School bus Ethical dilemma

[dramalamma]

I'm genuinely not sure if I'm being unreasonable here or not - ready to be fried if I am!

My primary age kids travel to and from school on the school bus - they only started this year but it's been amazing for me in terms of extra time to work so I really really don't want to stop! The bus is free because of the distance we are from school, and there is a lovely bus monitor and the kids are happy so all good.
Towards the end of last term and since they've been back this term, they've been telling me every couple of days that there haven't been enough seats on the bus (usually on the way home) so the monitor has been making some kids sit more than one child to a seatbelt or several have been standing.

Here's where I might be unreasonable, I've told them that if there aren't enough seats, they have my permission to get off the bus and ask the office to call me and I will come and get them because safety is more important than convenience. I do believe this but also understand that it's going to put some other people out.
So yesterday there weren't enough seats so they, (very politely I'm told), got off the bus and asked for me to be called. Fine, they did what I told them to do, bus monitor understood, office understood, headmaster agreed with what they did and said he'd be calling the bus company himself to make sure they sent a big enough bus from now on.
So today I get another phone call, same situation (plus one of the seats my son sat in had a broken seatbelt) so I went and picked them up, put them in the car then asked the office lady if they'd spoken to the bus company.... apparently not because there are some kids on the bus who live too close to the school to get the bus paid for so basically it's the school's fault there aren't enough seats....
Now I happen to know that the area that these kids are being dropped off in is not a wealthy area and that if they were officially on the bus, they'd have to pay (I have no idea how much), but because they're not officially on the bus, they don't have to pay.
I've inadvertently opened a can of worms cos there is no way I'm backtracking on what I've told the kids to do, but I do understand the school is trying to do something helpful for kids who might struggle to get to school otherwise (they'd be walking but it's about 1.5 miles so only just under the 2 miles where it would be free).
I'm really stuck what to do. I can't pick them up everyday as I won't get enough work done but I also don't feel comfortable leaving them on the bus for up to 40 mins a day without a seat or with a non-working seatbelt (probably more realistic is 10-15 mins as they drop kids off before our stop). I'm pretty hot on vehicle safety so I'm aware I might be taking this too seriously but I really don't think I am. I could speak direct to the bus company but then I'll drop the school in it. I can speak to the head but they're the one who has created the problem and it could result in some kids not being able to take the bus..... but ......safety!! Any better ideas??
WWYD??

It is the parents responsibility to pick them up and get them home. They are not entitled to the bus end of. My thinking is parents can't be arsed to get them to school either on time or full stop so the school thought getting them on the bus will help with attendance....... that is not your problem. The safety of your children is.

It's tempting but I actually don't want to get the school into trouble - in most aspects they're amazing! I was just looking for a steer over whether I should make a fuss and follow this through or if I was making a fuss over nothing..... it's really helpful to know I'm not the only one who thinks safety is paramount. Besides, they'd know it was me now! I think I might be the only parent who knows!!

Oh this is awkward but agree with everyone else saying safety first. I’d raise it with the school again and ask them to resolve it otherwise you’ll have to take it further. Whether that means they fund a bigger bus or stop the children not entitled to it is up to them. But your children’s safety shouldn’t be compromised in the misguided attempt to help out others, in fact the extra children’s safety is also being compromised.

And Tricky one but if you raise it politely, it should get resolved without any loss to your relationship with the school. It’s a safeguarding issue which I’m shocked the school don’t realise.

You’re right to raise it. It‘a the schools problem they’ve cerastes this mess. The children deserve a safe bus, if that mean a the kids who aren’t entitled to it as they’re too close can get on it then that’s what it is. Their parents will have to pick them up and walk.

Problem is this something the school are covering up and you only know because it’s involves your children. What else are they hiding or covering up.

The parents must have been told they can use the bus. For whatever reason, the school has decided to support these families in this way and needs to pay for it.

Exactly, how can you be confident in their risk assessments now! I wonder if it’s a misguided attempt to improve their attendance figures to avoid flagging up to OFSTED?

If hat bus crashes, the kids not strapped in or standing will be seriously injured, the school are in the wrong.

Yes, you do have to follow up with the school.

If they don't have budget to pay for another/bigger bus then the closer children won't be able to take the bus if there's no space.
It feels like the school could organise something where they know number of pupils who are entitled to and will be on bus (not attending after school activities) and the size of the bus. If there are spare seats, the extra kids can be dropped off. When no seats the parents will have to make arrangements.

This is a new situation, now that you know and they know you know.

Maybe put it back to the head - how are they going to resolve it to make sure the children who live over 2 miles away get their seats without compromising on safety?

Leave it hanging as a question. Don't take it on as your problem to solve, at least not yet.

I would expect school to put safety first. My children actually attend a school where a very serious bus crash occurred a few years ago. ( it was a big news story and resulted in a criminal conviction for the driver). I am really shocked any school in the UK would risk safety in the way you describe.
Sorry but no.

Safety overrides absolutely everything. I can't believe the bus would operate with kids standing up/sharing seats. It's gobsmackingly unsafe and if there was an accident someone would quite rightly be prosecuted.

Ethics don't even come into the equation.

The driver must be aware at least since your children got off the bus those times. Surprised they haven't told the company.

Ok agreed I would be worried about mine if they were alone and the bus jolted and they were stood up or not seated safely.

I wouldn’t worry about being the only parent who knows, children could easily have gone hime and told their parents that they shared seats and seat belts, which is especially dangerous.

I also wouldn’t worry about making yourself unpopular at school because I guarantee there will be staff that would be unhappy about this if they knew and wouldn’t let their own kids do the same.

Use the words 'safeguarding issue' when you talk. If you don't get any action:

Letter to the Head, copied to Chair of Governors. The school is endangering pupil's safety with this attitude.
Your Council should have a safeguarding children partnership of some kind. Depends where you are, will be a County Council thing if that is the sort of local government that you have.
The bus company are at fault here for allowing this and if you can find out who is in charge a letter saying that you'll dob them in for invalidating their insurance might help.

A shame but in trying to do the right thing the school are messing up badly.

As a former school governor I’d encourage you to make a formal complaint to the school and to the bus company and follow it up - I am appalled a HT was so ridiculously cavalier with children’s safety, not to mention the law, I’m staggered that no school staff put an immediate stop to it (and question their whistleblowing and safeguarding procedures) and I’m staggered the bus driver allowed it. You don’t solve a problem like that by repeatedly breaking the law and risking children’s safety (and children’s respect for road safety rules). They are absolutely in the wrong and if that’s the level of sense being displayed by the HT I’d wonder in what other ways their judgement was lacking!

Thank you all so much - I'm not from this area of the uk and spend a lot of time feeling like I'm making a fuss cos "that's how things work here" - things rarely happen by the book! but I'm not going to let this one lie now. I think a quiet chat with the head would be a good start and I'll see where to go from there. Pointing out about insurance, liability and safeguarding should be a good start!!

I'm shocked that

1. The coach driver is happy with unrestrained kids and going over capacity
2. That no one is taking a register of who is actually on the bus
3. Someone at the school is aware of 1 and 2 and rather than doing a risk assessment and thinking "this is not a good idea" is carrying on with it.

It's safety 101, surely?

The school (and bus company) made this mess by allowing extra passengers who are not entitled to school transport, to overcrowd the bus and break safety regulations.

Now they have to sort it out. Pronto.

If their numerous fuckups endangering children ever come to the attention of local police, the bus company's insurers;your MP , and the local press, all hell would break out. You won't be the person in the firing line so don't give them an inch.

Its not your fault, you did exactly the right thing and your children must continue to receive correct service.

I hear you but the school principal should not sacrifice child saftey so children who don't qualify can get the bus. I would push back and not care about being unpopular

Speak to the school transport team at your Local Authority. They are the ones responsible for the transport.

I hope the old 3 to a seat rule has finally been scrapped, I remember my mum up in arms about that in the 1990's

I understand how you feel and people don't seem to care if everyone is OK but when I was a kid I was on a school bus that crashed. I was OK but some of my friends were in hospital. No seat belts in those far off days. If it goes wrong you will always regret it if something happens and the school will be in a mess.

You are doing the right thing.

I’m mystified by this. If they had to travel to school on an ordinary bus with no seat belts like thousands of other kids this wouldn’t be an issue.

A service bus has a limit on the number of passengers, they don't have primary age children doubling up on seats. Where do thousands of primary children travel on service buses to school without their parents?

Also where is this part of the uk that operates differently to the rest?