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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Parents of neurodivergent teenagers

91 replies

Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 02/01/2023 21:03

To expect support financially and physically...

Dd is nearly 20 and has adhd/autism and I'm feeling stuck with what to do.
She has always been quiet, has no 'real' friends (lots online) and she very rarely goes out other than with me or dh. She lies all the time even to our faces.
She attended college just before Covid happened so most of it was online and she hasn't done anything since, and lied her way through most of it, things like telling tutors we have no Internet when the only reason she hadn't submitted work is because she'd procrastinated.

She spends her days in her room which is a mess, sleeping in and staying up late.

I have tried to talk to her many times but she just cries and before now has even said 'I didn't ask to be born.'
She also seems to have high levels of anxiety.

She will reluctantly empty the dishwasher once a day (extremely slowly) and will leave anything with even the tiniest bit of food/mark on.
She doesn't do anything else and if I ask her to do something, she takes ages (like hours) and usually does it poorly.

I suggested she should contact the job centre in the hope they'd offer guidance/support in moving her life along as I am at a loss but they are doing nothing but she now has a monthly income for doing sweet FA.
Again, I am unsure how much bullsh@t she is telling them.
She gets a bus to appointments but will happily want a lift if she can get away with it. This is the only time she leaves the house without a parent.

Myself and dh both work full-time and I have a health condition. We also have a younger child (12)
She is very educated but opiniated and regularly clashes with dh although silently, they just avoid each other mostly but I feel stuck in the middle constantly trying to keep the peace, consider dd's mental health and improve things plus trying to keep myself well.
Honestly, it's hell but it's also impossible to work out whether it's just pure laziness or the adhd/autism and where to go next, she is so fragile.
Should I expect more from her? Financially and physically?
Any suggestions? Please be gentle

OP posts:
Onnabugeisha · 02/01/2023 23:50

Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 02/01/2023 23:39

I do have adhd too (diagnosed as an adult) and I'm demand avoidant too (something I can see in both my children)
I totally understand the difficulties and live the reality daily.
I also have a health condition and no amount of drive or passion helps when your body gives up
Adhd is only just becoming known more so in females so its a learning curve for everyone. I just thought I was a sh¡t adult

Show quote history

I meant more that you don’t have both ASD and ADHD (I do) like you suspect your DD has. Having both means where there is overlap, like executive functioning, the disability impact is amplified. Sorry to have been blunt, I guess I was a bit concerned about your “taking advantage” comment.

Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 02/01/2023 23:50

secondaryquandries · 02/01/2023 22:58

I think that university would be a good idea. A local university probably or a university with a lot of support available. It would gain her a degree, provide focus and support. Give her (and you) some time to think about possible careers.

Definitely this, some expectation and purpose with a bit of freedom would be good (for both of us) I think

OP posts:
Parrotid · 02/01/2023 23:51

What if you reframed it as a description? Not a label? Why do you go along with that anyway?

Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 02/01/2023 23:54

caravanbuckie · 02/01/2023 22:59

Should I expect more from her?

No, you should expect less. All the examples you give in the OP suggest that you think she should be able to do the things you mention her not doing. Online learning, her room, sleep etc. she may struggle with executive function and not be able to do these things, at least not without support. Neither of my autistic DC engaged in any online learning during Covid.

I don't want to seem critical, I'm not trying to be, I just know what it's like to be that young adult who isn't coping.

But I am concerned about the alternative... spending her life gaming whilst mum and dad provide everything isn't good for her.
If I don't expect anything, she will literally do nothing

OP posts:
blueshoes · 02/01/2023 23:56

Onnabugeisha · 02/01/2023 22:25

Those are the wrong A levels to do tech/software/game design.
Could that be part of the issue? Might have to pay for her to get a BTEC if you want to help her pursue what she really wants to do.

Show quote history

OP, your dd is a smart cookie. Since she is arty and likes drawing, she could do a foundation course in a university. I believe many of them are free. She could use that year to find out which creative area she is interested in and then build a portfolio with a view to applying for a creative degree. Often art universities are relaxed on UCAS grades (but your dd will have no problem with that anyway) and will choose their students based on the portfolio. So it is no problem she does not have a creative subject in her A Levels, so long as she has a creative and artistic flair and interest to drive her during the Foundation year.

My dd has autism and most likely ADHD. Going to Uni (she is studying Computer Animation, a close cousin of Computer Gaming) and living in Student Accommodation has been the making of her. She is much more confident.

Ok, I don't know whether it will lead to a decent job but if not, my dd does not have to pay back her uni loan. The self esteem is what Dd needed and she needed to do it away from us in a course she enjoys to find herself.

It is better for your dd not to fall into a fug as it can take years to come out of it. If you can persuade your dd to get a diagnosis (not essential but it unlocks extra funding Disabled Student Allowance or DSA, up to 20K) and get onto a course she enjoys, it is a step forward.

byebye2022 · 02/01/2023 23:57

My eldest struggled when school finished, the routines of everyday were gone.
We wrote out daily plans of what she needed to do each day. This involved a chore, leaving the house for a reason (even just a shop for milk, a coffee with friend, a bike ride to her nans down the road), and applying for a job.

We also encouraged her to look at courses, and apply for small jobs, and apprenticeships.

And I'm sorry if this sounds blunt, but ASD and ADHD are medical diagnoses and therefore while you might think she has it, you can't confirm that. It has to be a doctor and she needs to start on the pathway to that.

Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 02/01/2023 23:57

Onnabugeisha · 02/01/2023 23:22

Why is she anti-label? Would she be ashamed if she were diagnosed? Where does that sentiment arise from?

Show quote history

She has very strong opinions on labels in anything...gender, sexuality, neurodiversity, disability
No clue where its from from but she doesn't want to wear any of them 🤷🏼‍♀️

OP posts:
Parrotid · 03/01/2023 00:01

Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 02/01/2023 23:57

She has very strong opinions on labels in anything...gender, sexuality, neurodiversity, disability
No clue where its from from but she doesn't want to wear any of them 🤷🏼‍♀️

Show quote history

The refusal to seek assessment IS going to hold her back. She has (probably) got a significant disability. As her carer you need to force her hand on that, to allow her to access medication and support. Until she does this she will just be categorised as awkward/lazy. Is she happy with those labels?!

Onnabugeisha · 03/01/2023 00:22

Parrotid · 03/01/2023 00:01

The refusal to seek assessment IS going to hold her back. She has (probably) got a significant disability. As her carer you need to force her hand on that, to allow her to access medication and support. Until she does this she will just be categorised as awkward/lazy. Is she happy with those labels?!

Show quote history

I agree with this, you need to convince her to seek medical help. You’re even labelling her as “unmotivated” and “no drive” and “taking advantage [of benefits]” “opinionated” “lazy” “fragile” and you love her dearly! Imagine what strangers will be labelling her as…

ADHD, ASD…these are not labels that denigrate but liberate.

lollipoprainbow · 03/01/2023 00:29

ditherydotty · 02/01/2023 21:29

I had to reply, sadly not with advise, as your post resonated so strongly with how much this could be me in 10 years with my own dd (asd and I believe pda although they don't diagnose pda where I am). My dd is only 10 but acts the same as you've explained your dd is. Especially the "why did you born me"

It's so difficult, I expect now she's 20 and classed as an adult the support is limited. The job centre staff could refer her to a program that may help (depends on your area). Personally I would be taking some form of financial contribution but I'd likely put it away for her future. Also a rota for family chores so she knows what's expected?
Sorry can be much help Flowers

Same, reading this reminds me of my dd10. Hates her life, has no friends and wants to sleep in, stay in her room and go to bed late. Loathes school. No life at all it terrifies me what her future will look like.

DariaMorgendorffer · 03/01/2023 00:31

"The refusal to seek assessment IS going to hold her back. She has (probably) got a significant disability. As her carer you need to force her hand on that, to allow her to access medication and support. Until she does this she will just be categorised as awkward/lazy. Is she happy with those labels?!"

Completely agree with this.

Adhdsucks · 03/01/2023 00:33

@lollipoprainbow if you’re willing and able to fight for your DD and support her, help her access anything at all that can help her then it doesn’t need to be anything like how you’re worrying it might turn out.

Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 00:38

hourbyhour101 · 02/01/2023 23:12

So I'm gonna jump in and say just my personal experience as I have asd and I'm on the highly functioning scale.

Find something she laser focuses on would be my recommendation. I liked tech and money, so I went and got a degree (a 1st - not that it matters tbh) and now I'm in v v well paid job. Own my own house and stables (along with 3 horses and one very bad tempered donkey). But for me it was about knowing how to get to end of the tunnel, I needed to have it mapped out and I was told at a young age, growing extremely poor (probably helped, you want to earn good money first you need to go to school, go to college, degree, internships, work work work. I always always told I would be at a disadvantage having asd but actually I consider it my super power, but that made me work harder. I was never allowed to use it as a reason not to keep going.

It can be done but you have to be fairly ridge with rules and structure. If you haven't been particularly stricter with her re house rules growing up it's a bit of a sudden fear shift to go ahh your a adult now. Same actually with career stuff or even socialisation ect. That's a shock to NT folk let alone someone who's ND. Patterns we learn in patterns.

Break things into smaller chunks, simple tasks may seem easy to you but if not broken down it's easy to get overwhelmed and give up .

Have a look at failure to launch in Google. You might see some common patterns.

Obviously this is just my lived experience so will vary greatly person to person but given the right conditions people with asd can thrive. Wish washy just won't work imo because who would do chores when they have always been done for them before. There's no incentive (and emotive trains NT people would use just don't apply the same way here) esp if she's not got many friends so hasn't grown her empathy bone (and that's grown through pain and hardship iMO)

Also tech/iT seems to attract a certain crowd shall we say, your Dd may very well be suited to it, it pays well but pretty cut throat. Tends to be less about the people and more about the mechanics of things which is suited to people on the spectrum. Less room for ducking up basically.

Thanks for this insight too, very useful
I'm not particularly strict, both children are lovely natured and calm. To be fair strict doesn't work anyway, not for me either but maybe expectations are woolly. I'd just like a little help once in a while
My job means I barely get a rest so by finish time I'm pooped.
She isn't motivated by money so isn't bothered about a job so definitely need to work to her strengths and passion

OP posts:
Parrotid · 03/01/2023 00:45

I’m observing that all the posts pushing for assessment and diagnosis are being studiously ignored by the OP.

Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 00:46

byebye2022 · 02/01/2023 23:22

So she has no diagnosis of either ASD or ADHD? She managed to get though school and did GCSEs and Alevels with no support? I would suggest that if she managed that, she can do more than she is right now. She is a teenager too before her diagnosis.

DD1 has ASD and a chronic pain disorder. She did get UC for a bit but we also set clear boundaries of what we wanted from her. She had to pay 20% or £200 in house keeping, which ever was lowest. She got a job after a few months. We also have chores. When she's moaning about them I remind her that if she wants to do her own washing, shopping, cleaning and cooking she is more than welcome. We have a list of the whole household jobs and the bills. How much work it is to run a house. It's a good visual aid for her.

She is highly intelligent and very academic but my concern is that now an adult with less guidance and structure, she is using more of her executive functioning for simple tasks leaving her limited for anything else
The other thing to consider is the whole teenage thing, she's not silly so is she playing on it or is it genuine. How can you tell?

We have a list of the whole household jobs and the bills. How much work it is to run a house. - this feels like a good idea for all of us 👍

OP posts:
Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 00:49

I’m observing that all the posts pushing for assessment and diagnosis are being studiously ignored by the OP.

Hardly...I've replied to a few and I'm trying to reply in order and navigate my first ever MN post plus be ready for RL tomorrow
Cheers

OP posts:
Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 00:55

Adhdsucks · 02/01/2023 23:25

This may not be helpful but I just wanted to post as I’ve been the teen DD with ADHD. I wasn’t diagnosed at the time though my parents just thought I was a horrible, lazy person. The relationship I had with my mum was terrible, she took everything so personally and even though I was shit to live with, looking back I can’t see how I could have been any better with none of us realising there was something wrong. So it’s great that you do know and you sound like a lovely caring Mum so your DD is lucky to have you.

It’s hard being different as a teen especially if you’re lonely.

My local council runs employability type courses for people with any disabilities/learning difficulties. It’s so many weeks of paid work experience with a qualification at the end. Do you know if yours does anything similar?

Thanks for this, I feel she is lonely and not happy generally.
I do believe parenting with the knowledge of adhd/autism means I approach things differently and it makes for a much calmer life but it's tough. We are effectively a household of NDs trying to navigate life and that's before the outside world.
Typical example, eldest hates touch, youngest needs it 🤣🤣

OP posts:
Idonotcareforcarrots · 03/01/2023 01:09

My children are adults now but one of my sons had ADHD diagnosed as a child and one was diagnosed with BPD as a teenager . Your daughter sounds like my one with BPD, very intelligent but didn’t want to go to University struggled through a college course well below their ability and failed the course for not completing course work. The lying was off the scale and in the end they left home and got a flat with the help of a young persons service. After many years of not working they were supported/forced into first voluntary and then paid work by the job centre. They actually now work from home ( call centre type job) live their best life online and very rarely leave their flat but they seem reasonably happy and actually we have a good relationship now. I do keep trying to push them gently to be more involved in the world but they chose not to and as an adult it’s their choice. My adult son with ADHD is actually very different and lives his life on fast forward, he’s very impulsive gets into all sorts of bother and is a constant worry to us, he doesn’t live at home either. He has quite recently gone back on ADHD medication after refusing to take it for many years and of course there is no way you can force any adult to take medication.

Felicity42 · 03/01/2023 01:15

Is there a drama group locally?
She might like getting involved with that.

Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 01:38

IdisagreeMrHochhauser · 02/01/2023 23:29

That's me too. I'm about to turn 46 and my life exhausts me so much - I do work - that doing the dishwasher is sometimes beyond me too. Do some reading on executive dysfunction and then help her to break tasks down into really simple and manageable steps. Asking her to just do x is too much. She literally needs step by step instructions and maybe them written down as if she's anything like me she won't form habits however many times she repeats it.

I'm not an idiot. I have a degree from Cambridge. But autism and ADHD are real disabilities.

Me too! Totally understand the struggle and agree it's very real.
I'm constantly exhausted, the house is a mess and I'm just about managing work.
If I leave her to her own devices, she gets up about 2pm, has dinner, takes an hour to eat a meal then does the dishwasher, back to her room til tea them comes down about 11pm for a snack til 1/2am (I'm often in bed by then)
Trouble is, if I didn't battle every single minute of every day with my own adhd whilst balancing two children's neurodivergence and their mental health alongside maintaining a marriage we'd never get anywhere 😔
I'm definitely not suggesting anyone is an idiot at all. It really is hard x

OP posts:
Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 01:42

Parrotid · 02/01/2023 23:33

I think you’re going to have to FORCE medical intervention here. It’s no good for her to go along with this “doesn’t want a label” nonsense. She’s wrecking her life and holding back yours. She wants to live in your house under your care? Then she needs to take some responsibility right now. Meds for depressive states and ADHD can be utterly life changing.

How can I force medical intervention? She is an adult and has her own rights, sorry but as much as I feel it would help its not my decision to make.

OP posts:
Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 01:43

She doesn't want any diagnosis 🤷🏼‍♀️

OP posts:
Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 01:45

This is a reply to a PP whose dd got a temp job and it worked out well for her

OP posts:
Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 01:46

OriginalUsername2 · 02/01/2023 23:39

Get her doing something that will earn her a lot of money (STEM!) (But not gaming!) so she can solve a lot of her future problems with it. A cleaner, a personal assistant, a therapist, etc.

She may not know what her she wants yet but her future self will definitely appreciate financial security, choices and options.

Have inspiring talks with her about what life she can create for herself.

Great thanks will definitely talk to her
Positive options ftw

OP posts:
Original poster
Stuckinthemiddle2003 · 03/01/2023 01:50

Onnabugeisha · 02/01/2023 23:50

I meant more that you don’t have both ASD and ADHD (I do) like you suspect your DD has. Having both means where there is overlap, like executive functioning, the disability impact is amplified. Sorry to have been blunt, I guess I was a bit concerned about your “taking advantage” comment.

Show quote history

Thanks for clarifying, got what you mean now.
I understand the executive functioning issues etc and I meant it's hard to know if she is taking advantage at times or if it is genuinely difficult in that moment

OP posts: