Ambulance strike is disgraceful?

[somethingdifferenttoday]

I just read this on bbc news, "Unions say life-threatening callouts will continue to be responded to over the next 24 hours but some urgent calls, for example for late-stage labour or a fall in the home, might not be answered."

Is it just me who thinks this is disgraceful?

Late stage labour at home or an elderly person laying with a broken hip ARE emergencies! I'm not sure how people in a caring profession can strike knowing these calls will go unanswered.

The unions talk about the backlog, paramedics stuck outside hospitals in ambulances unable to unload and go back out on the road but then admit they are striking for more pay rather than as a protest about that. The average salary of ambulance staff of £47,000 and a 4% pay rise isn't enough they claim but if they are given a pay rise, they will stop striking.

I think they do deserve more money (we all do with inflation) but I can't get past them supposedly being in a caring profession but taking steps that WILL cause extra deaths regardless.

I work in the private sector and have had zero pay rise. If I went on strike nobody would die and I'd be fired. This approach is abusing the critical position of their roles. I hope they are not given a pay rise as it will just demonstrate that blackmail works to other public sector workers and we will have even more strikes.

YABU = I support them striking
YANBU = I agree, it's disgraceful behaviour from a caring profession

We need an urgent care service that can be paid for by patients and ambulance service (some exist in London) for those that can afford to pay, pay and those that can't have the usual A&E route. That would relieve the system to some degree. The private sector would have to step up and provide for all cases similar to the NHS. That would be a start.
Gov could make the upgrades tax free with incentatives to expand the private medical sector.
At the moment all cases are sent to A&E but with a few changes this would help.

@Thereisnolight
60% of Irish population has private health insurance, 90% of French
20% of British. Wake up!

Disingenuous rubbish, these are state schemes, not AXA PPP & cover pre existing conditions which no UK inurer will & they cover cancer and chronic, which good ole AXA wont either, then there is the cost.

I might as well argue that 75% of Brits have Insurance too because they pay National Insurance.

Health insurance doesn’t mean that you have to pay to have your sick child seen. It means that your sick child will be seen faster because many other children have taken themselves off the public waiting list.

No, they are VHI and many other PRIVATE insurers.

So Venetia, you are angry at the government for not sorting out the issues in the NHS for the 12 years they've been in power?

I mean, you acknowledge that there are issues, you have presented solutions.

You are angry about unnecessary deaths potentially caused by strikes.

So you are presumably angry about unnecessary deaths caused by the government doing fuck-all to address the problems in the NHS?

It matters quite a lot actually. You can't just shout words like "reform" and "overhaul" into the wind and think that's a solution to the massive recruitment and retention crisis in the Health service.

Why would paying for Ambulance/Urgent care create more Paramedics and relieve pressures on Social Care?

Takes up to 5 years to train as a paramedic in a specialist role and 3 otherwise, where are the people hanging around suitably qualified who want to start an apprenticeship or degree course and who will train them?

Where will private sector find the medical staff for this extra work? (3 guesses)

@Thereisnolight I could write a dissertation on why monetising health does not serve patients well - and if you look at the USA (and I guarantee that is the model our govt are eyeing up) do you really believe that everyone gets the quality and parity of treatment? I have good knowledge of the private sector and can assure you it's not the wonderful service you think it is.

“Ambulance unions have made 'a conscious decision to inflict harm on patients' by walking out of their jobs in a bitter dispute over pay, the Health Secretary said today.” What a cunt.

Hypocritical cunt, too. He's happy to inflict harm on patients by failing to fund the NHS adequately.

YABVU, OP.

Genuinely, I don't see this as a party issue at all.
It would be a disaster regardless due to the pandemic and cost of living crisis. Labour would be on the line of fire in the same way.

I am sorry you always want to bring it back to politics but to me the NHS transcends politics.
My grandfather died waiting for an ambulance under a Labour government, I don't blame them, it was winter and they did their best.

It would be better if we stopped making political capital out of the deaths of people and started considering ACTUAL solutions.

Nope i used to work in France, your talking out your arse.

Charging for GP appointments?
What, everyone? Of every age?
Including those over 65's that use it most? Or will the same groups be exempt leaving the cost to the squeezed middle.

A very very quick Google shows this

Charging for GP appointments?
What, everyone? Of every age?
Including those over 65's that use it most? Or will the same groups be exempt leaving the cost to the squeezed middle.

I am 64 and haven't been to the GP for about 20 years apart from those covid jabs we were practically forced to have

If their responsibilities are so grave, surely they deserve to be paid enough to live?

It would be better if we stopped making political capital out of the deaths of people

Venetia, you are the one on this thread who has been ranting about nurses murdering people by going on strike, and yet when unnecessary deaths due to government mismanagement are pointed out, then that is 'making political capital out of the deaths of people'?

You cannot have it both ways. If deaths due to understaffing on strike days are the fault of nurses (as you claim, I disagree, I would say that the strikes are also the fault of the government due to a refusal to negotiate), then deaths due to understaffing on non-strike days are the fault of the government in charge, who have allowed the NHS to get to this dreadful state.

Why are you so keen to defend the government's appalling record?

I repeat: what about Steve Barclay refusing to discuss pay at all when he met with the RCN? Sat in a room opposite Pat Cullen, who'd already said the strikes could be called off if pay talks resumed, and arrogantly stonewalled her. That is not the actions of a man who gives a shit about the lives that could be lost today. Where's your fury for him?

I repeat: What about Steve Barclay refusing to discuss pay at all when he met with the RCN? Sat in a room opposite Pat Cullen, who'd already said the strikes could be called off if pay talks resumed, and arrogantly stonewalled her. That is not the actions of a man who gives a shit about the lives that could be lost today. Where's your fury for him?

Why not give St John’s ambulance a call to see if you can lend a hand during the strike?
YABU 🙄

Yep. If i'm struggling to feed my own family due to cost of living, and dont want my taxes to rase for someone else's 'need' for a 19% pay rise, then go ahead and call me selfish.

There is already an ambulance crisis - see the other thread.

The whole of the public sector is in crisis. That’s what happens when you underfund everything for years and these jobs no longer pay a competitive salary. It will get worse. The NHS especially - there are noises coming from front benchers about moving to an American model. Same will happen across the board, schools, health, social care - all up for grabs.

100% this.

Everyone blames the Government, fair enough and I guess they need to raise taxes but spending is out of control.

Since 2020 the amount spent on NHS per head has increased from £1000 to around £3500 now.

How should this be funded - the average person needs to fund from their taxes, their own £3500 each year plus extra for non earners including children and pensioners. With more and more pensioners, it will only get worse.

In the 1970s the Labour Party increased taxes on the wealthy so many of the left and the tax take remained the same. Its not that easy.

I want to retain the NHS as a backstop, but think we should embrace private insurance to pay for private care, private GPs and ambulances as it may reduce the load on the NHS and the amount we have to pay in over the longer term. I don't know what else we can do.

Since 2020 the amount spent on NHS per head has increased from £1000 to around £3500 now.

Dunno if you noticed but we had a little bit of a pandemic in that time.

YABU

Without the strike people are dying waiting for ambulances. Or dying in ambulances waiting to be admitted.

Earlier this year DDs friend lost her mum to a heart attack. They waited 2 hrs for the ambulance. The mum was 40! She left behind a husband and 3 school age daughters.

Paramedics are striking BECAUSE of this. Without the strikes it will just become the norm.