To think work no longer ‘pays’

[Cuppasoupmonster]

This is a controversial topic so I’m expecting a few biscuits to be thrown at me so I’ve got my hard hat on. Inspired by the ‘benefits overhaul’ thread.

I often see on here that working and owning your own home is always better than claiming benefits and living in social housing. But it seems like the perks are long gone if I’m honest.

It feels like every day I’m dragging myself up at 6am to take my daughter to nursery (when I would much rather have her at home with me), just to pay our enormous mortgage and bills, before breaking even at the end. We haven’t had a holiday in 5 years. A few months ago I went into my overdraft for the first time in about 6-7 years despite the fact my spending is no different. What are the upsides again? Is it just that we get to choose the care home we die in (perhaps)? Because right now I’m feeling pretty pissed off with the whole thing and wondering if anyone else feels the same.

For Me I’d be ashamed to reply in handouts, I like working and earning my own money. Couldn’t imagine thinking oh I’m gonna just live in benefits. That’s the easy way out.

If you can go on benefits and get a council house and be better off with it all go for it. But I am under the impression that it doesn't work like that. I dont think that people just sit back not working and get handed benefits. I think they have to show they are looking for a job and get sanctions etc etc. So if that's the life you'd prefer then go for it. No one needs to own a home during their lifetime, in most cases they are there to be handed down to a family member when you've gone, so it's not necessarily a benefit to you (apart from when your mortgage is finished you don't have payments anymore). Like my previous post says my life is unrecognisable to when I had to claim benefits, I wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

You mean men and women are not the same. That’s not what equality means. Equality means being treated equally, for example in the workplace.
If you we’re in an equal partnership with a man then the woman wouldn’t be shouldering the responsibility for nursery fees, you’d split it. Don’t get involved with men who don’t treat you as an equal.

How many people do you think as a child or teenager say I want to live on benefits when I grow up? Benefits also top up working people’s wages so they can afford to live, yes even people working full time. Child benefit is a class of benefit, did you ever receive that?

Presumably you chose to home because you liked it and viewed a few before you found ‘the one’. Your lender checked you had sufficient income to cover the mortgage. With social housing, you get little choice and often have to spend a few years living somewhere grotty before getting a transfer to somewhere decent. With private rentals you are at the mercy of your landlord.

If inflation continues the way it has been, one day your mortgage is likely to be less than other people’s rent. One day, you will have paid your house off and you’ll have no housing costs.Of course, it will coincide with a time you no longer have children to support and certainly no childcare costs. Very few people have to sell their homes to fund care; most people don’t go into care and those that do are rarely there long term! As you get older you can also downsize or move to a cheaper area and release some equity to enjoy.

The only way you’d be better off not working is if your childcare costs outstrip your salary and travel costs. This has to be balanced against sacrificing any advances in your career or, indeed, the opportunity to return to your career. Only you can decide on that. As your DH works, unless he is on a low wage you are not eligible for state benefits. No point in saying, yes, but what if I leave DH, if that is not what you’re planning to do. Doubt if you would find life all that rosy as a single parent on benefits trying to find somewhere to live.

You are at an expensive time of your lives with a high mortgage and childcare costs.It must seem relentless but it is a short time and things will get better.

@Eyerollcentral excellent advice 👌 where were you when I was 20? FGS people make mistakes and you don't always know these things until it's too late. DS dad was finically abusive to me I got rid of him and believe me I agree with what your saying I have not had any more children since. It definitely was a hard lesson to learn.

You’ve come through a really tough situation, you should be really proud of yourself

It can feel tough. We have had a bad start to January - the washing machine died, we needed work done to the pipes under the kitchen sink and the toilet flush is on its way out. I feel like I habe spend half my Janaury wages before I even get paid.

BUT we have control and choices, we can get a plumber out, decide to buy a better new washing machine etc.. my cilleague who rents has been without a washing machine for nearly months as her landlord is insisting on using the company guarantee and it has taken them ages to get an engineer out.

It is the same with work. By working you are getting experiece, learning skills, earning your own money. It gives you choices and control over your life. Never under estimate the negative effects of depending on the whims of others for your housing security or income. Some people have no choice of course, but if you do always take the option to work.

It's hard at times but it will pay off.

You do have the choice as long as you have the wage or savings which unfortunately many owning a house don't so doesn't feel like a choice. You are stuck with it until you magic the money up!

Well that is true, but it is a consideration when you buy a property that you are not just on the hook for the mortgage but also the running costs.

But yes sometimes it means having to live with broken stuff for a bit. Our toilet is going to have to wait until next month as there are too many bills at the moment.

Presumably you chose to home because you liked it and viewed a few before you found ‘the one’.

No, I did what most people do - buy the least bad property that is commutable to work and nursery. Not ‘the one’ by any stretch 😆

That’s the only thing that stops me really, what my family would think.

Work

I have the same feeling at times OP. Once you’re on the social housing train and if you manage to luck out in winning the bids on a nice new build one (or getting there through swaps etc) or one in a lovely village or similar, life does seem very easy. I’m jealous of several I know in such situations. A couple of them have returned to work as the kids have got older - but with your rent at say only £400 per month for a 2 bed house in a desirable village where new build 3 bed semi sells for £350k - there is little financial pressure and you can work part time, topped up with benefits, have a peaceful life in a quiet area, surrounded by posh people.

Yep. Absolute joke!

We both work. We also rely on UC. Why should anyone feel ashamed about that? If you are entitled, you are entitled.

Yes that's how I read the OP. I don't know why people turned it into a working vs benefits thread.

Both full time? What’s your housing situation can I ask? Do you pay nursery fees?

Why is it always a race to the bottom on here?
Why is it always the fault of mostly (I know not always) underprivileged people?

Why are you not all up in arms to your MPs!
Mortgage fees have gone up (who's fault was that?)
Why can councils manage to have rents cheaper then private rents?
Why is Nursery fees so bloody expensive compared to other countries?

Why are people not asking these questions instead of arguing with each other on a forum which I'm sure the tories ore absolutely loving!

Ok, I’m up in arms. Will that change anything? Of course not. Im not criticising individuals, im criticising the system that enables them and makes me worse off for working full time and being married!

@Cuppasoupmonster as long as you're putting the blame on the system and not on its victims, I'm with you. It's ridiculous. And I don't often agree with @Xenia about anything, but the benefits system here is a disaster. I'm from one of those countries she describes, where what you get depends on what you've paid in. You can get up to 75% of your last wage for a duration that depends on how long you were in that job. The rules are very clear. It stops people from plummeting into instant poverty, which means they are far more likely to get another job quickly.

Income tax is very high in the uk, in fact the is taxed to death and it also has an extensive welfare state. Crazy really.

Same for where i am, welfare is based on what you've put in. People quickly get a new job here, whatever is available.

@Tekkentime income tax isn't actually all that high in the UK compared to countries like Germany/France, and it's lower than it is in the Scandinavian countries where you get so much more back for what you pay in. We aren't taxed to death. What's killing people here is the cost of housing and childcare, both things which could be addressed if the political will was there.

I think the uk is taxed to death for what the actual taxpayer gets out of it.

If the nhs goes, there will be no justification for it!