Mother with severe depression - and I can't face it

[BlessedKali]

I'll try to summarise a rather large picture as best I can-

My mum has always had bad mental health as long as I can remember, I was an only child and she was a single mum so it was mostly just me and her. When I say bad mental health I mean mainly depression and alcoholism

I don't know how and if this is related but she has always seemed to make poor choices for her life - not socialising, not having hobbies, drinking problems away, engaging in mind numbing activities (like playing dull games on a phone for hours rather than reading or other more positive pastimes) never doing excercise, always taking a taxi rather than walking, she never works. I list these things because it is hard for me to know what came first, the chicken or the egg. Is she like this because she is depressed, or depressed because she is like this?

Either way, it was quite shit at times growing up - she was very verbally abusive as a teenager when drunk, she wasn't there for me at all, she taught me nothing about how to manage the world, she quite often made out that it was my fault she was like that..... I basically dragged myself up and figured out how to be a woman, how to make life work.

Fastforward a few decades and now I'm a mum of 3 kids under 6. We (me and hubby) are in the middle of renovating an old mill, living in a static caravan whilst we do this (which is pretty full on work in itself), we are trying to be great parents, to pay for a good (steiner) school for our children, and I am trying to study. Basically: life is full on trying to give my kids everything and be a balanced human being.

Meanwhile my mum is still in the same position as before. Only now I don't have time to give her.
I obviously accept that she is not supportive in a normal motherly way to me, but I feel like at this time in my life I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO GIVE HER.

And basically I just feel bad that she is depressed and alone, and that I am not helping her.

But I can't even face ringing her. I just can't hear about her misery anymore, I am so, so worn out by keeping my family thriving, than even just hearing 20 minutes of the same, depressed, self-obsessed conversation that I have been hearing for what feels like forever .. I just feel like I can't

So I'm not really contacting her much...

AIBU?

Don't waste your time worrying about her diagnosis. Concentrate on yourself and your kids and dh.

My alcoholic family member went through therapist after therapist, angered by the suggestions of BPD. Her latest one has said she may have ptsd from childhood trauma and she's very happy with that as she now feels she can blame her parents for her problems. However, when asked to do some work on it she got angry and walked away again, it's very frustrating.

Thanks, I did have a therapist last year but stopped on the birth of my youngest and haven't been back since. I absolutely need to find that time again.

Yes can't help jump back into 'saving'

And as far as I am aware her life has been reasonably easy. She used to get drunk and tell me all the terrible things that has happened to her in order to emotionally manipulate.

One time ingrained in my memory is her sitting pissed on the sofa, I was maybe 14. Maybe I questioned her drinking, i don't remember, but she looks up at me virtually cross eyed and shrieks at me about how she had an abortion at 18 that she didnt want to have. I remember being absolutely horrified, and fairly confused. I didnt really know anything about abortion.

Since then I had an abortion myself. I never asked her for support because I was young and thought it would be too traumatic for her. The experience wasn't nice for me, and played on my mind until the birth of my first child. Now I look back with horror, I cannot ever imagine telling my girls about my experience in such a way.

So my point is; Im quite sure that she would have used any event to bash me about and create drama... It sounds like her life has been fairly easy. She loves to tell me how terrible my father is. They split up when I was little and he is from Spain, where he lives. Me and him have a good relationship, he has his own awkward ways, but nothing abysive or severe. Living with my mother would have been impossible. She is so toxic. Ultimately the only people who could put up with her behaviour were her parents, who did everything for her, gave her everything.

I know life isn't easy for any of us, but my MIL had a truly horrebdous childhood - sexual abuse, abandonment, homlessness. She is now a fully functional adult, has had a career, friends, hobbies....

So I don't think my mum's life is to blame, no.

Yes you are all right, why am I focusing on getting her a diagnosis, what would it achieve, what am I trying to make happen?

I think I am aware of a few things:

That she is going to enter a real crisis at some point soon, whether it be a full breakdown, sever illness etc ... I just feel it looming and would like to avoid it.

That when she dies I am going to have complicated grief, and no doubt feel guilt that I should have done more for her while she was alive. So I am trying to mitigate that.

That I am sad that there is this amazing wonderful world full of interesting people and their stories, on her doorstep, yet she is missing out.

But deep down I actually know she is really very unlikely to change.

I appreciate this thread for helping me pull these thoughts apart

If you have nothing left to give, you have nothing left to give. Your children only have one childhood.
I'm in a similar situation with my mum. I call her once a week and see her once every 6 weeks.
That's all I can give and that's what I do.

My therapist has taught me to never feel parent like responsibilities for my parent. You have to make that transition to be happy.

Walking (a form of exercise) would produce endorphins in her brain and help her to be happier in general

OP, You can't help an alcoholic.
They've got themselves into this situation and only they can sort their life out.

Alcoholics usually drink to change the way they feel and end up drinking more frequently because unfortunately, Alcohol also makes you depressed so the more you drink, the more morose you feel.

You could try contacting someone at Al Anon
to talk about your mum and get yourself some support.

Nothing you do or don't do will change the situation for your mum as only she can do that. Please stop feeling guilty! Focus on your own mental health and your own little family.

Ultimately the takeaway here is that you can't help her. Only she can help herself. It isn't selfish to prioritise your own mental health and your family, and it isn't selfish to prepare yourself for when things go wrong. Yes, you are likely to have to deal with complex bereavement when she dies. So be it, you have insight, you will get through it.

And a personality disorder doesn't excuse you from working at being a good person either. My DC2 has that diagnosis and is a lovely human being. It's incredibly hard and they are still on a waiting list for DBT, but because they recognise there is a problem, they work on themselves all the time.

This book (or others on emotionally immature parenting) might be helpful to you, OP

Recovering from Emotionally Immature Parents: Practical Tools to Establish Boundaries and Reclaim Your Emotional Autonomy amzn.eu/d/9iLO7Xl

Sending soldarity OP (and joining for tips). I also have a depressed mother which seems to take a lot of my energy away, although not exactly the same situation or reasons. It is hard.

Wow thank you for all your wise thoughtful words. And for the book recommendation🙏

Hi BlessedKali,
Found your post last night as i was searching for people with the same experience as me although my experience has not been abusive mentally or physically. Just a very depressive mother. I find myself now without any energy for my mother. I have tried over the years to coach, change her...but it is like she is not interested in improving her situation or maybe the antidepressants just have made her like that over the past 40 years. I myself have had anxiety all my life but have always fought and tried everything to get better. I just wanted to say to you that i understand how you must feel. I have this huge gap in my heart that i think only a mother could have filled. Still i have found that this book and doing some exercises massively useful. The Emotionally absent mother by Jasmin Lee Cori. I wish you all the best and keep focusing on creating good with your kiddies. X

Frankly OP, she abused you. The fact that she had seemingly poor mental health at the same time is by the by.

I think if you said to a stranger, "I grew up living with my mum, but she was neglectful of me, and verbally abusive to me for a lot of years, so now we don't have much contact"... I don't think anyone would think badly of you.

She had her chance to raise you, and have a positive role in your life, but for whatever reason (which is not your issue, concern, or fault) she made the choice not to. She missed the boat and now she's reaping what she sowed.

It sounds like you've got your own plateful of business now OP. Crack on. And if you want to keep contact to a bare minimum, then do so. And if you need someone's blessing... Here's mine.

You can't fix her. It's not your responsibility to fix her. It can be very liberating to truly acknowledge that.
Give her what you can- a visit or phone call every week, or whatever. But you and your own family come first.
Your mum is unlikely to change. Any change has to come from her.
You can't fix her. It is not your responsibility. to fix her.

One of the first rules you learn as a first aider is not to put yourself in harm’s way. This very much applies in a personal setting too. You need to prioritise your own wellbeing and that of your own family. There is no point in jumping into a fire started by someone who has no intention of putting it out and burning yourself in the process. You have absolutely nothing left to give her because she has totally drained you. What would happen to your children if you overstretched yourself by trying to take on this needless burden? Give yourself a break and do not contact her. With an addict you have to let them reach rock bottom and stop enabling them, it is a similar situation. No one can improve her lot when she is doing nothing at all to address it. Good luck with your renovation. I have done two massive projects, so I know how tiring it is on top of everything else.

Thanks again all, for further comments... and ressurection of thread, she was on my mind as I received the notifications for this thread.

I think one of the most difficult parts about people like this, is that they tend to blame others for their position. In this case she tends to blame ME for her life. If she's lonely then it's my fault for not calling, if she's struggling then it's my fault that im not helping enough. It's taken me years to see through this and to distance myself from it .

objectively its so interesting to watch her create a self-fulfilling prophecy. She is lonely, she blames me, I distance myself and she becomes more lonely.

It's standard addict mentality though - lack of responsibility and blame, debilitating for the individual.

a very intereting moment recently - i hadn't called her in months, because she had messaged me at tea time, giving me abuse, calling me 'self-absorbed and mad' (interesting projection of self there!) - she didnt ask my how I was, and if she had I would have said not good, as I thought my babies leg was broken and was deliberating whether to go to hospital or not.

since that moment I hadn't called her in 4 months. She hadn't called me either

when I last went to see her, in a momwnt of berating me, she said 'You haven't called me in FOUR months. Do you know how horrible that has been for me? I've been sitting on the sofa in my pyjamas crying all day because I've been so lonely'.

as sad as that image is, it blows my mind she would want to try to put that on my shoulders. Sitting on the sofa crying in your pyjamas?? That is absolutely not my fault, and the moment she takes responsibility is the moment she has an opportunity to swim up.

I honestly can’t believe the gall of some PPs telling the OP she should learn about depression when she’s been on the receiving end of her mother’s poor mental health all of her life. OP is saying it as she sees it, and that’s absolutely fine. For once this thread is about the OP’s experiences and needs, so please stop centring her mother.

I do resent when people narrow down the acceptable range of sayable things around mental illness. People who suffer mental ill health are not beyond critique, especially when their behaviour ruins other people’s lives.

It's interesting that she said that you haven't called her for 4 months, but it doesn't even register that she hasn't called you either. You may as well respond with "me too! This is the first time I've got dressed in 4 months. I've been staring at my phone, hoping you'd call, and it never rang. I could think of no ways to solve this taxing problem, so just sat there crying."

Your mum is not going to change anything in her life now. I'd give her a ring once a week whilst I was sitting watching TV and let her ramble on about her life. But that's all I would do.

I had a close friend who was depressed. It began to take over my life. He was like a sponge of all my energy and it was still never enough. His parents bought him a house. Most people would be over the moon to have the oportunity to life mortgage free, it was a perfectly normal three bed house in a normal street, the only problem with it was that it was a bit dated. The ugly decor was the only bit he focussed on, not in an unkind way, just in a 'poor me, it will take time and money to make this look nice'.

I hoped that when he got out of a depressive dip, his outlook would get better. But it never did, he remained through the good and bad times completely focussing inwards, his mood, his worries, his struggles. I can see what OP said about her mother doing nothing to get herself out of the low mood, thus causing it to remain, or at least to continue to be bad.

If my friend would have took a more realistic view of life and been greatful for all he had, I think a lot of his problems would have been solved. Yes, maybe the depression would have dragged him down sometimes, but at least he could have enjoyed the good bits. He had very, very supportive parents, who helped him financially as well as with childcare, and who he would see several times a week. He had a reasonable job, very low outgoings and had the time and money to do his hobbies. Yes all he talked about was himself, all he focussed on was the negative side of life. Me, his parents and others did a lot for him. He never really acknowledged all that we did. It was like he was stuck as a child in a man's body. Kids are never greatful for everything you do for them because they are kids and they are completely dependant on you. He was exactly like that, it would never occur to him to return a favour, people essentially exist to support him.

I am now long out of that friendship, but I've come to realise that there are some people who shape their whole personality around their mental health and their neediness, and no matter how much you give, they will always want more.

What exactly do you feel you owe your mother?
It sounds to me like you've overcome a difficult upbringing in spite of her and lead a pretty successful life now. Some of us just have to come to terms with the fact that our upbringings weren't great because of our mothers. It took me many years to work that out.

If you can get your head round it, there's no shame in accepting that your childhood was difficult because of her, there are many many others in the same situation.

Wow, I could’ve written this post myself. I always remind myself that my DD relies on me and I chose to bring her into this world, so my priority is always her. I remind myself that my nuclear family has to be my primary focus otherwise they will suffer as I did. It’s not just the time spent dealing with difficult family members, it’s also the toll it takes on your mental health and that has a knock on effect on your dh and dc. We have to break the cycle.

Please ignore the critics telling you that you don’t understand depression. Growing up in these circumstances gives you an acute insight into addiction and mental health issues. And experiencing depression and anxiety is never an excuse to be abuse, controlling and cruel. Congratulations on building a lovely life for you and your family 💕

I have been in your position, with a mother and sister. I have felt much better since I made it clear to both I couldn't help them. My sister took it badly, we aren't in contact anymore. She is still adamant that everyone must help her and it is everyone's fault why she is poorly, so we are responsible for her (she's 50 years old, not some young teen). My mum accepted that I was right, and over the last few years we have developed a better relationship and I can help practically with things like making phone calls on her behalf when she isn't able.

It's different for me, as my mum doesn't drink and wasn't/isn't abusive. It was difficult growing up with her being sectioned repeatedly or trying to commit suicide. She had a relapse in 2021 and I really had to distance myself again while her meds were adjusted.

You do what is right for you and some distance will do you good, but tell her why.