To think our govt is capable of rigging an election

[Waypastshitcreek]

With everything in the news about what they pulled with and during covid, them acting as a bunch of Eton bully boys above the rules (let's face it they probably got up to all sorts at Eton to)...we litterally can't trust them any more surely ... surely they're capable of anything deceitful now...

What really scares me us that if there was a genuine pandemic like Ebola or anything deadly the public would be like yeah right, F Off, see you down the pub in half an hour!

Surely not. This is the kindest, most honest, loveliest government we have ever been blessed with, not a dishonest, conniving bone in any of their bodies....of course they wouldn't rig an election or any other vote for personal gain.... Actually looking at how many people still seem to support them despite the fact they're venal cunning bastards in some areas they wouldn't even need to rig the vote....

Voter ID is an attempt to alter the vote. The types of ID that are acceptable discriminate against younger people, and favour those more likely to vote Tory

Do they though? I get the point if someone's a non-driver, has no passport and isn't disabled, but then there's always the Voter Authority Certificate.
Admittedly not everyone may have heard of this, but then if they're sufficiently bothered about being "discriminated against" I'd kind of expect they'd look into it

They won't get the counts to be rigged - people who are responsible for these and who oversee them are not going to allow the many safeguards to be ignored. The whole process is designed to prevent this.
But they are stopping people less likely to vote for them from voting with voter ID. And have rigged the voluntary changes in their favour. They will ensure they stay in power this way.

Absolutely. Tories are gangsters with posh accents.

I'm more worried that labour will lose and try to steal the election by claiming there is election fraud.

It is very well monitored I assure you, police, and independent adjudicates, and not only that, but representatives of every party watch every single person counting votes.

I’m convinced it was rigged. There’s a load of people I know who agree. Groups on fb such as www.facebook.com/groups/DemocracyNotDeMOCKracy/?ref=share which had a LOT of info immediately after the 2019 election.

the bbc is corrupt, a mouthpiece for the tories. As is the guardian. All the weaponisation of the anti semitism in the LP was just that, but the guardian joined in, as did the bbc, in blaming corbyn.
I don’t know anyone in real life who voted Tory. And I know a lot of people.

I just don’t believe the lying cheating Johnson beat a man whose constituents adore him, who has been championing human rights, working rights, equality etc for his whole life.

something seriously dodgy went on.

Here's part of the list of acceptable forms of ID:

• Older Person’s Bus Pass funded by the Government of the United Kingdom
• Disabled Person’s Bus Pass funded by the Government of the United Kingdom
• Oyster 60+ Card funded by the Government of the United Kingdom

The full list is here - www.electoralcommission.org.uk/i-am-a/voter/voter-id/accepted-forms-photo-id But you'll notice that bus passes for younger people are not accepted. In fact, despite a lot of work by a lot of people to try to ensure all types of photo ID are accepted, the ones finally put into legislation all favour older people. Many people don't worry too much about the election until the final week before poll - by which time it is too late to get a Voter Authority Certificate. Yes, lots of people vote by post, and lots of people know about an election and get engaged early - but a huge number do not. I know, because we get the phone calls in that final week asking questions about voting, polling stations, options, locations that could have been answered much sooner. This May is a dummy run - local elections where most people who want to vote will already have ID. But soon we have the next General Election, and voter ID (or lack of it) will have a much bigger impact.

Please link me to some reliable evidence that vulnerable people in Northern Ireland have not been affected negatively by Voter ID.

Because I am reading in multiple sources that potentially 25,000 people, or 3.5% of the electorate, were deterred from voting in 2003, when voter ID was introduced in Northern Ireland.

Voter ID is not a good thing if you want to encourage vulnerable people to vote and enable them to have their say in elections.

If you don't care about that, then of course you can spout your nonsense about it. There is no reason at all to justify introducing it when confidence in UK elections is among the highest in the world, and fraud among the lowest. Other than, of course, more votes for our horrendous, bigoted, lying Tory government.

Personally I don't find some social media credible and am reminded of what Cambridge Analytica made possible. There's no proof though. It was reported that uk government staff were sent over to meet Trump's Bannon in the US in the past-wasn't that 2019?

It's not THAT free - you need a photo id - that might have to be digital which means you either get it from Snappy Snaps (about a tenner) or have to scan it. You need your NI number to hand. Bank statement or utilities bill. Put bluntly, it deprives the homeless of a vote, doesn't it. But the homeless aren't going to vote Conservative, so that's okay.

Probably denies the elderly in care homes a vote - the very ones who have suffered under recent Tory adult social care policies.

Denies the busy a vote - it's just that bit of hassle isn't it compared to last time where you just show up with your address. Admittedly, not sure how the homeless got past that last time. Maybe this new ID does allow folk without an address to vote?

Sorry, but it IS that free.

You can download apps for passport photos, you know. Use that and upload it. Ditto scanning apps.

The homeless can also apply for free voter ID.

homeless.org.uk/news/how-we-vote-is-changing/

So, the homeless aren't deprived of a vote. 🤦‍♂️

The busy? Pretty sure they'll already have at least one accepted form of ID, e.g. driving licence. I carry mine around wherever I go, sure.

None of us know if we have been disenfranchised until we present our papers and see if they are accepted.

In some senses, boundary changes and voter ID is a type of election rigging (apologies as I assume that this has probably been mentioned many times in this thread). The Tories will have no compunction about manipulating the odds as much as they can, even if it's to mitigate a heavy loss at the next election.

The combination of gerrymandering constituencies, moving some MPs to safe seats and Voter ID is designed to stop a Tory wipeout next election.

The rule that photo ID cannot be accepted unless it is a good likeness and also telling us that expired photo ID can be accepted will inevitably result in some people being denied a vote.

The rule that photo ID cannot be accepted and allowing 18 year olds to use their childhood passport but not their current travel card will lead to people being denied a vote.

And they know it.

But if they didn't say people could use expired photo ID or childhood passports then they would have to admit to disenfranchising 5 million people.

Sorry, It should read Photo I'd Cannot be accepted unless it is a good likeness

We need as many posts like this as possible and for it to be out there as much as possible. The Tories will rely on their usual vote and then apathy amongst the greater populace. Hopefully people will be motivated not to let them get away with 14 years of awful government.

So if Labour win it’s not rigged but if Tories win it is.
I think labour need to get some policies out there if they want to win. Apparently they are going to get rid of the people traffickers- oh, yeah , that’s easy without sending sas or undercover inertia into other countries to ‘deal’ with them

This is simply not true.

For example, driving licences and passports already have rules around what constitutes acceptable photo as well as likeness.

For those who require a VAC, download apps that enable you to take passport photos and upload. You can even get these checked before proceeding as it'll confirm whether the photo is fine.

@DownNative

Really?

Nobody ever changed appearance significantly since a photo was taken?

It's more likely in the case of a childhood passport or expired photo ID.

But could happen to any of us.

Denies the busy a vote - it's just that bit of hassle isn't it compared to last time where you just show up with your address.

Busy people have another option, postal voting.
No need to have your photo on you, no need to have photo ID anyway, and more relevant when a ‘busy person’, no need to be in the right place at the right time.

Register for a postal vote, receive a form then post it back.
If you don’t get around to filling in the form and sending it back then you still have the option on the day to turn up in person

I have not voted in person for decades

On rigging an election - no.
The government are not capable of rigging an election

But exactly as had been shown by Trump, it’s easy to remove confidence in an election
He had a clear plan:

If the results were that he won, then hooray he won
If predictions were that he was winning, then claim victory
(If you get lucky the opposition concedes before the final count)
When there are sudden surges (because multiple areas count results come in) if that goes against you then say that it’s proof of rigging

Make claims about various fraud methods
Call official ballot boxes getting opened mysterious boxes/cases that have appeared from nowhere
etc

Then just keep repeating claims after they have been proven false

Feeding doubt of fraud is more powerful than fraud

Placing these doubts in people also stops participation - if my vote doesn’t count then I won’t vote
Which can be successful if you discourage opposition voters and backfire if you discourage your voters

Local elections can be easier to target doubt - pick the right narrative to discourage opposition voting
National election narratives can more easily backfire, as all different types of voter sees your disencouragement

Corrupt and self serving - exactly.
We no longer live in a democracy. The media is used as thought control and distraction. Don't vote it only encourages them.

If you don’t vote then you have zero engagement

If you don’t vote then don’t complain about what you get

I’ve been reflecting on this recently.

There is such a thing as a competent pragmatic Tory but the current government are not full of them, and that’s the problem.

Conservatives who do not like the current government need to highlight the issue to their local parties and Tory MPs.

This government are inexperienced, they are ideologically driven and haven’t had enough time in the real world doing proper jobs (I don’t count investment banking I’m afraid) so that they can learn a bit of pragmatism. And it shows in their way of running things into the ground.

Making a noise is really important.

Keep writing to your MP. Keep checking your facts and sources. And for the love of god, keep voting. Join a political party - even the Tories if you would normally vote Tory - and make your voice heard.