Thoughts on moving from England to Florida

[Decisions2023]

Other half wants us to move from England to his home town in Florida. He has family and friends there etc and he can keep the same job. We have a 9 months of baby and the move is making me nervous. The thought of making my child American is making me nervous as it would become his home and all he knows. I'm not sure if I'm thinking rational. We are not well off and the thought of making this big decision on my childs behalf makes me anxious/nervous.

Do you think I would be putting my child at an advantage or disadvantage?

Thanks in advance.

@Decisions2023 I think you need to have a long hard chat with your DH - so much is not about the differences but what you know. I live in classic London suburbs that is made by the family friends and community that I have and why I wouldn’t want to leave. The feeling of belonging that you have here and he has there.

but you need to be rock solid in your relationship you could find yourself without a job family and community and unable to bring your child back. Because once you move your child is as long as your DH wants him to be - American.

I’d rather be a single parent in the U.K. than have to bring a child up in America. Especially Florida. The politics, guns, abortion law, all things that I would feel the need to protect a child from, not expose them to. We have talked about moving countries as the U.K. is kinda shit but America is definitely on my list of ‘hell no, I’s rather stay here in the U.K.’ list places.

@Ideatcakeforbreakfast I work in multiple schools in England in a professional role and not once have I known them to have lockdown drills.

Hi, again @Decisions2023

I agree you have a lot to talk about and America has its disadvantages but I must offer some data on childbirth costs to counter those unsubstantiated claims of USD 10K and 30K for the insured.

Kaiser is one of the biggest HMO networks in America. (Never mine) In August 2022 the Kaiser Family Foundation published a report showing that the average out of pocket (ie direct) cost of childbirth to the insured is about USD 2850. The American medical system bills very oddly, and I would not be surprised if women receive bills showing total costs of 10K or, in complex cases, 30K. That doesn’t mean they are paying this amount! Most of it is covered by insurance.

In my HMO virtually the only costs were the copays for antenatal care.

None of this is to deny that costs for the uninsured are brutal

On the topic of identity - my DCs were always aware of a different perspective (held by me) on America as they grew up. They heard songs and stories and a different accent, they ate foods their friends weren't familiar with. They realized the world was a wide place and that different societies solve problems in different ways.

At the same time, I threw them wholeheartedly into those aspects of American childhood that were available to them - there was a lot to choose from that was very positive. T ball, softbalk, and baseball were so much fun, as were all the middle school sports and drama productions, and all the rituals involved in homecoming, prom, etc. They all applied for their Irish passports as teens, and have traveled under their own steam to visit their Irish family as teens and young adults. Doing study abroad programmes in France and the UK while they were at university meant some of them could pop over to see rellies in Dublin. DS is currently planning a graduation trip.

They developed a degree of cultural fluency in two cultures, yet within their American culture they are obviously rooted in a certain place and time, just as a British identity could involve the Yorkshire dales or SW1. I think all identity rooted in real relationships is local in the end. I don't see a spreading or thinning of the wider national or ethnic identity as a loss.

Worth pointing out that over 40% of US births are on Medicaid, which means zero out of pocket cost. In some states, Medicaid for pregnant women is available for family incomes of 300% of the federal poverty guideline. This particular example is very tricky--costs are all over the map, and the real headache can be sorting out the bills. I was extremely happy to give birth to one of mine in a hospital where all the doctors were employed by the hospital. I got one bill for the hospital services, and one for all my physician services (these bills are always divided because Medicare does it this way). Everything was correct, there was a single payment from the insurance directly to the hospital, and I simply paid my deductible. If the doctors are all in private practice, they send all their own bills, and it's a mess.

What you have to watch out for, and budget for, in the US system are chronic conditions, as your deductible will reset every year.

do think your husband really should have thought about all this and talked about his wish to move back before having a child. this feels massively unfair to spring onto you like this though I understand his feelings too it's not fair to burden you with this guilt.

We don’t know that he didn’t. We don’t know if it’s been a wish of his from the start, if OP knew but hoped once they put more roots down in the UK with kids etc his desire would lessen, or if OP was open to it at some point in the future, until maybe her feelings changed having become a mum recently. Covid has changed people a lot too & the job market, opportunities etc

It sounds like (only my interpretation) that OP has known that he has always wanted to return at some stage, as she says it will be a dealbreaker to him if they don’t.

Can’t imagine anyone springing that on someone shortly after having had a baby with them but it’s entirely possible I suppose.

Marrying someone of a different nationality & having a child with them is surely always going to carry the risk that they may want to return “home”.

Op doesn’t say if she’s even visited there & if their financial predicament means that this job offer for her DH will radically improve their situation & may explain why he’s so adamant to move….

They’ve been quite common for a while. A google search brings up a number of LEAs publishing theirs. The school I worked in implemented one 10 years ago which is when it became more widespread. Should note it’s not just about shooters though, it’s for any instance where kids need to be kept inside - most recently used in my current school when there was a suicide from the top of a car park opposite the school and we didn’t want kids seeing the body in the street. Guidance is it should be practiced in the same way a fire alarm is practised, although obviously a different sound.

@Decisions2023 my eldest is living independently now and my youngest is at boarding school. Yes I’m British and living here.. will you be figuring a second income into the equation?

@Decisions2023 please pm me if you’d like to share more info! I’m very happy to help

In the UK (Midlands) both my children had drills for active terrorist/shooters a few years back.

Why are people so naive to think it only happens in the US?

$8 for a dozen of eggs and $20 for a small chicken, according to reports I read.

People are attributing this to animal culling and fires in large production plants.

How can people afford these prices? Can anyone living in the US explain?

Came here to say this exact thing. The USA is a great place to visit but has a lot of problems and not a healthy culture to raise children in. Daily fear of being shot to death while learning your ABCs doesn’t lay great psychological foundations.

I’d never want to live in a place where it’s easier to buy a gun than a pint. I’d never want to live in a place where old men get to make decisions about whether I can gain access to an abortion. I’d never want to live somewhere where a school shooter is a very real possibility. Or where an unexpected medical bill could bankrupt me, where police brutality is a reality. Where food standards are way lower, chlorine washed chicken anyone?

Great place for a holiday, but you do you op.

We’ve already explained in this thread that we’re not paying prices that high. All you need to do is actually read the thread.

I have RTFT and different prices were being discussed by TomAllenWife and Cantstandbullshitanymore

How can people have to pay $23 for meat and assume it's all fine and dandy?

Only 5% of chickens are washed in chlorine. It made a great talking point when it was about trade negotiations, though. Also, despite the European ban, EFSA found no evidence it's unsafe. The real issue was about fears of cheaper American chicken overwhelming British producers. It was always economics, dressed up as food safety and animal welfare.

Because we don't. One data point does not make an average. Everyone's going on about $18 eggs for example. I saw that Guardian article. The $18 eggs were in an expensive gourmet market in Manhattan. They picked an outlier as a talking point. According to my grocery app, organic whole chickens are $3.49/lb. Lean mince is $5.49.

Not reading the while thread but two more votes for no drills in schools in 2 different London boroughs. Explained what I meant and they laughed at the idea of going under the tables.

Even if drills were routine though, the fact that my child will not actually get shot at school is more important to me than drills. That would stop me from moving to America alone. The gun culture.

I'd happily go over for a month or so each year until school age. By then kids change less rapidly and his family will be able to videochat with them more effectively. Hopefully it will be easier if any subsequent kids come along.

On an applied science school trip to a zoo we did an escaped animal drill. The food in the zoo canteen was ridiculously priced too.

The biggest issue is that if you split you'll have no default right to bring your child back to the UK with you. (It would be the same the other way around as well).

You need to think about whether you will happy to be stuck in the states of your relationship ends. Or to leave your child in the states if you want to return.

Some prices are that high. I was in NJ last week and purchased a chicken from a chain supermarket, it cost $16.

OP - if your child lives in the US, he won't see the UK as his home any more. That's obvious, surely?

I am British, married to an American man, live in the US and my children were born here. It is a source of sadness that my children are American, mostly because that makes them different from me (I don't think much of either country, truth be told). BUT, that's all my fault for marrying an American man. They're literally half him, and he's American.

Your children will be fine, as long as they're in a stable home ideally with both parents. Where that home is doesn't matter so much as the home environment. I will say that personally, I think most of Florida is the armpit of the USA and hell would freeze over before I lived there - hence why I'd never have married a man from there or any of the other places in the world I'd never want to visit or live in. Unfortunately for you, that ship has sailed. You've had a baby with a Floridian.

Personally, I would focus on your own mindset. There is a HUGE cultural difference between anywhere in the UK and anywhere in Florida. Huge. You need to decide for yourself where you want to live and take it from there. Your child won't be happy if you're miserable.

I can't believe this has never come up before, that only now is it a make or break thing. Did you really not discuss this stuff before you got married? Before you had a baby? Have you ever been to Florida? Which part is he from/would you move to?

Haven't RTFT but this sort of comment is so idiotic (and I'm as anti-Florida as they get). It's the tabloid version of nuanced thinking - ie sensationalist, uneducated rubbish. Millions of people live happy and psychologically healthy lives in Florida every day. Do you really think they don't?

That's true, if you're buying an 8-lb "oven stuffer". Or the multiple organic options, some of them come out that high.

For a chicken equivalent to what I'd buy in the UK it's more like $8.