Driving myself mad, should I move back up north or not?

[Led92]

I’ve been in the south East for 15 years for work but I grew up up north. My siblings and parents are there.

We have a nice house in a nice area, with green spaces and good schools. There’s lots of clubs and activities for my 3 children and my eldest DD started a nice school this September.

My dh is now full time wfh and I have a meeting next week with my boss to discuss going formally to 2 days a month in the office when I return from maternity leave. Same pattern as him and what I was doing before maternity leave anyway. However it would limit my promotion opportunities as generally the more senior you are the more you need to be in the office.

It would mean we’d have an opportunity to move back up north. I’ve thought about it for years as I’m quite lonely here despite clubs and parties keeping us busy. I keep thinking about it. I’m a lot happier when I’m with family.

but… if they weren’t there I wouldn’t be moving back, the area is nice but it’s a bit dead. My siblings and I all moved away for work and are only able to make our way back through flexible working. I feel guilty taking my DD’s away from the south east, there’s so much going on here.

Also I don’t have savings spare for the stamp duty etc so we’d have to take £30K
out of the sale of the house to cover stamp duty, legal work and moving costs which seems like such a waste of money.

The disruption, money, impact on my job all seem significant but… you only get one life? DH is up for it if we could find the right house. And we’re up for February half term to see how it feels in an air bnb close to my sister.

What would you do?

yabu: forget the hassle, stay where you are and go up for holidays!

yanbu; move, you only live once.

It sounds like a big risk with your job unless they are happy to write the 2 days a month into your contact. Otherwise, they could ask you to come into the office FT and you'd have to decide to leave, they wouldn't have to make you redundant.

I've thought about this but I decided I'd feel too trapped in one job and it would be background stress thinking about what would happen if that job went tits up (lots of situations where you wouldn't be made redundant but it could become miserable eg terrible new boss, restructure so you have loads more work/work you don't like etc etc). I've decided to stay in the SE where there's lots more opportunities.

Your sister is your best friend then I wouldn't hesitate.

When you go back things are never the same as when you were young so don't expect that.
personally I would discuss with whole family and see what the realities are of seeing them,they will have own jobs and friends etc.
his has the surrounding area changed?
are your dc close to any cousins?
it's a huge upheaval and a considerable financial loss if either of you lost your jobs.
try a good and bad list and see how long either side is?

I live on the Wirral and disagree about it being a bit dead. Depends what you want, I suppose, but my kids have clubs and activities coming out of their ears, and I belong to several local sports clubs myself.
Happy to give more details if you wanted to know about specific stuff?
And you don’t have to live on the Heswall / Caldy side if you don’t find the house prices manageable. I’m in Bebington and can be in Heswall in less than ten minutes, and in Liverpool in under 20.
there are two sets of grammar schools if you don’t want history repeating itself - both Wirral Girls and West Kirby Grammars, not to mention Upton Hall.
which primary school are you looking at? The birth rates in Wirral have dropped over the last few years so there’s quite a few very good schools with space.

I definitely wouldn’t move unless the flexible working was approved formally. If they want me to come into the office more it’d have to be at their expense. I’ve been in the job 10 years and do like my colleagues and the company. We have teams nationwide so meetings are always calls with people dialling in from across the UK. A few people I work with live up north.

DC love their cousins, they’ve asked me to live closer but don’t think they understand what that means about school!!
My sister is constantly lobbying me to move (in a fun way, she happily declares her self interest).
My parents already somewhat elderly in their mid to late 70’s, full of fun but not what they once where. My sister and brother help them already, so it’s not really swaying me one way or another. Actually a bit frightened of seeing them a lot more and then losing them, think it’ll hurt even more than now where they’re not really part of my daily life (apart from the busy family whatsapp group)!

Do you actually want to move? Do what you really WANT to do and your heart tells you to do not just what the best decision from an objective point of view is.

Also wondering if you can move back to a more buzzing area not on the doorstep of your family but fairly near. We moved back north two years ago but we have moved to a larger town about 30 mins from my mum and dad. I still see them every week but we can't pop in for a cup of tea on the way home but I feel the balance is the best thing for us- this town allows me to establish myself as an individual and it has so much to offer.

Schools - if you can be sure of moving to a good catchment ( primary and secondary).

Ah the Wirral, where I'm from, although I'm not sure I've ever heard it referred to as 'West Wirral' before, whereabouts are you thinking?

I left in 2000 and I'm not sure that I would go back... although my M&D are still there. We finally settled just south of Manchester and it feels like there are lots more jobs/opportunities here. The Wirral always feels slightly dull to me although it's lovely in the summer with places like Parkgate, West Kirby, New Brighton, Thurstaston etc etc.

I wonder if 'near the Wirral' might work for you?

Heart says yes.
Head says no due to jobs, hassle, cost and my kids probably ending up in south east anyway themselves like we all did!

I don't understand why you would uproot yourself and your whole family, just to hang out with your sisters a little more often (& it won't be as often as you think!).
And surely your kids will have better career opportunities staying where you are? And I say this as someone who lives happily in the NW!

Instead of moving north, can you confirm what you don’t like about your present life and make steps to confront them.

Feeling lonely - take up a new hobby, or join the gym, etc to meet people.

Miss family - set up a weekly FaceTime session for all the family to natter.

Holidays - schedule more visits.

Is it a case of the grass is greener, or are you genuinely unhappy in the south.

This is the kind of decision where I'd take time to work it all out on paper.

You ask should 'I' move back?But it's the whole family and while DC shouldn't be involved in the actual decision making, their feelings should be taken into account. Especially regarding interests and opportunities.

So make a list of what they really LOVE doing and are likely to continue with - sport, music, drama, art, scouts etc and check facilities and opportunities in schools and areas you might move to.

Make a list of the things that bring you joy, that you love to do regularly. Could you do these if you moved? More? Less? Same?

You might lose £30k in the move but could you get a better house for a lower amount, freeing up some money for good holidays or to invest for DC as house deposits or uni funds? If aso, would that be more valuable to you that staying out an dhoping the house increases in value?

All the people I know who moved back North were really happy to have done the move. But it has to work for all of you.

If it would be a financial loss, can you not just stay put and make the decision to visit your DSis and family at least three times a year and encourage them to come to you at least once a year. This is a tiny island. We're none of us more than a day's drive from each other - even Scotland to Cornwall can be done in a day!

Exactly!
I feel lonely here and think I’d be happier up north . My kids are so little still that they’ll make friends and have fun wherever we go it’s only really my 5 year old that has made friends but it’s not like they’re BFF’s….. but.. is it really worth all the hassle!?

Currently our sundays will be us as a family finding something to do…. I find it quite insular and boring… DD’s are great but hard work.
Up North I imagine we might pop into my parents on a Sunday morning, go out on a walk with cousins then have a family Sunday lunch. That’d be my perfect Sunday!
If it was just me I’d move now.

But the reality might be different.. and I just don’t know.

I do find the North a lot friendlier in general though!

Reason I say I is because it’s my life. My kids can do what they need to when they leave Uni, we all did and scattered around the country. As they’re not old they don’t really have any ties to Seast yet. My 5 year old does dance and swimming, both available up north too. My 2 year old and baby just do playgroups. Once we don’t need to worry about schools we might relocate again if they’re all down South.

I’d always imagined my teenage daughters traveling into London (travel is free- again cheaper than the North where it’s not for teenagers) and hanging out, going to free fun and interesting stuff or just meeting with friends at Greenwich park which is quite near to us. But… that’s at least 8 years away it’s a long time.

It’s hard to take up hobbies or get out with a 3 month old DD I need to feed of an evening! But certainly in a few months/years I’ll have more freedom. I’d rather be happy where I am than move but it certainly is seeing family and doing long country walks that make me happiest.

This is why I’m going mad you see… I’m going round in circles and honestly getting upset and annoyed with myself.

Hi Op - I recently moved 'back' to somewhere I had lived when young from london - bringing my primary age children with me - I then poured my tears onto mumsnets pages with regret! However several months in I'm glad we moved -

Here is what I think you need to ask yourself - one of the most painful things for me was leaving an established community and the buzz/ diversity of London life which I had become very used to over decades.

Will your day to day life in the Wirral be different to your current life - can you think about how?

Can you write a list of what you are worried about losing when you move?

I think in terms of teenagers schools etc - I think most places will be fine as your children are young that is all they will know.

Can you hone in on what you might regret? One thing I can tell you is that the things I thought I would regret about the move - I absolutely did! I was right both about the positives of moving and the negatives - I still ache for my old friends and neighbours.

It sounds to me from reading this that your heart wants to move - that you don't personally feel you 'belong' where you are - that is close to how I felt.

I think it sounds like regardless of the 'head ' reasoning - your heart wants to do this and you will probably not be able to switch that off

despite losing a huge amount in our move I now am very happy as are my kids - life outside the south east has a lot going for it - space/ greenery/ country/ coast etc -

It's interesting you say 'life is short' - that suggests to me that what you really really want to do is move.

Based on your updates I think you should move. You love seeing family and long country walks. That says the Wirral. It's not the middle of nowhere, there are cities around if you want variety.

You're very caught up in the "hassle" of the move. Yes it wont be easy, especially with young kids. But it's a one off thing, for a long term aim. A few months house hunting, a few months of stress over chasing soliticors and packing, a few months of settling in. Then at least a decade in the place where your heart seems to be. At least now your kids don't yet have established friendship groups.

If it's truly where you want to be, don't stay out just because you can't be bothered to move.

I’ve been returning to the idea over and over it for 5 years.
I’d be worried about work and jobs, and know my DD’s would likely have to leave home for higher education and jobs whereas they probably wouldn’t in London. But our day to day family life could be anywhere.

My Mum worked part time at a local factory…. I wonder if having a Mum at work commuting to London every now and again will give my DD’s a different perspective on everything.

I have Mum friends here but only for playdates, I don’t think anyone would be up for a spa day in future if that make sense. Seems our friendships revolve around the kids. So nothing really to miss there.

South East has a great vibe but I’m also a bit tired of it. We’ve had a new car nicked off our drive and another recently broken into with nothing taken (there was nothing in there). Someone came into our house too and stole my purse… we were upstairs! (Tiny window left open on a hot day, must have been Oliver Twist). Never mind the commute, everywhere being busy etc… a bit fed up of it all.

If I earned more money and could afford a detatched house in the counties like Surrey I might feel different, but we don’t have that kind of cash and are unlikely to.

I live 3500 miles away from my family ....
Frankly you have so many positives where you are now and realistically how often would you see family if you moved? I'd stay, continue to do holidays etc with family - best of both worlds!

Honestly do you think that you would actually spend say every Sunday doing those things or would they not become boring and mundane. Might your sister and your parents might not want to do other things. I’d live where there are the best opportunities for my children for their further. Rose tinted glasses have a lot of problems.

Wanting to play with cousins etc again is all fun when it’s novel because it’s once every month or two or whatever but when it’s a weekly obligation is not so much.

I might try this. I go back to work in August and might feel differently when I’m not pushing a park around all day in my own. I think drop dead date for listing our house is Jan 2024 to be moved by Jan 2025 in time for primary applications. If we missed that we’d leave it. The stress of selling a house is one thing, in year transfers is another.

In the meantime make an effort to do more Airbnb weekends on the Wirral to get the best feel of how it would be. Jan 2025 my oldest would be 7, I do feel that’s starting to push it regards being disruptive for her. She’s quite shy and sensitive.

If we moved and then my sister moved I’d be gutted. But I can’t begrudge her if she does. She and her dh work in aviation and could end up anywhere if they wanted! (Albeit they love the Wirral and I can see why, they have a lovely house with fantastic views. She says she has no intention of moving)!

Btw this will make you laugh…. My other brother lives mainland Europe and he visited recently with his teenage children. I asked them what they would do and my 16 year old niece told me to move back North as London is best for young people. I’m late 30’s! Made me laugh. I take her point though she thinks it’s nice to raise a family outside the city.

Having spent years on the Wirral and in London near greenwich, I would absolutely go back north. I’d be up there like a shot if we didn’t have to be southern for work. Honestly I think it’s a great place for families, and so important for kids to grow up near family if possible. Trains/buses into Chester, Manchester, Liverpool - loads to do for teenagers!

One thing to consider, and the thing that would mean I would never return to live in the north of England, is how you feel about darkness and cold in the winter.

Today 8 hours 32 minutes between sunrise and sunset in London
8 hours 17 minutes in Manchester, 8 hours 2 minutes in Newcastle.