To think we could make housing estates like Center Parcs re cars

[QuertyGirl]

The USP of Centre Parcs is for many, the fact that they are mostly car free. Kids can play out and ride their bikes like I did when I was kid.

Can't do that now due to the amount of cars, speed and size of cars and, attitude of some car drivers.

People (including myself) pay a small fortune to holiday at CP.

Why can't we make housing estates more like that?

Communal car parks in walking distance, deliveries by small electric vehicles from a hub (like old fashioned milk floats), exemptions for blue badge holders and funding for electric mobility scooters for those that need them.

Yet, if the council suggests a couple of cycle lane and all hell breaks loose.

As I said build middle class homes like this and see if people buy them? They won't unless they are much cheaper than conventional houses.

How would plans like this work for people like community nurses? They already struggle to keep up with workload without having more issues accessing the properties they need to.

I walk whenever I can but I have a disabled DS and for his needs easy access to a car is vital.

Yeah, I think you COULD make housing estates like that, tbh.

It's not for me so I'll stay where I am with my drive but it may well appear to enough people to sell property there...

While I agree in thery practically I cant see it working.
Ide be happy if houses on new estates had drives and pavements personally rather than everyone parking along the road

Ah, another 'I don't drive so nobody needs to drive' thread.

Here are a couple of reasons why this doesn't work:

1. I live on an estate which is built up a very steep hill. Lovely views, but a pig to walk up if you live right at the top. And it's getting more difficult as we all age.
2. In the past I had hobbies like flower arranging. Carrying 3 fullsize bin sacks full of spiky foliage plus delicate flowers plus floristry tools plus a handbag, is just not possible. I didn't even carry everything out onto the drive at once, to put it in the car.

YANBU, our lives, streets and children would be much happier and safer without all those bloody cars everywhere however people think they own the road outside their houses.
Take away cars as per your suggestion and quality of life would improve greatly. Children playing on streets again, people stopping to speak on streets etc etc. I'd love it.

Well the councils are trying that within London via the LTN. It’s a nightmare. So limiting. Maybe create new build communities like that and people can choose to live like that.

Yes because when I’m in a crohns flare walking a mile from my car to my house is not going to happen.

well it might. But likely with a trail of shite and me and anyone who sees it traumatised.

@SweetSakura , many around here are 20 mph now.

I would guess you could have delivery services for large items.

My ex has to use annual leave if he needs to be at home for a delivery, which isn't feasible to do every time he needs to buy a large item.

you might shop more frequently, buying less each time, using shops that are more local.

Lots of people can't afford to use their local shops due to the expense. Or they can't get what they need from smaller shops. I have coeliac disease and have to drive a few miles to get a loaf of bread.

Currently your kids are dependent on you driving them to get them to school and football practice. It's not inconceivable that a community could be designed so at a certain age kids could cycle or scoot themselves around, or be escorted somehow from school to activities. They don't now because roads are unsafe because of cars. So you need cars because there are cars. Or training might start later to allow walking time instead of driving time between places.

My 7yo doesn't cycle to beavers every week because it's an 8 mile round trip. As for training starting later, I doubt the unpaid beavers leader would want to stay any later than she already does, tbh.

What annoys me the most about these kind of threads is people assuming everyone lives like them, in a city with easy access to facilities, and only have cars because they're lazy, and don't get any exercise, yada yada yada.

Ide be happy if houses on new estates had drives and pavements personally rather than everyone parking along the road

I think this would make a massive improvement to safety. Much wider roads and bigger drives to allow people to get multiple cars off the roadside.

What annoys me the most about these kind of threads is people assuming everyone lives like them, in a city with easy access to facilities, and only have cars because they're lazy, and don't get any exercise, yada yada yada.

Yip.

18 mile round trip to scouts 🤷🏼‍♀️. Same to any kind of activity for kids. Only local shop is tiny and poorly stocked and so expensive.

School bus only available at 3.30 no bus later so if kids wanted to do after school activities I had to go and get them.

OK so I don't live in a city I live in a village on the edge of a small ish town in a fairly rural area overall. The kids are driven to school the days I work as I can fit more work in that way. On the days I don't work I actually do walk them. They couldn't take themselves as they are too young to be unsupervised.

I could shop more local but only at the one convenience store so limited options and prices- again an issue right now for most people.

Again maybe the coach would start later but as there is numerous sessions running at the same time ther may not be pitch time later on and it's quite late enough for a finish on a school night anyway.

I think these ideas are rose tinted by those living in built up areas where life is very different

I think estates could be laid out better to provide more open spaces away from roads for kids to play.
My friend lives on what was built as a council estate. And it's fab. The streets are running parallel to one another. The front of the houses open onto a green area with a pathway running all the way around it. But no road.
At the rear of the houses they have a decent sized garden with back gate leading to their off-road parking spaces.
So you have the best of both worlds. Kids have a safe place to play. Easily visible from the house. Yet the car isn't far away either.

The town I live in is a little bit like that. On-street parking is prohibited in most parts of my neighbourhood, although in some streets it is allowed between 8am and 6pm. Instead, there is usually a small car park at the start of each street or at the start of a development (usually 3-5 streets with the same type of housing). Newer apartment blocks will usually have underground parking.

Where I live, you can get permission to drive up to the front door if you're moving house or getting a large piece of furniture delivered, emergency services also have access. Otherwise, there is a loading bay about 50m away, while actual parking is about 100-150 meters away.

It's a design that seems to work really well here. Most housing developments will have some kind of green space or play area in their centre, then around that is housing and then on the outskirts of that is where you park. For me, the inconvenience of not being able to park right outside my door is outweighed by the fact that it feels much safer for kids to play, as well as for everyone to walk/cycle/scoot because there aren't cars parked everywhere.

I think these ideas are rose tinted by those living in built up areas where life is very different

I do wonder if there may be an element of the same that goes through everybody's minds when stuck in congestion: how everybody else shouldn't be there!

I'm Dutch and lived in a tiny estate for about 5-6 years where you couldn't park your car (or drive through). I did everything by walking/cycling.

I so often hated it. Carrying around the heavy shopping/a bit of furniture/some tools/the christmas tree is a fucking pain in the arse if you have to do it every bloody time for years on end. Not to mention through slippery snow or muddy rain. Not at all comparable to a CP holiday (which I love). It also costs more time and I'd rather do something fun with my time.

I now live in a house with a driveway. That was a very conscious decision.

Why not just make sure all estates have to have an enclosed safe area for kids to play, allowing bikes and scooters?

And teach your kids road awareness?

That was one of the ideas behind the Barbican Centre in London, built in the 60s. A modern way of living, with arts and culture at the centre of the community and the cars hidden away in undrground car parks.

It was visionary at the time.

I'd love to know how people living there find it.

There are double yellows directly outside my house and no ability to put in a driveway. For years I had to park a good five to ten mins up the road as it’s so busy further up since commuters park there during the day - this was when my kids were pre school. It was awful, particularly if the one out of the buggy fell asleep and I had shopping.

Eventually we found a way to build a garage at the rear of the property. We have to shlep all the shopping up through the muddy garden but it’s a hell of a lot easier than a ten minute walk!

I'd happily live like that. But rather than a car park, I'd prefer a bus / train station - or even in addition to the car park.

The difference with London LTN and the CP dream is that inside the LTN people own cars.

That always make me chuckle, people who say that they were stuck in traffic. No dear, you were the traffic.

Sorry OP. I found Center Parcs totally stifling and couldn't wait to leave. There is no amount of money that could compel me to live in similar circumstances permanently.

This was tried in Cumbernauld, the premise of the original town was to separate cars and pedestrians. In some parts of the town there are huge issues with car security where cars are in central parking areas with houses built out of sight of the cars. There are also issues for folk with disabilities accessing their own homes. Centre Parks it is not.

What annoys me the most about these kind of threads is people assuming everyone lives like them, in a city with easy access to facilities, and only have cars because they're lazy, and don't get any exercise, yada yada yada

Very true