Vegan diet and high oestrogen content for women (and men)

[unsureatthispoint]

I sometimes watch influencers to wind down in the evenings or for the aesthetics and light entertainment. A few young ones (30ish) are vegan and are now doing 'Veganuary', providing recipe ideas, saying what they eat 'in a week' and buying vegan 'on a budget' to help with the cost of living crisis.

Most of the dishes they have seem to be based on tofu, soy sauce or pulses. Shouldn't they be concerned about the amount of oestrogenic foods they consume? For some of them, their male partners seem to have been influenced too and are now long-time vegans. Is so much oestrogen healthy for men? The amount of goitrogenic vegetables like kale, broccoli and cauliflower could be problematic also for the thyroid?

The multitude of expensive supplements they seem to take in order to cover their nutritional needs are also based on pulses which only adds up to the issue IMO.

What do others think?

its is not a new way of eating - it is completely normal worldwide for generations, including for anyone in in uk and europe who is lactose intolerant, including my sons who were raised on soya milk and neither have any issues with their gender or sexuality 😂😂nor any of my mothers family, her siblings and their children and grandchildren, who are also lactose intolerant.

and there have been multiple studies that disprove this urban myth

Honestly, I get absolutely sick of this rubbish.

Because I have oestrogen sensitive cancers, there is always a small cohort of well meaning but ignorant people panicking about soya, or trying to "educate" me of these imaginary dangers and mythological pseudoscience.

SOYA CAN NOT RAISE YOUR OESTROGEN LEVELS

I have often wondered about phytoestrogens as I had a very oestrogen sensitive breast cancer. I asked my GP - who clearly thought I was bonkers! Anyway I can’t stand soya or tofu so I don’t ever consume them.

@gymbummy I heard so many bad things about eggs and dairy but I feel absolutely fine on them, no skin issues, no respiratory issues, period like clockwork.

To other posters, I stay away from soy, lentils and beans. 3 years trying to get my gut to get used to them with no use, they told me it's too much fibre, give it time, but by the end of my almost 3 years vegan I became convinced they just aren't beneficial for me. Scientific papers can be motivated by monetary gains to push certain agendas for their funders and it wouldn't be news if the science/dietetic community made a u-turn. Remember all the corn flakes and breakfast is important agenda pushing? Or the worse one about smoking being beneficial? I know soy affected my body, I wanted to eat soy, I liked soy! I only made the connection about my cyclical breast pain when I read research about it affecting hormones which stopped when I removed soy. That's living proof for me. I wasn't prefed a myth.

Genetically my ancestors diet was free from soy it was mainly a meat and dairy diet. My ethnic community gets ill from eating processed food, not from chicken thighs, butter and full fat milk.

It’s a myth. The oestrogen contained in soy is plant oestrogen, structurally different to the oestrogen we have in our bodies, so does not produce oestrogen effects in our bodies. In fact one study found that consuming soy products can significantly reduce cancer risks. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27161216/

Soy products such as tofu are a great alternative source of protein for those on meat and/or diary free diets.

I only made the connection about my cyclical breast pain when I read research about it affecting hormones which stopped when I removed soy. That's living proof for me. I wasn't prefed a myth.

Same for me. I read research, but when there starts to be a disconnect with reality I just go by what I experience

No. Do some research on phytoestrogens.

phytoestrogens not the same as oestrogens. Look at the diets of japan, china etc where they eat a lot of tofu and soy and the suggested issues you cite are not an issue.

Yes, this is correct and latest research suggests phytoestrogens may act as estrogen inhibitors in humans.

Eastern counties do not eat soya in the same way that the western world do.
I visited a soy sauce manufacturer in south korea who said that they don't eat soya that is not fermented in some way

latest research suggests phytoestrogens may act as estrogen inhibitors in humans

Breast Cancer patients in countries other than the UK are advised against having soy-rich foods though

er, no, having been a "breast cancer patient in countries other than the UK" I can assure you, we are not

"In some parts of Aisa these none fermented food provide the bulk of soy intake"

If you want to worry about female hormones on males, look at out water supply

having been a "breast cancer patient in countries other than the UK" I can assure you, we are not

I know that in the US they push soy consumption quite hardly. This is not the case in other countries in America

You are talking about “science” that has been thoroughly debunked

You are talking about “science” that has been thoroughly debunked

Research is expensive. Someone has to be investing heavily on this 'debunking' business. Research results are neither here nor there for me when reality is telling us something different

How ridiculous.

reality is not telling us something different - nobody has invested in debunking. Impartial research has been carried out, and conclusions drawn, and repeatedly confirmed.

There is no scientific basis for this myth what so ever.

You are just repeating nonsense.

I have oestrogen sensitive cancers. Do you think I would be sitting here sipping my soyal milk latte if I hadn't checked out these pseudoscientific fictions properly, very many years ago.

And I am qualified to evaluate research, and from the looks of what you have written, you are not

And I am qualified to evaluate research, and from the looks of what you have written, you are not

This is incredibly rude. Most people are perfectly able to read research and assess their own symptoms after eating a certain food.

You can keep on having soy milk if you feel like it, nobody is going to stop you

You say no one is going to stop you , yet that is exactly what you are trying to do !

You yourself brought up the notion of social contagion and here you are trying to persuade/ influence people that vegan/soya products are really bad and are r being highly dismissive of people who disagree with you

You don't like it don't have it but spreading misinformation doesn't strengthen your point

OP, I've found this thread to be really educational. I have read a lot about vegans who really suffered on the diet, and how it's a bit of a taboo subject in the vegan community, especially if you are quite embedded into the lifestyle. I think the impact of ultra processed foods (which a lot of modern veganism involves) and soy would be fascinating to see explored in an unbiased study. There would obviously be vested interests in seeing that unpublished, however! Anecdotally, I have read so many accounts over the years of people who feel dreadful, have skin issues, gut issues, and generally feel dreadful on a vegan diet. I wonder if it impacts women/different ethnic groups differently, as a lot of the accounts I read were by white women.

Anecdotes don’t debunk peer reviewed scientific research papers and being non binary has nothing to do with being vegan… this is the weirdest anti vegan thread I have read, so strange.

I mean anecdotally I have met loads of people who feel amazing on a plant based diet but it doesn’t really tell me anything about the health benefits or otherwise, for that I look at the scientific research papers which have found links to a whole foods plant based diet reducing risks of high blood pressure, cardiovascular disease, type 2 diabetes and certain cancers.