was a 12hr a day mother or a mum who worked a few months one year since a child was born until they were 14 years old and expect that to have the same influence. (I.e non)

Did it matter if it was a paid role?
It appears job role and salary did not matter either, so could they volunteer a few months one year and it have the same effect?

Survey respondents included 13,326 women and 18,152 men from 24 developed nations. The researchers based their analyses on responses collected from the 2002 and 2012 surveys

Not exactly a vast amount of respondents over 24 developed nations that was conducted up to 20 years ago.

Anyhow, people can always find "research" to hekp their side of an argument, it happens all the time on these silly WOHP vs SAHP threads.

Just do what's best for yourself and your own families, dont listen to others' judgments and of possible do what makes you happy. Thats what makes the best parents.

Botw1 · 10/03/2023 17:46

@Twizbe

You can't see how being a sahp sets you up as the default parent /pcg?

A lot, if not most, of these comments are saying that's exactly why women do it.

Twizbe · 10/03/2023 17:54

I suppose it depends what you mean by default parent.

I could walk out tomorrow and my DH be able to literally pick up where I left off.

The kids go to us equally (and strategically depending on what they want lol)

Me staying home was an economic decision (with a large chunk of covid chucked in) I don't think it's better or worse for the kids for me to work or not.

Botw1 · 10/03/2023 17:56

@Twizbe

Primary care giver.

The main parent. The parent doing the most of the parenting.

If you're not doing that as a sahp, then what are you doing lol.

MajorCarolDanvers · 10/03/2023 18:09

Both me and DH went part time for a few years.

I wouldn't have enjoyed being a full time SAHP. Would have driven me crazy.

shivbo2014 · 10/03/2023 18:21

I've been a stay at home mum with my second child and have absolutely loved it, he's starting reception in September and I'll go back to work. I am studying for a new career, will only work part time for now though.

KievsOutTheOven · 10/03/2023 18:30

tiggergoesbounce · 10/03/2023 17:46

In developed countries, employed women in two-parent households report that they spend an average of 17.7 hours per week caring for family members, while employed men report devoting about 9, according to the researchers. At the same time, women report spending an average of 17.8 hours per week on housework, while men report an average of 8.8 hours

It is showing that women are still doing more of the caring, women are still doing more of the housework whilst still working full time - im not sure this is a great thing to aspire to.

"It didn't matter to us if she worked for a few months one year, or worked 60 hours per week during your whole childhood," McGinn says. "We weren't interested in whether your mom was an intense professional, but rather whether you had a role model who showed you that women work both inside and outside the home. We wanted to see how that played out."

This is ridiculous, so their research classed a working mum the same as if it was a 12hr a day mother or a mum who worked a few months one year since a child was born until they were 14 years old and expect that to have the same influence. (I.e non)

Did it matter if it was a paid role?
It appears job role and salary did not matter either, so could they volunteer a few months one year and it have the same effect?

Survey respondents included 13,326 women and 18,152 men from 24 developed nations. The researchers based their analyses on responses collected from the 2002 and 2012 surveys

Not exactly a vast amount of respondents over 24 developed nations that was conducted up to 20 years ago.

Anyhow, people can always find "research" to hekp their side of an argument, it happens all the time on these silly WOHP vs SAHP threads.

Just do what's best for yourself and your own families, dont listen to others' judgments and of possible do what makes you happy. Thats what makes the best parents.

There is a massive difference though - I cited a peer reviewed study carried out by a well recognised education institution, and they cited a mummy blogger.

And I was only doing it to disprove her crock of shit claims, I don’t actually care what anyone else does, but I do care about judgemental people who share blog posts as “research” to try to put others down.

MrsToothyBitch · 10/03/2023 18:31

If we had the cash I'd be a sahm in a heartbeat! I love being at home and actually suffer from (diagnosed) anxiety which is always work related/triggered by work so I'd be a lot happier and healthier physically and mentally.

In reality though I think I'd probably try and work as part time as possible around DC so I didn't have a gap in case I needed to go back.

musos · 10/03/2023 18:34

Yes being a SAHM has been the greatest privilege in my life. I couldn't have imagined it any other way. It's paid off - financially, emotionally, physically for everyone over 15 years.

KievsOutTheOven · 10/03/2023 18:37

Awumminnscotland · 10/03/2023 16:18

My mum was a working mum. I am not. We are different people living different lives, making our own choices. She brought me up well, I learned from her, and I will do the same for my daughter, just differently. My daughter will then make her own choices. It's nothing to do with how we are ' bred'.

No, it’s nothing to do with “breeding” - it’s all to do with the aspirations and environment that you are brought up in; as was discussed previously on the post. Everyone should do what works for them; but to claim that sending your children to “daycare” is damaging is not true. I was simply refuting that claim, because there are tangible benefits (beyond finances) to your children of their mother working rather than being a SAHP.

Obviously it isn’t universal and it’s nothing to do with their actual “breeding” - rather it’s to do with what the family values growing up. Ans there is no right or wrong answer, unlike the poster I was replying to who stated that working mothers are somehow damaging their children (but fathers are perfectly okay with staying in the workforce, presumably - you only have to give up your career if you have a vagina)

Rosebel · 10/03/2023 18:47

I wasa SAHM with my eldest two until youngest DD was 6. If I could be a SAHM again with my DS I would.

Mutabiliss · 10/03/2023 18:48

I would hate to be a SAHM. I'd hate to be the one entirely responsible for all the housework (which is what would happen). I found maternity leave very dull and honestly didn't particularly enjoy ages 1-3.5 - it's bloody hard work. SAHM to a 4 year old would be ok I guess, but I would much rather work and have what I have now - one day with him and two weekend days as a family.

If I had the money to be a SAHM I would rather work and outsource all the boring bits of life - so a very regular cleaner, meal delivery services most days, personal trainer, personal shopper. That would leave me time and space to do what I actually want to spend my time doing outside of family time - gardening, reading, travelling, maybe studying.

OheeOheeOh · 10/03/2023 19:04

AlwaysLatte · 10/03/2023 17:42

I've been a SAHM since I was pregnant 15 years ago and I love being around to take them to school and collect them, and be around for all the school holidays and sickness days. I wouldn't change it unless I had to.

Do you really think you are a sahm if your kids are in high school? Will you still be a sahm when they are at uni 🤣?

Honoraryuce · 10/03/2023 19:05

I would have said definitely yes but after a few years of part time I did start to appreciate the time and space from my kids a couple of days a week. Being at work is a breeze in comparison so it's like a day off even though it's a fairly high level of responsibility job.

Honoraryuce · 10/03/2023 19:06

If I'd had to use nursery or childminder instead of family though I'd probably choose SAHP.

IAmTheWalrus85 · 10/03/2023 19:36

I’m not really sure what or why you’re asking OP. I’m guessing you’re asking because you think it’ll show all women want to be SAHMs really. But even if the answers on the thread had been a resounding yes (they haven’t) it doesn’t really establish that.