... to be (slightly) freaking out about my woodburner?

[HappyAlley]

The Guardian is going really big on this (although we all know they have a track record of ignoring other vital concerns) & other news outlets have been reporting on this for a while. It does seem obvious that burning fuel inside a house is, in fact, very bad for you. I have a four-year-old & we've had a woodburner for 5 years, since we bought this (draughty, Victorian) house. Used a fair bit to cut down on energy bills. Two - four times a week in coldest winter; sometimes all day on weekends etc. I try not to open it loads but DP won't bloody listen; he's got that man-disease of constantly tending/fiddling with the fire for no fucking purpose whatsoever.

Must admit I wouldn't have one, despite the fact some people say 'they have passed all da rools and regulayshuns'... I know personally of 3 people right now who have log burner regret. One is a young mum (aged 31) who had a baby in November. She paid some £3,000 back in the springtime of last year for the supply and fit of one, and she says she hates it.

She lives in a small 2-bed house, with a small lounge (12 X 12 feet,) and she has this colossal logburner in it. It's too hot 90% of the time, and she ends up opening the windows to let the cold air in as it's stifling hot. Defeats the object of lighting it to warm the house really!!!

Also, she (and the others) say they are shocked at how quickly the logs burn through, and are forever having to get more and more, and keep having to chop them up, as they are often too big to go in the fire. AND they are shocked at how often it needs cleaning out, (the chimney/flue...) It's much more high maintenance than people let on.

In addition, they are all concerned about noxious fumes too. MAYBE there is nothing to worry about, but I wouldn't risk it personally. Neither does the woman with the 3 month old baby. The baby is always in the kitchen or hall when the logburner is lit.

Problem is, once you've had half your chimney breast hacked out to accommodate the logburner, it's hard to go back.

Why would you want to go back? An open fire would be far worse and that would be the only reason to restore a chimney breast. I’m assuming none of the log burner haters ever have a barbecue because they’re far more toxic.

We use good quality dry hardwood that burns slowly and smokeless fuel, the multi fuel stove is serviced and our flue swept once a year by HETAS qualified engineer.
To light the stove, single layer of smokeless fuel, kindling sticks, fire lighter, when it’s got a hold, another layer of fuel and then damped down. This creates a glowing bed of embers that heat the room for an hour or so, we then put on a log that burns slowly. After an hour or so, another layer of solid fuel or log. In the morning a fine layer of ash to put on the garden.
A well maintained DEFRA efficient stove should burn slowly and shouldn’t need the flue constantly cleaning.

Could you get an air filter?

This sounds like such a load of rubbish

So she didnt think carefully enough about what size burner she needed (there are calculations online for room sizes) and so has a 'colossal' burner. And yet its too small to accommodate logs that she has.... hmmmm

A chimney should be swept once a year.

I love bbqs, but only have them a couple of times a year and outside in a well ventilated space, not in the middle of my living room.

You can also get gas fired ones if you wish to cut down on smoke and smell.

Chopping wood is gloriously fun. It's a great workout, too.

most dangerous to children in the womb

ah well then, I'm sorted. Womb has shut up shop.

It's weird these stories about noxious fumes. I end up repeating myself. Often I struggle to dodge diesel fumes from vehicles, which are super obviously unpleasant. Nothing about my burner's emissions (inside the home) are remotely similar. I often see people standing in bus diesel fumes with seemingly no reaction. I seem to have conditioned myself to find whatever the burner emits fine but must keep self away from the back end of a bus and indeed almost any busy London road <gag> <gag>.

I'm of the opinion that they're better than a cold, mouldy home.

Yes there is some work involved to prepare the fuel, light and maintain the fire which is harder than just having the heating come on a timer. Personally I enjoy getting out in the garden for a bit to chop wood when I wouldn’t usually in the winter time and the satisfaction that comes from the huge savings in the cost and burning of fossil fuels.

Exactly this. Comparing a log burner inside a closed room inside a house, to a barbeque - which is always outside - is a ridiculous comparison. 🙄 Can't believe anyone even compared the two to be honest! 😂

They are awful. No matter what you do and even using the recommended fuel it is burning wood and they kick out high amounts of particulate matter. Most of it won’t be going inside your house but some will and it pollutes the air badly outside and it gets into other people’s houses. Or you and they just breathe it in when you’re out in the street or outside your house.

Yes humans have always lit fires even in cave times. They used to do all sorts of things and have much shorter life expectancies too.

They’re VILE. I can’t wait until they’re banned. Sick of smelling them everywhere.

www.theguardian.com/environment/2022/feb/15/wood-burners-emit-more-particle-pollution-than-traffic-uk-data-shows

Your friend clearly didn’t do her research before having a log burner installed. Sounds like she had one that’s too big for the room put in. The installer should have raised their concern. We have a fairly small lounge and have a 4KW multi stove. We get a nice bed of (smokeless) coal burning and then put a small log on probably once every 2-3 hours. The room never feels stifling. We also have a small fan on the top that circulates the warm air.
We have the flue cleaned out once a year.
We've saved a lot of money over the last few years as only have the heating on when it’s really cold. The washing dries so quickly in front of the log burner too. We love ours. Best decision we made having it fitted.

I appreciate your concerns OP; I'll happily help you out and take that pesky woodburner away.
TIA
Thing

The smoke from ours leaves a chimney at least 40 feet above the ground. Smoke rises. The only sentient beings that might, just might, be affected by the smoke are birds. You’re out of luck if you think there’s a snowball’s chance in hell of them being banned @Diverging.

The log burner has a door which should be shut (so long as the OP's husband isn't involved). Barbecues on the other hand are free to smoke away.

I get my chimney swept once a year. Logs from a local farm come already chopped and seasoned. Little bother and my poorly-insulated 188 year old cottage is nice and toasty. It's certainly preferable to indirectly propping up Gazprom.

They're definitely not great if you have existing asthma. Just got in from walking my dogs... Along streets inner city but residential. This evening was much worse than usual- not sure if some folk were burning unseasoned/scavenged wood? I got back home needing my blue inhaler and you can smell the smoke on the dogs' fur.

We've no choice here in rural Wales, as theres no mains gas and who can afford to heat their homes with electric?

I totally echo what others have said re. well season logs, i use a moisture meter (which was under £20) to test every log, and dont burn anything over 15% moisture.. easily done.
Plus burning unseasoned logs excessively tars up your chimney, which can lead to big problems when it comes to sweeping!

@GinJeanie i have asthma - it’s only a problem if it’s a trigger for your asthma. Not all asthmatics have the same trigger.
My worst trigger is being cold, followed by stress. My multi fuel stove is a god send for my asthma. Not a problem for me at all. Now a gas boiler flue will have me coughing my guts up, even if it’s on the second storey of a house…wish they were regulated a lot more for fumes.

like anything- we are all different and benefit from different things.

@Alphabet1spaghetti2 - absolutely true! As I've got older (50s) my triggers have changed and I think I've become more sensitive. I used to be able to use gloss and emulsion paint and now I can't. I know using a woodburner wouldn't be a good idea for my own asthma. It's great that it helps yours though!
Tbf, I don't usually notice it outdoors so don't even think about it. I think the main problem for me this evening was somebody burning something they shouldn't 😕. I guess folk need to use properly seasoned logs (I know they're expensive though - like everything else).

@GinJeanie people who burn the wrong items on a fire - indoor or outdoors deserve a special place in hell. It isn’t difficult or expensive to get it right (£275 for a years heating!) when compared to the cost of other forms of heating or the free council garden/plastic etc recycling collected from your door! (We are lucky to get garden rubbish collected free - but even when we didn’t, it could go in the black bin for free).

I think people are missing the point that the emissions from burning contribute to general poor air quality in towns and cities. It's not just about you and your front room. Like cars, the people inside aren't getting the worst of the pollution.

Comparisons with times when the population was many times smaller are ridiculous. London had bad air quality/smogs for centuries until the Clean Air Acts were passed. It would be a real shame to go back on those achievements because people in cities want a nostalgic but unnecessary wood fire.

because people in cities want a nostalgic but unnecessary wood fire

if only has was cheaper!
if only electricity didn’t need fossil fules.

what we need is a government that makes clean living affordable

Clean living is always going to be more expensive.

Wood burning isn't any more affordable than mains gas if it is done to the correct standard. What makes it cheaper is when people get "free" wood or burning materials, which often though not always is not the correct standard.

That's why in cities it should be banned, in the same way we have ULEZ in cities. Not only does it destroy the air quality, there are nearly always similarly priced better alternatives (mains gas).

If there is no mains gas then I think there is a stronger argument, both because people without mains gas have less options and because people without mains gas tend to live in the country where there is lower population density and less impact on air quality.

The same applies to cars. You can drive the car in the country for free if it is not up to the higher standard, because the impact on air quality is less. However drive it in the ULEZ where the air quality impact is high and you pay an additional tax. Why do this with cars to improve city air quality but then destroy it by allowing wood burning ? It's pointless.

You can easily source and season (correctly - it is not hard) you own free firewood. Ive collected enough for next winter since Christmas only, all legally and all in my spare time.
Its hugely cheaper than gas central heating if you do that.
People who live in cities have some of the highest costs of living.

I can't afford to have my heating on more than 2.5 hours a day. Simple as that. There is no cheaper alternative for me.

As a city dweller (and former rural dweller) I would dispute the assertation that people who live in cities have the highest costs of living. Yes housing costs in cities tend to be higher but other costs aren't. Gas is still a relatively cheap fuel to use to heat water and space. I live in a two bed flat in London with gas central heating and my total energy costs are just over £100 per month. Many city dwellers do not need to run a car, public transport can be easier to access and cheaper, there are a lot more free or low cost cultural events in cities.