That some small businesses are failing because they don’t adapt to the needs of their customers?

[Isawyou]

I try to shop local. Fortunately I do have some great independent places nearby.

What I am finding frustrating is for example the fruit and veg shop closes at 4.30pm. They start packing up at 3.45pm and it is really difficult to buy things from there where they are stacking all the stands with the produce inside. They also look unhappy at customers coming to buy at packing up time. It is easier to go to the Tesco express that stays open until midnight.

Other shops do not open until 10am and close early. So I can’t get there before work or after work.

They complain their businesses are not doing well and people do not shop local but they are not exactly facilitating it for the customers either.

Actually you did....

"It is never good just to rely on one source"

I said never just rely on one source yes.

Where I have said just rely on what people say and nothing else? Show me please.

It was a different era and different business landscape back then. For a start there were no huge chains of discounted grocery stores! If someone tried to do the same thing today, they'd not last long!

Same with Alan Sugar who made a killing selling "cheap" hi-fi units, CD radios and personal computers with the "pile it high, sell cheap" philosophy. All that happened is that other manufacturers jumped on the bandwagon, manufactured their own "cheap" copycat versions with their brand name on and pushed him out of the market!

Kwik Save supermarket chain also did the "pile it high, sell it cheap" on branded groceries, i.e. Heinz, Kelloggs, etc., but the likes of Tesco, Asda, etc., just started selling the same items cheaper, pushing Kwik Save out of business.

It's just a race to the bottom now and the pile it high, sell it cheap philosophy just doesn't work anymore.

A posh tea shop in York that went viral over this. A customer whinging she was charged the price of a cup of tea when she ‘just wanted a cup of hot water’ (plus lemon) and the cafe owner explaining why for a cup of tea, the tea bag and milk were the least of the costs.

www.finedininglovers.com/article/restaurant-owners-fun-response-reviewer-who-complained-about-price-hot-water

Awesome!

Don’t get me wrong, I am definitely eating out less these days due to cost and the fact I can do many of the cheese toastie style meals cheaper at home but I don’t feel ripped off if I do eat out and the cafe charges me more for the full meal than Aldi would for the ingredients.

I rarely get out to eat but I had lunch with a friend. £8 for a very very average panini, plus a drink.
Not a tourist place but in a depressed NE town.
It actually puts me off going out even when I have the opportunity because I know what I could buy for £8.

A sandwich and a drink to eat in for under £10? I think you should eat at home.

We had prople coming in asking for hot water than putting their won tea in. Fine, yeah you like your tea, but 90% got pissy about us charging the hot water. Like am I heating it up and then washing cups for free with my mind or what?

Good on these!

How selfish of people to want stuff to be affordable and readily available. And how evil of successful (often large) businesses to provide it.

We are lucky to have some virtuous among us who don’t care about this so called ‘instant gratification’. Presumably those virtuous ones seek out poor service from badly run small businesses.

I take my aunt out for a coffee once a week. What used to cost about £5 each - basic toastie and a latte- at a local cafe she likes, now costs £8.50 each.

At the smart patisserie, a cake and a latte is now approx £12.50 each- used to be £16 for both of us and now £25.

We can go to the local cafe- not worth the price though £17 for two very basic toasties (literally two bits of white bread and a bit if average cheese) and a drink. The smart patisserie (which isn't great but she likes it) is out of the question. It's very quiet these days.

This week I took her to our local community ed centre which has a great cafe. We had a fish finger sandwich each with salad and coleslaw (homemade) and Halloumi fries and tea for two. Cost £16.40 for both of us and well worth it.
The prices seem very random.

How awful that customers have benefited from this over the last 50 years, eh? High quality Food and general variety consumer goods had never been so affordable to all - until Covid largesse happened.

@RuthW My GP does some late nights and Saturday mornings so it's obviously not impossible.

I think that’s a lot for something that wasn’t any good, wasn’t in a nice place, wasn’t even filling.

A posh tea shop in York that went viral over this. A customer whinging she was charged the price of a cup of tea when she ‘just wanted a cup of hot water’ (plus lemon) and the cafe owner explaining why for a cup of tea, the tea bag and milk were the least of the costs.

Some people are just either entitled and/or stupid. If it's always it's a no-brainer to you to make food and drink at home (or take it out with you), why would you even bother to frequent cafes at all? Surely it would be the same to you as the pet shop is to me (a non-pet-owner) - somewhere irrelevant that you have no need for and thus simply ignore the existence of.

If you are acknowledging the added value that the business can provide, why would you not expect to pay something for it?

It's also interesting how people choose to frame things to justify their own advantage. That awful woman in York was assigning no value at all to the cup (to provide and then wash), the hot water, the staffing, the chair and place at a table, the lighting, the electricity, the heating, the business rates, the lost business from an actual paying customer sitting there etc. etc. She seemed to think that all these significant costs were magically free, but had she wanted a teabag and a splash of milk in her hot drink, that would be the sole costs to the business. Then, if that's her thinking, presumably she sees the price the cafe is charging for a hot drink, compares it with the price of a teabag from a pack of 500, and will mistakenly conclude that they're absolute rip-off cowboys making a solid mint.

It's also baffling how many people seem to think that shops get their stock free and so 100% of the price they get from selling it is profit, and so they can also take as much of it as they want for themselves/friends/entitled CFs completely free of charge. It's like an 'adult' equivalent of expecting to get everything you could possibly want for Christmas, because Santa makes/pays for it all, so cost is utterly irrelevant.

I know it happens a lot, but I still find it hard to understand the nerve of people who will quite cheerfully tell the shop owner that they are looking for details/info/photos about the item they're selling, so that they can order it cheaper online instead. Not even trying to be subtle about it.

I think that’s a lot for something that wasn’t any good, wasn’t in a nice place, wasn’t even filling.

The vast majority of what you pay doesn't pay for the actual cost of the food and drink. That doesn't mean that they shouldn't work to provide better quality/cooked/prepared/served food and drink - that's what cafes and restaurants live or die by - but was it warm in there? Was the chair comfy? Toilets convenient and clean? Any issues with the provision of the plates, cups/glasses, cutlery? None of those are free, far from it.

We are lucky to have some virtuous among us who don’t care about this so called ‘instant gratification’. Presumably those virtuous ones seek out poor service from badly run small businesses.

@sst1234 buy the things you need and want however you want to do it. No one is saying any different. I buy nearly everything from bricks and mortar stores because it suits me but I don't buy from places where I get poor service. Neither do I class doing my shopping as a humanitarian act but ,maybe you buy different things to me.

As I said @Teatime55 I think you should eat at home

Surely it would be the same to you as the pet shop is to me (a non-pet-owner) - somewhere irrelevant that you have no need for and thus simply ignore the existence of.

@WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll interesting. I am no longer a pet owner but still find pet shops relevant, though increasingly rare. Instead of buying kittens or cat litter I treat them as small zoos with no entry price. As with many aspects of retail, you don't get the same experience online. I feel people are missing this important point and pet shops aside, i suspect we might agree.

How did that work for the cafe where they wouldn't swap a slice of plain bread for the unwanted slice of fried bread? It can't cost them more to not fry the bread can it. What happened was instead of selling two breakfasts plus drinks for about £14 we left. The place was empty, I don't mean it wasn't busy I mean that apart from two members of staff we were the only people in there. We weren't asking for a discount but they wanted £1 for the plain bread and to not serve the fried bread.

This was a new business, we often go for a walk (if husband is well) or to sit on the seafront and enjoy the view and then go for something to eat. They have lost the chance of ongoing business because we won't go there again.

Are you sure the breakfast wasn't a frozen one that was microwaved? Usually the case when places will not swap items.

How did that work for the cafe where they wouldn't swap a slice of plain bread for the unwanted slice of fried bread?

@ancientgran that's a reason not to go in that particular cafe not a reason not to go in any cafe anywhere ever.

Another place might offer good service and is therefore worth visiting again and again. For instance, a couple of nights ago my friend and I dined at a restaurant offering a free cocktail if you ordered a main course from the a la carte menu.

It was made with grapefruit juice so she declined because she takes statins and they do not mix. The waitress asked if she would like a glass of prosecco either straight or with some peach juice. My friend said yes to both. Incidentally I'm on statins too but forgot you're not supposed to have grapefruit juice. I thought about asking for a prosecco Bellini but decided to chance it because I like both grapefruit juice and living dangerously.

PS she had boeuf bourguignon and I had roast pork belly, both of which we could have cooked at home alone cheaper. But it was just what was needed on a cold night out with a friend in a nice restaurant and very reasonably priced. We didn't even have to do the washing up afterwards.

No it wasn't frozen, you could see into the kitchen area and as I placed my order she was getting sausages out and only stopped when the issue of fried bread came up.

My point was that I wouldn't use the cafe again, I'm sure they won't understand why they aren't doing well compared to other cafes and we have lots, seaside town and getting a breakfast isn't a problem. They will be another small business failing unless they actually stop and think about customer service.

I wonder if they had absolutely no swap policy (even though the bread is ridiculous) because people kept swapping bits?
We had that a lot. "Can I have x instead of y and z instead of a and..." We just made it "here are items, pick what you want" at the end. Some places go the other way with no substitutions at all.

Someone once ordered full english but without sausage and bacon and mushrooms and tomato.... They wanted egg on toast with beans... Which was even an option on a menu!!!😳