Nightclub took DDs epipens

[anaphyl4xis]

My DD - 18 and a 1st year uni student - went to a nightclub last night and they refused to let her keep her epipens on her. They said if she needed them
She had to go to the medical room.

She was with a group of friends and had all paid to get in and the venue also refused to refund if they decided not to go in.

AIBU to be absolutely livid and to follow this up with the company.

For context my daughter has a life threatening allergy to nuts - but not peanuts.

your DD needs to check if they have warnings about this before the point they had to pay. then she needs to take it up with the nightclub - in particular she needs to ask them what their process is for someone who suddenly needs the epi pen, she should ask to see their risk assessment documentation.

And als warn the uni to tell other students that this may happen if they go to this particular nightclub.

Which victims have reported this? The reports I've seen, including those linked on this page, are of people suddenly feeling ill without being aware of being injected at all. It tends to be only later that needle marks are found.

But no proof they were EpiPen injections.

I think some posters are missing the point by saying that the epipens need to be used forcefully and held down for a long time etc.

The spikers aren’t actually using epipens.

The drug inside is different and probably the needle but the outer casing just looks like an epipen.
So it is disguised as an epipen and a bouncer probably wouldn’t be able to tell the difference.

I would hope that you can get some sort of proof so you can keep it on you.

I get it that the nightclub may have misguidedly thought this was a way to guard against people being spiked. But the point is that they are making money out of creating an environment where spiking incidents happen; therefore it's up to them to find a safe way to deal with the risk without putting the lives of people like OP's daughter at risk.

But no proof they were EpiPen injections.

They won’t be actual epipens as they won’t have the desired effect for a rapist.
They would just look like them.

Again can you back up that they are using something looking like epipens? I can't see a single link here that shows that to be the case

Well yes. Those of us who have used Epipens know the effects of Adrenaline. We know that people are saying they were modified or refilled with something else. The point is there's no proof at all that they are using EpiPen like devices or injections disguised as Epipens.

And is there any proof at all of this? Has anyone actually seen a doctored epipen or seen one being used in this way?

No.

People are saying it could have been an epipen like device because they mistakenly believe an epipen is administered in a single jab so would be quicker than holding down a plunger on a syringe.

No it isn't. You've never actually used an epipen have you? You can't just subtly epipen someone and it doesn't just take a second either.

It doesn't matter what age she is, the nightclub needs to be informed about the importance of keeping this injection on her at all times and I do agree that you should contact them .

At 18 we think we know it all, unfortunately this is not true and for everyone's safety it's going to be up to you to point this out to the club. They may be able to adjust their procedures as they may be unaware of the importance.

I would email and be factual and to the point. I would inform them that they are putting peoples lives at risk. I would also point out the timing to get to the pen, who gets it? Will it be given to one of the friends? as they are not the person it's prescribed for. Will they have other injections held in their medical place and is the person handing out the injections trained and knows which ones to hand over. What happens if they have a few different injections. This is all using up time, something vital and can not be wasted.

A school should not be keeping the epipen in a medical room. The epipen should always be with the child. I have one in my classroom for a child and it goes with us outside. In high school the children are supposed to be able to carry it with them! This information came directly from the NHS training we do yearly at school. Time is imperative in anaphylaxis!

Again can you back up that they are using something looking like epipens? I can't see a single link here that shows that to be the case

On the links I’ve shared most of the victims believe it was an epipen.

I doubt they would lie about it when it is something quite common as drinking spiking is becoming less common.

Again, it won’t be an actual epipen though.

But if your nightclub has had several instances of women being potentially raped and potentially injected with a drug - what are you supposed to do.

I can see why they are trying their best to protect women and have a dedicated first aid room but it’s not necessarily the best option.

Agree with above - and surely in a nightclub with the lights and noise and packed with people the chances of making someone aware that the pen is needed is going to take even longer than in a daytime situation. Surely that is the point of carrying epipens as the timing is imperative.

But why do they believe it is an epipen?

Likely because they mistakenly believe be an epipen is a quick jab and done. When in reality it's nothing like that.

Have any of them actually seen an epipen being sued to spike them?

People 'believing' it to be an EpiPen is just based on the kind of misconceptions on display on this thread. That it's a quick and easy and less painful way to inject someone. Which it's not by a LONG shot.

There's absolutely no evidence that removing EpiPens from nightclubs would make any difference whatsoever.

They're also very bulky. It's much, much easier to conceal a small, regular syringe.

We can't allow a few people's 'belief' based on no evidence whatsoever to affect the lives of those who legitimately need them.

But why do they believe it is an epipen?

People 'believing' it to be an EpiPen is just based on the kind of misconceptions on display on this thread. That it's a quick and easy and less painful way to inject someone. Which it's not by a LONG shot.

They will not be epipens.

No one thinks they are real epipens because that won’t have the desired effect.

There's absolutely no evidence that removing EpiPens from nightclubs would make any difference whatsoever

They're also very bulky. It's much, much easier to conceal a small, regular syringe

plus my understanding is that it’s generally men doing the spiking and they certainly aren’t having their handbags searched

Also my DCs anaphylaxis doesn't present in a classic swelling up like a balloon film representation.

It's very subtle so if they collapse and they don't have an epipen on them some might not recognise it as anaphylaxis.

You're deliberately misinterpreting us. We know no one is suggesting it's Epipens filled with adrenaline.

Let's substitute 'autoinjectors' for the brand name Epipen. People here, including you, are arguing that some.kind.of autoinjector or something that LOOKS like an autoinjector is being used. But there's no proof for that beyond people believing they're quick and easy and therefore it must have been an autoinjector. But they're not, and can't be proven they were used. Therefore no reason to prevent people carrying adrenaline autoinjectors

Again what makes them think it was disguised as an epipen?

I haven’t read all the responses but this happened to me about 15 years ago. I ended up going home as I realise that if I had to wait for someone sober to go and find my EpiPens then I could be waiting too long. I complained to the nightclub parent company and got an apology and some compensation. I really thought they would have loved on from this bullshit by now.

And why would they bother disguising it as an epipen? Why not disguise it as a vape which won't draw any attention if they are searched?

No. People believe it's a doctored epipen because of their mistaken belief about it being a quick jab and done.

I would approach it (or get your daughter to approach it) as a 'what can we all do to ensure this doesn't happen again' first of all.

It could be that they'd be happy with a doctor's letter stating that she must have the item on her person at all times. They should be but who knows.

What's not acceptable is her handing them over. If the medical person, or whoever has the keys to the room, is elsewhere (looking after someone who's passed out or being sick or whatever) your DD is in danger. That's the point of an epi pen - immediate use as soon as the person starts feeling 'wrong'.

My boss has an epi pen. It's in her bag and is ready for use. She's shown us where she keeps and what to do if she needs it. She has a nut allergy. It'd be no use if it were in a room away from her.

So I'd start with the 'how can we work together to keep her safe' stance and ask them to ensure, if they say they will accept a doctor's letter, that EVERYONE working at the nightclub knows this.

There have been spates of people using syringes (not epi pens) to either freak people out by 'stabbing them' (debatable as to whether they're actually old enough to go clubbing if that's their idea of fun...) or actually injecting drinks or people. Whilst epi pens don't work the same, a blanket ban saves someone at the door having to make a decision. A doctor's note may be all that's needed to confirm the pen is what it is and why it's needed.

Why should they have to spend money and wasting doctored time to get a medical note?!?!

No.

There's no evidence that epipens or devices disguised as epipens are in any way being used to spike people.