Page 2 | To think it's weird to allow babies in arms in cabs

anonacfr · 2023-02-21T12:50:21+00:00

Typical celeb clickbait article this morning online. Chloe Madeley apparently got abuse for posting a picture of her, her partner and their young baby in a black cab. They're both wearing a seatbelt but he's holding the baby- no baby carrier or restraints. She was lashing out at people criticising her by telling them it is a perfectly legal thing to do. Isn't that mega dangerous though? Looking back we always brought our carriers in cabs, or at least (in black cabs) strapped the babies in their buggy and secured said buggy so it couldn't really move. In these days of health and safety I am just surprised. Am I a hindsight PFB?

AGoldenNarwhal · 21/02/2023 13:41

Ithinkimthebfg · 21/02/2023 13:34

And Lap baby on planes is the dangerous one and should be banned. Any turbulence and thr kid is hitting the roof.

hopping a black cab in London and your massive fucking husband holding her is as low risk as it gets.

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I agree. Lap babies on planes should be banned. Airlines should be required to provide backward facing car seats for infants as part of the ticket price or parents can bring their own.

When we travelled by plane when DC1 was a baby, we took our car seat and paid for a seat for it. We then got into a massive fucking row with the flight attendant, who was insisting that we secure the car seat forward-facing. She gave in eventually but much more education is needed on this issue.

On the cabs issue, I can't get too upset. Life is an exercise in balancing risks, which we do in different ways. Co-sleeping is risky so I don't do it, but go figure I almost fell down the stairs carrying my baby this morning because I'm so sleep-deprived atm. Yes, it's riskier having an unsecured baby in a black cab, but black cabs don't tend to be involved in accidents at high speed so probably much less risky than having an unsecured baby in a normal car and with much better reason for it. You can't lug around a car seat all day and babies aren't intended to be in car seats as part of a travel system for more than a couple of hours.

Ponoka7 · 21/02/2023 13:44

BreviloquentBastard · 21/02/2023 13:00

I think it is legal, but I would never. My brother is a paramedic and he had to take a year off after being first response to a high speed accident where someone had been holding an infant.

He's never gone into graphic detail, but the infant was killed and became a projectile also injuring the mother. Just the mental image of what he probably saw that day turns my blood to ice.

The clue is in high speed. I live in a low income area, a lot of people don't have cars and get taxis. I have with my GC. The risk isn't there to warrant a change in law. It would be more detramental to a child's wellbeing to not be able to go outside the area they live in, because of not needed travel rules. I don't know and haven't met people who have the anxiety issues around this, and other things that you read on here.

Whentwobecomesthree · 21/02/2023 13:45

A lap baby on a plane has its own seatbelt. They aren't just free to fly through the air. Is keeping a baby in a car seat for 14 hours on a plane any better?

Chickenly · 21/02/2023 13:46

James Haskell is truly amazing. Not only is he an international rugby player, a performer, an author and a gentleman - as well as a solid friend, husband, father and wonderful person by many accounts - he’s also magically able to completely evade the criticism that Chloe has thrown at her for their joint parenting decisions.

OP, any reason (beyond sexism) why you think she’s responsible rather than him?

Whilst I don’t think either of them have done anything at all wrong, why are you only aiming your vitriol at her?

Ponoka7 · 21/02/2023 13:47

Surely people aren't serious on the airplane one? It might be an issue? If you are traveling around the US, but people shouldn't have to be so restricted on a flight across Europe. The accident statistics just aren't there.

TaskmasterAssistant · 21/02/2023 13:49

OP, having a baby in a sling and then a seatbelt around you both is incredibly dangerous. Your weight crushes the baby in the event of a crash. I wouldn't want to risk that even at low speeds.

TruffleShuffles · 21/02/2023 13:49

AGoldenNarwhal · 21/02/2023 13:41

I agree. Lap babies on planes should be banned. Airlines should be required to provide backward facing car seats for infants as part of the ticket price or parents can bring their own.

When we travelled by plane when DC1 was a baby, we took our car seat and paid for a seat for it. We then got into a massive fucking row with the flight attendant, who was insisting that we secure the car seat forward-facing. She gave in eventually but much more education is needed on this issue.

On the cabs issue, I can't get too upset. Life is an exercise in balancing risks, which we do in different ways. Co-sleeping is risky so I don't do it, but go figure I almost fell down the stairs carrying my baby this morning because I'm so sleep-deprived atm. Yes, it's riskier having an unsecured baby in a black cab, but black cabs don't tend to be involved in accidents at high speed so probably much less risky than having an unsecured baby in a normal car and with much better reason for it. You can't lug around a car seat all day and babies aren't intended to be in car seats as part of a travel system for more than a couple of hours.

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Why does the car seat near to be rear facing on a plane? Genuine question.

ChildminderMum · 21/02/2023 13:49

Legal
Not very safe
Totally her own business

AGoldenNarwhal · 21/02/2023 13:50

And what would you do if you had more than one small child? Drag 3 car seats around all day?

That said, we all have our limits and mine is that I won't take children unsecured in buses/taxis on roads with a speed above 30mph. Since most of the area where we live is 20mph, that's not a problem. We save motorways and longer trips for the weekend when my OH is home (he has the car for work during the week).

MrNook · 21/02/2023 13:50

A baby that small can go in one of those travel system car seats with handles so no idea why you wouldn't do that!

AGoldenNarwhal · 21/02/2023 13:52

TruffleShuffles · 21/02/2023 13:49

Why does the car seat near to be rear facing on a plane? Genuine question.

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For the same reason that car seats are rear-facing in cars and adults adopt the brace position in crash landings - it significantly reduces the likelihood of head and neck injuries, which are often catastrophic for small children.

TruffleShuffles · 21/02/2023 13:53

MrNook · 21/02/2023 13:50

A baby that small can go in one of those travel system car seats with handles so no idea why you wouldn't do that!

But small babies can’t be in car seats for long so what do you do if you’re out all day and need the carrycot/seat part of the travel system?

AGoldenNarwhal · 21/02/2023 13:53

MrNook · 21/02/2023 13:50

A baby that small can go in one of those travel system car seats with handles so no idea why you wouldn't do that!

You are not meant to leave a baby in a car seat for more than a couple of hours. Newborns not more than 30 minutes.

MrNook · 21/02/2023 13:57

But small babies can’t be in car seats for long so what do you do if you’re out all day and need the carrycot/seat part of the travel system?

I had to do it a lot when DD was newborn, she'd be in the car seat for the taxi ride and then used the sling when walking around

Sugarfree23 · 21/02/2023 13:58

MrNook · 21/02/2023 13:50

A baby that small can go in one of those travel system car seats with handles so no idea why you wouldn't do that!

Because if your using the taxi for a 5min journey to get to a train station, for a 3hr train journey plus what ever your are doing at the other end its better to have the baby in the carrycot rather than in the carseat for the 3hrs.
You can't carry a infant carrier, luggage, change bag and push a pram at the same time.

Practicalities at the reason it's legal.

Original poster

anonacfr · 21/02/2023 14:01

Ithinkimthebfg · 21/02/2023 13:32

You can stand down, Chloe Madeley isn’t asking for your risk assessment.

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That's a bizarre answer- she does what she wants, I was commenting on her correct response that it was legal.

I hadn't realised and find it quite scary. Am I not allowed to have opinions- why is commenting on an article I saw on my twitter feed seen as disingenuous and an attack on a random celeb.

I didn't even realise she had a baby (or was in a relationship with Haskell for that matter) until I saw the article.

OP posts:

GloomyDarkness · 21/02/2023 14:01

Travel systems usually have car seat slip on top of a pushchair section.

You cant have babies in baby seat very long - which means of any kind of lengthy trip you left lugging a baby carrier round and a pushchair.

I think most parents risk assess - and frankly I don't want children and babies effectively banned from taxis because sometime they are the better option.

Twice we've had to get DS down to A&E with serious but not life threating condition and taxi was quickest way -second time he was immediate triaged and straight into surgery as it was a medical emergency but not life threatening - life changing I suppose.

Boomboom22 · 21/02/2023 14:02

Perfectly legal and not just in black cabs or under 30 zones.

If you think about it why would you own a car seat if you don't own a car? Low income families can't afford a travel system and are unlikely to be able to buy a car seat new, you are not allowed to buy or sell second hand car seats.

ParentsTrapped · 21/02/2023 14:04

Fullyhuman · 21/02/2023 12:56

It‘s legal. As is giving a lift to a parent with a babe in arms. Sometimes it will be the best available option, although yes, in the event of a collision there’s be a much greater chance of injury or death.

I haven’t double checked this but im pretty sure that it is legal for a child under to 3 to ride in a taxi without a seatbelt, it is not legal to do so in a private car. So you can’t give a lift to a parent (unless you are a licensed taxi driver).

Silvergreenblue · 21/02/2023 14:05

MrNook · 21/02/2023 13:57

But small babies can’t be in car seats for long so what do you do if you’re out all day and need the carrycot/seat part of the travel system?

I had to do it a lot when DD was newborn, she'd be in the car seat for the taxi ride and then used the sling when walking around

And what did you do with the car seat? Lug that around too? They're heavy!

GloomyDarkness · 21/02/2023 14:05

I had to do it a lot when DD was newborn, she'd be in the car seat for the taxi ride and then used the sling when walking around

That worked when we had two adults and one baby - didn't work when we had more kids or were down to one adult, case and baby even using a sling it was a bulky heavy item to lug around as well as everything else.

notimagain · 21/02/2023 14:09

Whentwobecomesthree · 21/02/2023 13:45

A lap baby on a plane has its own seatbelt. They aren't just free to fly through the air. Is keeping a baby in a car seat for 14 hours on a plane any better?

Agreed, US aside (I think, unless the rules have changed) a baby will have it's own seatbelt. - whether they are kept in it or not once the seats belt sign is out is another matter, but then again how many adults stay strapped in once the seatbelt signs are off?

AGoldenNarwhal · 21/02/2023 14:11

Car seats weigh a ton. I completely disbelieve anyone who claims both to have lugged one about all day and to have had a pleasant day out with their children.

Add a baby in a sling and I'd be bent double hobbling, and I'm fairly fit. Not to mention that this would then leave me unable to run after my older child and make sure he's safe.

When people post these things, I often wonder if they've actually tried them out.

Original poster

anonacfr · 21/02/2023 14:15

We used car seats in cabs when going away and then would use the car seat in rental/family cars for holidays.
Not an everyday occurrence.of course.

Rest of the time sling or buggy.

OP posts:

amispeakingintongues · 21/02/2023 14:16

OP it's legal out of necessity. Not because its a favourable option.

If you became stranded somewhere with no public transport, and with a baby in a sling, would you not find it scarier to walk home in darkness alone with a hungry distressed baby?

It's great you've never had to be in such a position but that does make you privileged.