4 day working week … for schools.

[AutumnIsHere21]

Inspired by another thread discussing the merits of a three day weekend and following on from the results of a study which concluded that a four day working week (for full time pay) had numerous benefits for employers and employees.

I just wondered how people would feel if schools followed suit and were only open Monday-Thursday.

Full disclosure: I’m a teacher so - obviously - would be very much in favour! 😆

I would like it. I hate that they only have 2 full days off. We don’t rely on school for childcare- we work opposites so one of us is always here for the kids.

Yes, I roll in 830, do fuck all all day, then skip home at 330, to waft about my mansion, paid for by my obscene wages.
The marking elves take care of marking. The planning fairies sort my lessons. The discipline dwarves phone home for me and the meeting trolls attend meetings. I'd like some data gnomes to do my analysis, but they're always busy holding fishing rods or pushing wheelbarrows.

The curriculum would have to be overhauled - but god knows it needs overhauling.

I can't see how this would work unless a) all employers allowed 4 day working weeks and b) school holidays were shorter to allow the 'lost' time to be made up. (My daughter's school are already worrying about how they are going to finish the biology A level syllabus in time - Covid disruption and now strikes are really not helping!)

Only if school holidays were shorter so there wasn’t lost teaching time. I wouldn’t want a longer school day so shorter holidays is the only way it could work.

Will happen by default if schools can’t start recruiting and retaining teachers.

@Parker231

Doesn't seem to be a problem where I am, so I doubt it

If you had loads of kids milling about on a Friday I bet all the 4 day weekers would go back to work 5 days a week, or take a different day off.

I'm in primary and no thank you! They are tired enough as it is without trying to cram everything into four days. I do however wish we could do 7.30 until 2 or something similar. Kids are always up at the crack of dawn iand 4 year olds have had enough by lunch.

"only" 2 days as well as 13 weeks holiday and all the INSET days and bank holidays...

I don't think they do too badly.

My DC are at school in France and have no school on Wednesday afternoons. Some primary schools have no school at all on Wednesday but the parents at our village school have voted to keep 4.5 days.

If parents are working children can go to Centre de Loisirs on a Wednesday afternoon - this is like a holiday club for the kids with activities. Sometimes the Centre de Loisirs is in the school but the one for my village is elsewhere (operating for several villages) and there is a special bus that takes the children there so you don't have to collect your DC and take them there yourself at lunchtime. The Centre de Loisirs is also available for the school holidays and is not expensive.

We use a child minder for Wednesday afternoon. Many extra-curricular activities are run on Wednesday afternoon. And for parents who work part time, Wednesday seems to be the most popular day not to work.

The tail seems to be wagging the dog amongst all the posters saying there wouldn't be time for the curriculum or the exam syllabus in 4 days. They can be altered to suit the available time.

Many secondary schools in Scotland currently have this. It works well.

I'd be in favour of reducing the curriculum back to a well-rounded education and not the bloated, ever increasing blob of social stuff that is expected to be delivered, and then have a 5 day school week with 1-1.5 days for enrichment /sport/music/ drama/outdoor education delivered by appropriately qualified and experienced instructors. Teachers would still work 5 days, but would have more PPA time to reduce the amount of work that takes an unreasonable amount of time outside a standard working day.

(Teacher here and think that if it the job can't be done between 8.30/9-5/5.30 in a typical week then the workload is unreasonable for people contracted to work 32.5 hours, as more than a 40-45h working week goes beyond what's considered 'reasonable' additional hours to complete the job)

I’d love it! Ds3’s school have a half day on a Friday (8.40 - 12.20). The other days start earlier, finish later and lunch break is shorter to make up the hours. I feel like the weekend starts on Friday lunchtime. I’d love it to start on Thursday night. I can, however, see how difficult this would be for parents of young children who work on a Friday.

This link outlines the study that inspired my original post: amp.theguardian.com/money/2023/feb/21/four-day-week-uk-trial-success-pattern

When reading it, I couldn’t help thinking that I’m sure many of the positive benefits of the four day week for parents were enhanced by one of the days being child free due to schools being open five days, allowing the extra day to be spent more freely.

My enthusiasm for the ideas of schools being open four days (or teachers being allowed the same benefits - four days for full time pay) were purely selfish! I, too, would like more time with my family; I’d like more time to rest and exercise and I also think I’d be more productive. I was not thinking what was best for children as - just sometimes - I like to whimsically think about what’s best for me! 😆

Obviously, there are many other professions where this utopian four day working week would not be possible either, I realise this.

I think I’d prefer a 4 day week and a shorter summer holiday. I’m a teacher and can’t see how we would fit the curriculum in otherwise. Specialist teachers on a Friday sounds lovely but there is no money. Longer days wouldn’t work- the kids have had enough by 3pm as it is.

Haha you crazy cat OP, thinking of your own wellbeing 😆. I do think my wellbeing would be worse though, all the lovely things that bring me joy at work would ultimately go, no more art or music or forest school, still a no from me in primary 😀

Doesn't a 4 day work just mean more staff to cover the 5 days but each working a max of 4, that was my assumption

4 day school week with normal opening hours and less weeks holiday in the summer and I'm behind it

Briallen
But if the changes mean that conditions are better than fewer staff would be off. If schools weren't having massive supply bills to agencies who charge hundreds to send a cover supervisor that they're paying £65 a day, then there could be money.
With decent conditions and workload we might get back to the sort of departments I did my NQT year in, where there was a mix of ages, mix of life experiences, mix of full and part time staff, staff with young children who were part time, staff who wanted to slow down towards retirement.

It would probably make for a more dynamic and flexible workforce too as quite a few people could teach a second subject, timetabling could be a bit easier. With longer serving and more stable staffing, behaviour might be better, which reduces workload.

I'm being optimistic to the point of naivety but it really could work, if there was political will.

A school locally to me is moving to a 4 day week for staff. Pupils will still attend for 5 days. I guess it means more job shares etc.

YABU

If you had shorter school holidays it would mean for the few weeks left, holiday prices would be even higher, especially in the summer. Employers have enough difficulty managing to plan holidays with those with families almost all wanting time off in six weeks summer holiday time, imagine if it were only five or four. (Those employers who plan that is, not people such as the Borders Agency who seemingly cannot, at least at Heathrow).

Even if four day weeks do become more widespread, it will only end up being a minority of jobs that are Monday-Thursday only.

Regardless of any educational merits, impractical.

It's just Lothian & Borders. But, yes, has been a thing forever.
Teachers still work on the Friday afternoon though.