AIBU to think the UK is more tolerant of dogs than children

[playgroundwarrior]

This morning an entitled dog owner shouted at me for pointing out that she wasn't allowed her (offlead) dog in our local playground. The dog was nosing around in our pushchair and hurtling around. The owner said she had seen the notices to say 'no dogs allowed except assistance dogs' but that hers was a puppy and that I needed to get a life! She genuinely thought her dog was as important as our children (she didn't have her own child and was with a friend)

This made me think about all the threads I've seen here about noisy toddlers in cafes and small children blocking the stairs. Last night I read someone moaning about the sounds of Peppa Pig on the bus.

I appreciate that the above examples of toddler behaviour are objectively annoying (mine frequently annoys me) but I'm beginning to think there's greater tolerance of dogs in this country than toddlers.

I've seen so many toddlers knocked over by offlead dogs and our 3 year old neighbour was pinned down by one last year, which was sort of just accepted as something that happens.

Since the pandemic, everyone seems to have a dog and the culture feels much more dog orientated than child oriented. I'd love a nice cafe or pub with a sign welcoming kids and a nice play area for them but have never seen one in my area, yet there are many signs welcoming dogs with treats and bowls.

Fully appreciate there are inconsiderate parents of toddlers and great dog owners who have perfect recall etc! I quite like most dogs but am
starting to feel the UK has its priorities very muddled.

AIBU?

YANBU and I say this as the owner of 4 children and 1 dog.

Entitled dog owners are as irritating as entitled parents...there's just too much selfish entitlement around nowadays I think. 🤣

Yes it's all about the entitlement.

YANBU... quite often dogs are yapping and barking in the street and people say 'oh it's okay!' And give them a stroke, but a child giggling too loud or getting excitable whilst out seems to be an irritant!

I adore dogs (and children) but think just like children should be taught rules and boundaries and to be quiet where possible (I don't think giggling a bit loud, getting excited for a moment is an issue, but screaming/shouting etc should be removed until calm), dogs also should be taught not to go in areas signposted not to, and given training and kept on a lead whilst not in a field etc

People seem to accept a dog being naughty/loud for a moment far easier than a child! It does seem bizzare

I think it's a pretty fair split to be honest.

Some parents are entitled beyond belief, some dog owners are.

Some people hate dogs, some people would rather not be near children.

I don't think there's much to gain from focusing on whether dogs are more tolerated than children or vice versa, I think it's too easy to overlook the stupid adults at the centre of all of these threads.

The expectation to change a baby on a restaurant table or play peppa pig full volume. To allow your fur baby to cock a leg on someone's pram or jump up at a runner, or smugly say cats are free to roam when someone says their toddler has picked up cat shit in their own garden. It may be easy to split into child/dog/cat etc topics but essentially they're all threads about the same type of adult bellends.

Playing Peppa pig in a communal space will never not be annoying and people have a right to complain about it, like you have a right to complain about a badly behaved dog.

Absolutely about entitlement. About dogs, children and sod everyone else but me.

I agree that we are very tolerant of dogs, and some owners are a bit entitled with it. But the whole cafe/ pub thing, there are LOADS of family friendly cafe/ pubs around where I am. Our closest pub has a family day at the weekend, with kids entertainers etc. huge playground. Dogs are allowed too!

I find atm a lot of entitled people who manipulate facts to fit their agenda. Considering we are meant to be evolving to develop equality and equal rights we do seem to be going backwards into complete extremist opinions. And essentially stripping rights and equality in the process 😬 also the problem is people who take the piss, ie assistant dogs that aren't assistant dogs just the owner decided to say it is and pop a vest on which ruins it for the owners who actually train and follow the processes. One bad apple seems to rot the cart and unfortunately once a person has a bad experience of a dog owner that will be more memorable than the other good owners :(. I agree people seem to be a lot more child hating atm, people seem to believe they can judge and dictate who is allowed to procreate 😬 it's everywhere on my social media, posts from guys saying if you don't meet this income you can't have kids, if you have a disability you must not have kids. Some people seem to think they can play god and their opinions are above the law.... although with the new abortion laws coming through even the law seems to be quite immoral. Bit worrying for society and humanity. Sorry may have ranted haha but I agree with both sides, and tbh I know dog owners don't like it either, as bad owners also put their animals at risk x

Yanbu. There are dogs in the local ‘no dogs’ playground everyday. People seem to think small dogs (cocker/cava/maltipoo) don’t count.

YANBU

There are too many inconsiderate dog owners and inconsiderate parents. And although both can make mistakes (and so get some tolerance) neither badly behaved dogs nor children should not be at large. Especially not in places from which they are specifically excluded (which includes spoiling older DC's fun by letting toddlers get in the way when they are allowed into over-8s playgrounds)

On dogs, this week my (adequately behaved and on lead at the time) dog was repeatedly pestered by a dog that would not recall, be caught or leave my (increasingly frustrated) dog alone. I nearly made myself late for something rather important because I stood still (and protected my dog) whilst the futile but eventually successful attempts went on (I was fuming, but I really couldn't have left the park and crossed the road towards home with another dog prancing round like a loon) Saw same dog off-lead again the next day, so I really think that's an accident waiting to happen, because no he's not "only playing" he's being a nuisance.

Also, I've seen complaints about this on MN, but hadn't spotted it myself until recently - poo! When I pick up after my dog, I usually pick up also any litter within reach. On two separate days this week, detritus has included other dogs' turds. That's a really shitty thing (in at least two senses)

I think that's true @Jericha I'm fascinated by it all the same and reading the responses here with great interest!

I have a non British set of grandparents who used to call us Brits weird for caring more about animals than people. They're long dead so this isn't necessarily a new thing if indeed it does exist. I wanted to see if my experience was universal since live in a 'trendy' sort of area where people in their 30s are far more likely to have dogs than kids because of housing costs etc. It feels almost like parental feeling has been transferred to the dogs or something and that dogs are seen as equally or more important than actual kids. I was raised on a farm with working dogs so this attitude is honestly very weird to me! Think I need to move to @Moontide's neck of the woods!

I'm currently on a train and there is a nice calm dog sitting quietly with his owner. Next to them are a couple with their 3 children who seem to be having some sort of screaming competition and playing their iPads at full volume, while their parents smile indulgently at them. I know what I'd prefer for the rest of the journey.

There are far more entitled parents than entitled dog owners

It's entitlement in general. You can see many entitled parents, whose kids are driving other people crazy, or (this really makes me angry 😝) cats shitting in other people's gardens, because "they're cats, they need to roam", or dogs sitting on the sofa in the pub (as in one of recent threads). As always, people are the problem thinking world revolves around them.

As far as businesses go, it's just about money.

Clearly many businesses feel like being dog friendly is a big hitter to increase revenue. Probably because dog ownership has ballooned in numbers in recent years. However, I rememeber the late 90s and into the 00s when it seemed like every pub was becoming family friendly and welcoming children.

Everything goes around, comes around, moves on.

I agree it’s entitlement and selfish behaviour that’s the issue.

Having said that, I would far rather share cafe/train space with other peoples dogs than other people’s children. Generally speaking, far better behaved 😀

Yes well there are idiot owners everywhere. Similar moment for me when I shouted at a guy who let his husky off the lead in a playground and it started chasing the children.

Idiot man

Agree about businesses going with what's most profitable for them.

But I do think there's been an increase in the number of dogs (so many people who were thinking about getting a dog 'in the next few years' went and got one during 2020/21). No where near as many puppies around at the moment.

For example, John Lewis shops have always allowed dogs in. But until this year I'd never seen one there. Now it seems you can't visit at all without encountering something small and hairy!

@playgroundwarrior I wanted to see if my experience was universal since live in a 'trendy' sort of area where people in their 30s are far more likely to have dogs than kids because of housing costs etc

Why have you made the assumption it's because of housing costs? Maybe they just don't like or want children.

that dogs are seen as equally or more important than actual kids

My dog is more important to me than someone else's kids.

That being said, YANBU about irresponsible owners (or parents). My dog doesn't want to play with strange dogs and is often harassed on her walks by off-lead dogs with no recall.

There are idiot dog-owners and idiot parents. Annoying, out of control dogs and kids are equally irritating. It is harder to get away from the kids as they can still go to more places than dogs. Really, it is about entitlement - I want to do this thing, how dare you stop me.

Out of control dogs can do a lot more harm.

Children are learning, and need a safe place to play.

These are two different things and one need, children, and their safety, is far greater than the relative annoyance factor. Children are not mini adults and make mistakes.

Dog owners are required by law to control their dog. When they give up on that bit of their legal duty they deserve shouting at to remind them it's a society not based on the needs of dogs.

I find Peppa Pig annoying in my own house, so I wouldn't be best pleased to hear it on the bus. My toddler has toddler headphones for when we need to use screens for bribery/distraction purposes

I don't disagree that there are some v entitled dog owners out there but I think the children point is because there's a vocal minority of entitled toddler parents out there (not picking up mess that's been thrown on the floor in the cafe, screens without headphones, allowing their little darlings to scream their heads off without even an attempt to encourage them to use indoor voices) I think all parents get tarred with the same brush. The sad thing is that the entitled toddler parents are usually ignoring that behaviour because they can't be arsed to parent their own child, so the child loses out too. I'm not some kind of a martyr and over the weekend DH and I fancied a rare pub lunch so we brought along a tablet for DD to watch so we could have a bit of downtime - but it can't do the kids any favours to have the 'easiest option' 24/7.

Whereas with dogs, the entitled dog parents are too involved - their dog's feelings trump everything because heaven forbid they are treated like an actual dog. It's the child substitute lot. The ones who want a dog who will sit quietly under the table at the pub generally train them properly because that's the only way they'll get any peace and quiet

Just look at one of the hundreds of anti dog posts on here. People can be completely outspoken about their hatred for dogs. Not what I’d call tolerance.