Family member shocked I get universal credit

[JungleJungle]

Had a long conversation with a family member today. I've just started a new job so not sure how much UC I will get this month, but previously was earning about 1800 a month, £950 childcare costs and £950 rent and would get, around £800 in universal credit. They seemed to think that I earn enough money to pay for myself and said nobody on 30k a year should be getting universal credit. They were quite shocked that I was getting anything. Childcare costs and rent come to more than my wage (£1900). I would likely have to give up work if I didn't get universal credit. My outgoings would be more than my incoming. I still struggle even with the £700 I have left after rent and childcare costs. Bills are so high, fuel, food, clothes, emergencies etc. Not sure what I'm looking for from this thread. I work so hard, full time, and never considered that I shouldn't be entitled to universal credit. I'm not being unreasonable am I in thinking that this is what UC is for, am I? Apologies for the slightly waffly post, just feeling a bit shit.

Wow, what an entitled reply, showing that you have no understanding of the lives that some people live.
It is not always as easy as planning a life and doing this, that and the other. OP has explained that this is a situation that was not of her choosing and unfortunately there are a lot of people who also have had to make difficult decisions or not had the privilege of making some of the choices you have been able to!

But it is a benefit, that you receive when you reach pension age. Most don’t pay in as much as they end up claiming.
You also pay NIC on the understanding that you will be able to claim financial support if you lose your job or need help to maintain a basic living standard. It is comparable.

I wouldn't be discussing money with anyone. It's not their business. It's a bit distasteful also.

@SpringsRightAroundTheCorner, that's exactly what I'm saying. And of course, I got a parade of replies from people bending over backwards to paint themselves as special snowflakes who aren't in any way responsible for their situations. It's the British way.

Yes, we can have bad luck. There are always going to be people who need help and I think most of us are decent and see it as our duty to help. There are always going to be people left with the kids to support after someone walks out.

But the problem in the UK is that it;s hordes upon hordes of people. Last time I checked (before the pandemic), we have the second-highest single parent rate in Europe, and the only country that beats us is somewhere in eastern Europe where there's a reason--decades of political turmoil and poverty. Our teen parenthood rate is right up there. It's obvious just from going out on the street. It's absolutely shocking.

I'll never be able to afford to buy a house and I've got a PhD from one of the best universities in the world in Engineering. It's simply not possible in my area. I can't have kids. Most people make much less than I do and it's wrong. People should be able to afford a house and a family. But we can't, we know we can't, and yet there's no effort whatsoever to teach kids it's wrong to make everyone else pay for kids they can't afford.

The problem is, there are no consequences for the takers. They have child after child that everyone else has to pay for. The fathers aren't made to pay what it costs. The mothers aren't told that they'll land themselves in poverty and should get qualifications and housing first.

@Cantstandbullshitanymore, working people are being made to pay higher NI because Boomers didn't put enough away to pay for their care. They knew it. I remember hearing about the discussions from when I was a child.

It's not only the NHS. We've got hordes of people who retired in their sixties who will probably live decades. The system was not set up for that. The Tories have bought their votes by letting them get away with it and taking from the young instead. The elderly did not lose a single bit of welfare (free bus, heating allowance, TV license, and on and on) after the 2008 financial crash. The young have lost everything. There's no housing assistance for under-25s now unless there are kids, there are huge tuition fees, and little NHS care. It took me nearly four years even to get signed up with a GP after I moved and I've never had NHS dental care. Most of my friends are in the same boat.

@Crazydoglady1980, people live their lives based mostly on choice. It's a choice to have children you can't afford and to make the rest of us pay. It's a choice to shack up with a loser who isn't going to support his own kids and who'll go off to have more kids he can't support.

Yes, there is bad luck, but we don't have the second highest rate of single parenthood in Europe by coincidence. It's that we allow people to grow up with attitudes like yours, where no one is responsible, everyone is special and entitled.

@SpringIsTooFarAway, you're telling yourself what you want to hear. No, the UK has one of the highest rates of single parenthood and teen parenthood in Europe. The rest of us are stuck paying.

No, you're not a helpless victim. You are capable of figuring out whether a man is ready to support children. There are sometimes situations where men walk out and they should be forced to pay for their children, living in dorms if necessary. Child support is pitiful in the UK and that means there are men who have child after child that they can't support. If they had to pay, they'd think a lot harder.

We need to change attitudes. The UK is the only country I know of where attitudes like yours are normal. Kids are simply not taught that they shouldn't be making everyone else pay for their poor decisions. Part of it is that expectations for women are so low. No one expects teen girls to get qualifications and a decent job. It's sad for everyone.

On the surface of it no, nobody earning 30k per year should receive UC

BUT that’s shameful on the economy that people earning 30k need UC to make ends meet not shameful at all on the individual.
Unless you live in a mansion, drive a Land Rover or take 3 foreign holidays a year then you’re absolutely not taking the p* some earning 30k per year should be able to rent a home, pay their bills and support one child I would argue that’s the basic life standard one should expect on 30k wouldn’t let anyone make you feel guilty for that.

It's teh cost of childcare - which is paid until the DCs go to school (or at least is much less after DCs go to school)
In Canada they take away your passport if you don't pay child maintenance.

@Antst unfortunately your replies only continue to show your ignorance of life for many people, which is understandable as many can only understand what they experience themselves.
Being able to gain the qualifications you have are a privilege not available to all. To have life experience which means you can identify men who are not going to make good fathers and partners has not been available to all and having an understanding that others life experiences are often about survival rather than choice, is also not something that everyone is able to understand.
I would suggest that you explore why people end up in the situations they do, by exploring evidence rather than other sources and then reflect on how your comments link

You are 100% entitled to Universal Credit. IF you were honest on the application and they are giving it to you it's yours. It's very rare they get it wrong. Don't ever feel like you shouldn't claim something you are entitled to!

Bear in mind that 30k these days is absolutely bugger all with the rising cost of everything and in real terms would be pittance if we earned the equivalent in the 90s.

As a side note it makes me laugh how people say you shouldn't claim benefits because working (while starving and freezing to death) is clearly far more important don't realise that if you earn anything under 30k with UC it's not even worth working.

@Crazydoglady1980, I grew up in one of the poorest areas of the country and with parents who provided zero support. I got out by the skin of my teeth and then spent years trying to get qualifications. I understand poverty very well.

I understand that people can have bad luck (something I've already said) but when there are attitudes like yours, where you're essentially saying there's no personal responsibility and people who land themselves with kids they can't afford are victims, then there's a problem.

This attitude is not normal in any other country I know of. The UK has huge problems with single parenthood. It often means poverty for children and the custodial parent. You are not helping. Looking for excuses is not helpful either for the young women who continue to land themselves with children they can't afford, feckless fathers who go off and have even more children they can't support, or taxpayers stuck with the bill. Or the kids who are growing up in poverty without opportunities because their parents didn't know to wait.

Why the angst at the women raising the kids and needing help to do so and not the feckless men forcing them to do so?

Perhaps if these posters want the 'benefits bill' of these single parent families reduced they should pressure the government into giving efforts to pursue child maintenance some real teeth, so these men can't get away with it. Or push for more social housing/rent controls/affordable childcare?

You absolutely should be supported by the state to stay in your career until your child reaches school. That's how we get a productive economy instead of loosing half the population for years and letting their skills go to waste plus it's just the right thing to do after you've been abused by some horrible arsehole so both a moral and ecenomic imperative

I'm glad you get what you need but I'm unimpressed that we were entitled to sweet FA. I am fortunate enough to own our small home but it meant that when I was single handedly supporting myself, DH and DS we got nothing. And I earn a little over half of what you do.

I do think people get it far easier nowadays. I was a single parent and worked full time and got nothing from the government back in the 80s, my child stayed overnight with my mum while I worked nights, it was hard. Then I got married and I worked nights, my husband days, it was still hard as I was on auto pilot from lack of sleep for years. Wish I could have claimed childcare costs back then, but in those days if you had kids you paid for them.

I'm shocked, I earn the same as you and yet I am paying towards your expensive rent and childcare. Maybe you should find some cheaper alternatives instead of holding your hands up.

For anyone who might be wanting to work out their entitlement or learn a bit more about how it is calculated

the website www.uceplus.co.uk
is the most accurate.

I have 1 child and a partner and pay rent.
we get UC top up.
I worked out that in our current circumstances Uc wouldn’t stop until we start bringing home 37k a year in earnings.

I do think the conversation with your family might have taken place because of the debate on Jeremy vine radio 2 show yesterday.

What Britain are you living in at the moment.
rent is ridiculously high at the moment.
in 2010 when I was looking for my first house to rent I got a 2 bed for for 375pm
i ended up in that house for 10 years due to rents becoming unaffordable- the lowest rent in my area was approaching 850pm for a 2bed.
luckily I managed to move away and find something more reasonable.
ive just checked rightmove for a house where I used to live and it’s almost £1000pm, it isn’t even a good area.

remember that people earning UC are also paying tax and NI too. Unfortunately they are just having to have it back for the basics of living.

maybe if you applied for Uc we’re entitled to it but instead of getting a payout you got a tax exemption that would help a bit. But then you don’t pay your pension so your scuppered later down the line

This and also that we need a realistic living wage.

I applaud the posters on here who have stood up for those of us who are on similar salaries but somehow entitled to nothing. Other than Child Benefit, we have never been entitled to any support. The NHS services in our area are so bad we are now having to find the money to go private, which is not a small amount to find.

DH and I both work full time. I’m sick of the anecdotes of handouts. We are penalised for being married and having a mortgage. It’s an unpopular opinion.

I have plenty of life experience and it’s nothing to do with not being ‘aware of how other people have to live’.

@aaltmember well said. I'm a big fan of universal basic income, which would go a long way in helping to sort out all of this mess.

Honestly I'm suprised too.. on that wage I would have thought you could find somewhere to rent cheaper so as not to be claiming. I early similar not so long ago and had childcare costs. Never considered benefits as would never have thought I was entitled!

This

Are you sure? 45k is more than I earn and it’s still definitely worth me working even with childcare and travel etc. along with continuing your pension and keeping your hat in the ring. We pay £62 a day for childcare 4 days a week (I work 0.8 WTE) and I still come out with over £700 a month after childcare if we just took it from my salary and I’m on less than 40k. Might be worth running the numbers again before you pack in work in case it’s not as bad as you thought! Childcare costs are disgusting though.