Civil servants - will you be striking on 1st Feb?

[Iamnotausername]

I know you probably can't say what dept you are in but will you be striking?

I will.

Thanks for the concern. I'm perfectly fit and well.

You're becoming very confused and seemingly mixing posts from people and misinterpreting/misrepresenting what's being written.

I shall clarify for one last time! I have never said i object to people being paid more depending on grade. This should reflect responsibility and position however, % increases in wages and bonuses should be equally attainable and fairly distributed among all staff. They should not be given to some for the work of others. I have never said pensions were a diabolic liberty or done a "reverse ferret". Indeed I said the pensions issue was not something that personally bothered me too much as I viewed it as a perk of the job not an employee right.

AA and AO levels are leaving due to better pay and conditions elsewhere. The reasons may have differed when you were a CS but this is now. You've still failed to address or acknowledge the current and increasing discrepancy in private pay vs public sector pay and at no time have you managed to rationally justify the discrepancy in pay rise % per grade/position. EG 17.5% pay rise parliamentary members awarded themselves, when the majority of CS have had pay freezes and now staff are accessing the benefit system due to low wages.

We do not strike and lose a days wage each time because we enjoy it. We do it as a last resort.

@Iamthewombat Well that was a bizarre response…

1. Tagging the person you’re replying to is not “trying to start a fight” – it’s a feature of this – and most other – forums. It prevents confusion. You’re holding several conversations at once – tagging or quoting makes that easier to follow. Calling it undignified is just silly. It’s perfectly normal and acceptable behaviour.
2. Your argument that my belief that withholding labour is a fundamental human right means that I’ve “forgotten the subject of this thread” just… doesn’t make any sense? The two things can be true at once: I support striking as a fundamental human right AND I believe this specific strike is justified.
3. I do have a pretty in-depth understanding of DP’s job, yes. I don’t think he’s mistreated. I do think he’s underpaid relative to his experience and responsibilities though, yes. In my experience — which is, of course, limited, but probably more than your average non-civil servant given I spent 6 years working directly with them — so are many civil servants, and I support the strike. I’m not “attempting to claim” that. I’m saying it outright. You clearly disagree. That’s fine.

Yawn. Here you are upthread, complaining about pensions in response to a direct question from me, which was, what precisely is your complaint about pensions?

We cannot affect what we pay into our pensions and they aren't as good as people think. I had private sector pensions that are probably better. We had a pay review 5 years ago. It was recommended we were being paid 6k under what was justified. The review was acknowledged but we've seen nothing, no additional pay, no levelling up. The head of our directorate got a 5 figure bonus this year because we hit our SLA and productivity targets (by working all the hours god sends). They're on a 6 figure salary to begin with. We got nothing, no Christmas card, no thank you, no 15 minute time allowance for a Christmas coffee with our team (I'm being arsey but honestly nothing, not even an email saying thank you).

You don’t understand how pensions work, do you? Or the specific point the civil service unions are making. But, that’s not going to stop you complaining. You have no idea of how much somebody would have to pay into a private pension to even get close to the benefits offered by yours, and yet you claim that private sector pensions are better than the civil service scheme.

You also complain that the head of your directorate “is on a 6 figure salary”.

You complain about not being thanked for doing the job you are paid a salary for.

In your latest post, you confuse MPs with civil servants. As if paying MPs less would be more than a drop in the ocean compared to public sector pay costs. Do you know why MPs got a bigger pay rise than you? It’s because their pension scheme was made significantly less advantageous. Think about that, and whether you are as hard done by as you think you are.

😂 "I shall clarify for one last time!" Seems to have been utterly ignored by you (among other things). You are tedious Iamwombat. I see you've still not given us your view on our pay review not being adhered to, neither have you covered the areas of lack of staff increasing workloads etc.

Pensions are your obsession throughout this thread and despite my previous statements on my concern over pensions you're hanging on in there and now becoming disrespectful and patronising. Such a shame that you ruined a good adult debate.

You continue to select, edit and misrepresent the context of many posts to spin your own agenda and essentially pick fights with members because clearly you are correct based on your CS experience (many years ago and probably in one department). 100,000 of us, plus those who support us are apparently incorrect and only striking due to pensions, whinging and being "hard done by" 😂. If only you had told us this sooner we could have all stood corrected 😉.

I wish you well Iamwombat. Best of luck in your retirement. Please do be patient with the services you require from a government department as there may be delays in processing due to ongoing strike action.

Nope, my civil service experience was not ‘many years ago’ and it covered two separate departments. Sorry to rain on your parade!

Can you see why your gripes are not being taken seriously at work? It’s because of the behaviour you have displayed in this thread. Petulant, over-emotional, petty and frankly illogical. Upthread you complain about having to work from home, because it’s unfair that you have to pay for heating and lighting during working hours. Simultaneously you complain that you couldn’t afford to commute to work if asked to do so. What do you expect your employer to do? Lay on a free taxi every day? I doubt that even that would satisfy you: you’d soon find something else to moan about. Perhaps your odd conviction that by paying for your excellent pension at bargain rates you are somehow ‘losing money’:

I appreciate you at least trying to find out the facts on the pension reason to strike which is based on us overpaying into our pensions based on the projected return we will receive during our retirement. It is unpalatable because we cannot affect what we pay into our pensions and therefore over the years we will be losing more money.

My views on the pay review and your workload are irrelevant, but you must see that all kinds of people, irrespective of the sector they work in, have had pay rises below what they had hoped for and that many people have high workloads? The things that give you the negotiating power to ask for a higher salary are having specialist and hard to source skills, having great experience and being a co-operative member of a team. And voting with your feet, by which I mean leaving for a better-paid role, not an inert one day strike.

@Iamthewombat

Whoops. Tagged you. How very undignified.

Which pension scheme are you talking about? You say you USED to be a CS. Are you on the old pension scheme or new one?

More sour grapes! The new scheme. If I were in the old scheme I’d have had to have been a civil servant a long time ago. Which I noted that I was not.

@Iamthewombat

Please explain why asking what pension scheme you were on is sour grapes? Exactly what was so sour grapes about my post? Oh yes, that's right you just read what you want to. You do that, don't you.

I was going to ask you something about the (new) pension scheme that you may have found useful and you would probably have wanted to look into. It has nothing to do with the strikes but seeing as you know everything anyway, I won't bother.

Anyway, you seem intent on making a fool of yourself and trying to upset people and start a fight so I'm going to just let you get on with it. I bet your colleagues were devastated when you left the CS.

Probably not. People are used to the woeful state of the civil service from lockdown days. They’ve had three years off work now. What’s another few days.

@sst1234 I love the fact in January 2021 you called people idiots for falling for celebrity PR, and yet here you are regurgitating Tory bullshit like it's fact...

Obviously I have time to search old threads because I don't work, just getting paid to sit at home

Untrue. Myself and my colleagues worked all the way through lockdown, no change to service behind the scenes apart from increased workload due to thousands of new claims. Ridiculous comment.

Did we get 3yrs off? Nobody told me that. Why was I working on an antiquated lap top that they found in a cupboard that would crash at least twice a day if we got time off?! I feel ripped off.

My shift starts in an hour so I'd best go and get ready to do nothing for 8hrs.

Whoops. Tagged you. How very undignified.

Here’s your sour grapes. I see that you have included many more in your latest post! This is why you won’t be taken seriously.

Three years off work? What planet are you on if you think that. I only joined 2 years ago but it's been fully face to face every day and I know colleagues were in office the first year too.

@Iamnotausername are you being paid when on strike?

Civil servants were not paid, either by their union or by their employer, for the strike days on 1st Feb and 15th March.

@BessieSurtees

People on strike do not get paid by their employers, nor do unions replace lost pay.
Most unions have a hardship fund you can apply to but would probably only kick in after a prolonged strike. But it does not replace lost income

I know but I also know a nurse who was paid for two days on the picket line and two teachers who were paid on their strike day. The PCS have said they will pay staff.

www.pcs.org.uk/campaigns/pcs-pay-pensions-jobs-campaign/pcs-strikes-your-questions-answered

Last question

Members who take part in sustained, targeted action will be paid strike pay at their full normal rate of pay. We are able to support members in this way as a result of establishing the levy. Where we call national action involving all members in the dispute, for example, as we did on 1 February and 15 March 2023, strike pay will not be paid.

Analysis of CS pay shows that it’s HEO and above where pay is most adrift from the private sector and the gap increases the more senior the role. Pay has fallen in real terms (by up to 23%) dependent on grade/ location and a lack of pay progression, with experienced staff on the same pay as newly promoted staff being a significant issue. However, having worked in the private sector there are some clear reasons I won’t be striking, namely that it’s less pressured, more flexible (open to compressed hours, flexi-time, home working) and the pension. To be fair, I’m sure the levels of pressure and flexibility will vary according to role.

@BessieSurtees

As I said they will pay for sustained strikes, 2 days I separate months is not sustained- therefore no strike pay

No but 5 weeks will be sustained and it does say they will be paid so no lost income. Is that not how you read it?

@BessieSurtees

well lets see if it happens

And is so, so what? We have paid into the strike fund - thats what is there for.

The union is almost certainly not going to be able to cover 5 weeks wages because the strike fund isnt big enough. The union is likely to pay something, akin to a hardship fund, but it won't replace their full wages.

Having said the above - if PCS do pay full wages, I have no objection. And as a member, I'm one of those who pays for it.