To think we cannot afford to support Ukraine anymore

[Saysomething1234]

This may be an unpopular opinion but it is annoying me to no end and NC

We have a littany of issues crying out for funding domestically - NHS broken. Economy going down the drain. Pound down 20% in one year. Public services collapsing, Education system requiring re-investment, high taxes driving talent out. We can keep blaming our politicians but someone needs to prioritise where money goes - and no one is willing to talk about this

Yet we are spending hundreds of billions in supporting Ukraine in a war which has nothing to do with us. Yes we are morally supporting them but is there no amount which will be too much? We are paying both directly (through weapons and aid) and indirectly (through huge energy subsidies - last totalling north of £200bn) - we need to stop this spending, reduce energy prices, stop this craziness

How is this war something we can afford on the basis on principles and why aren't we more aggressively pushing for a negotiated settlement?

We cannot afford this. It sucks for Ukrainians but this is not UK's bill to foot.

AIBU?

What do you mean "anymore?" We weren't able to afford doing it in the first place.

No one wants to admit it. This is an endless, unwinnable war for Ukraine and it's crap, but that's true. All we're doing is prolonging it.

I also read somewhere that the UK has given more money to Ukraine than the whole of the EU combined. Ridiculous. I'm not saying give nothing and don't help-but why more than the EU? We're one country. That may have changed since I read it-but at one point, that was the case.

No one wants to admit it. This is an endless, unwinnable war for Ukraine and it's crap, but that's true. All we're doing is prolonging it.

No, it's just crap. Full stop. What we can't afford is for Russia to come out of this with any desire to do it again. By all means argue that the balance of financial support should look different, but what you've written here is just plain wrong.

Sorry but this is just wrong, unless of course you disagree with numerous knowledgeable military experts that is.

And as for money to Ukraine, numbers are roughly 37.2bn from the EU and 7.5pm from UK between Feb and Nov 2022 so again utter garbage that the Uk has contributed more than the EU institutions.

7.5bn that should be.

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I also read somewhere that the UK has given more money to Ukraine than the whole of the EU combined. Ridiculous.

Not true. Read the thread. Many excellent links and information posted about this.

Current order in absolute terms of money in aid US, Germany, France, UK, Italy. So pretty much in order of size of economy. It appears some other countries like Poland and the Baltic states have given more relative to their income than any where else.

Yes, and honestly, if people want to say the UK is paying too much they can do that without talking complete nonsense.

I’d say we are contributing well given that graph

But as discussed this war is happening in a proxy manner and we are so lucky to not be paying with more

@clairelouwho

I also read somewhere that the UK has given more money to Ukraine than the whole of the EU combined.

That type of claim was discussed this PM and there appears to be some confusion ovr the way some of the info is presented.

Some EU states are proving aid/finance via an EU scheme that sees that aid labelled coming from from "EU institutions", then you've also got money/aid/equipment going direct to Ukraine from those same EU members state governments...

However it works there are plenty of sources out there showing the sum of aid from the individual members states of the EU plus their individually directed contributions , or even just the sum of direct contributions from 2 or 3 of the larger EU member states, is greater than that given by the UK.

www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/12/9/infographic-who-provides-the-most-aid-to-ukraine

It also looks according to some sources as if Germany is about to overtake the UK as the targets single source of aid and assistance after the USA.

Yes. I did too. Quite unpleasant

UK has done well.... it was among the first and did a lot of military training too.

We ve lagged a bit on refugees but thats not surprising really ...surprised we didn't outsource to Rwanda.

@Autumnnewname ah thankyou MNHQ were quick on that one.

I think they might have been inundated by quite a few of us going 'oh fuck no.'

@JassyRadlett Thankyou... Yep the 2nd bite of the cherry got me...... i mean what were they thinking!!!

That's like saying that India didn't exist before 1948. Ukraine existed in some form before it was colonised by the Russians.

MNHQ has drunk the Koolaid then. There is ample, extensive, documented proof of the Neo-Nazi movement in Ukraine. It is, quite simply, anti-Semitic to deny this - you would be carrying water for Nazis and anti-Semites.

There is well documented neo nai movement in russia

Well if they are real people then why don't they pop up and tell us exactly what their views are. Surely their reasoning can withstand debate, no?

I mean, if we look at those who actually have posted then "idiots" seems to fit pretty well.

Does that mean all Ukranians are Neo nazis? I mean, there is ample, extensive documented proof of the Neo Nazi movement in the UK, are you a nazi anti-semite?

There is well documented neo nai movement in russia

Indeed there is. No-one has said otherwise.

Does that mean all Ukranians are Neo nazis?

Of course it doesn't. Why would you think that?

What about the civilians the Russians shot, do they get a vote?

i don't know, how about the civilians Ukraine shot? and do you think they'll give the vote to the Ukrainian men who were banned from leaving the country with their families, and forced into the army?

Neither Putin nor Zelenskyy would accept such an idea... have you not noticed their negotiating positions?