Ambulance strike is disgraceful?

[somethingdifferenttoday]

I just read this on bbc news, "Unions say life-threatening callouts will continue to be responded to over the next 24 hours but some urgent calls, for example for late-stage labour or a fall in the home, might not be answered."

Is it just me who thinks this is disgraceful?

Late stage labour at home or an elderly person laying with a broken hip ARE emergencies! I'm not sure how people in a caring profession can strike knowing these calls will go unanswered.

The unions talk about the backlog, paramedics stuck outside hospitals in ambulances unable to unload and go back out on the road but then admit they are striking for more pay rather than as a protest about that. The average salary of ambulance staff of £47,000 and a 4% pay rise isn't enough they claim but if they are given a pay rise, they will stop striking.

I think they do deserve more money (we all do with inflation) but I can't get past them supposedly being in a caring profession but taking steps that WILL cause extra deaths regardless.

I work in the private sector and have had zero pay rise. If I went on strike nobody would die and I'd be fired. This approach is abusing the critical position of their roles. I hope they are not given a pay rise as it will just demonstrate that blackmail works to other public sector workers and we will have even more strikes.

YABU = I support them striking
YANBU = I agree, it's disgraceful behaviour from a caring profession

But they were not on strike yesterday.

So what you describe is a reason for the strike: chronically underfunded and not attracting new staff for the wages offered.

People shouldn't be calling ambulances for a funny turn, they should either get a lift or a taxi, ambulances are for people that can't be moved, this is part of the problem.

'Because people who strike for better conditions are fighting for their conditions but also bringing up the lowest common denominator so conditions improve for everyone.'

'So conditions improve for everyone'. Except those who require first aid and an urgent trip to hospital today that is, then you're on your own.

I think people who think they’d get a much shorter wait for an ambulance on a non strike day are being either deliberately obtuse or really fucking naive.

@Snowy6 And its the government who have brought it to that situation.

I'm only here typing this post because I once got CPR'd by a paramedic (years ago). Yes, there probably will be an excess of preventable deaths today. And if the government don't start paying ambulance drivers and nurses more and improving their conditions, there'll be an excess of preventable deaths indefinitely. They aren't slaves, and they can't pay their bills in claps.

People who suggest we should be grateful to bankers have awfully fucking short memories.

From this thread it seems that people call ambulances willynilly without considering getting to hospital under their own steam

This isn't a zero sum game of household spending.
While I appreciate the graph, what you've missed is that it's an ageing population - so there needs to be more spend per head now. And in fact government spending is not keeping up with demand. Also did you miss the bit about a pandemic and waiting list backlog?

If you chronically underfund social care and the NHS you are not managing a budget. You are leaving people on waiting lists to get worse and cost more. And live in pain and stress. If you don't fund social care people will be more likely to have falls or have to bed block in hospital. Costing more.

If you pay people poorly to work in terrible conditions you will pay more again in hiring and training.

It's not about saving money. It's about spending on what's important. The health of everyone, knowing if an elderly relative needs treatment or I do it is available timely and staff are well rewarded and not overworked. That is my number one priority. Surely it's everyone's?
It's not the thing to economise on.

@user18596463 There will always be a minority who call an ambulance (or the police) "willy nilly". Doesn't mean they send one.

You're an absolutely peach, aren't you? On what basis would you make them Band 4s? That is, the ones who aren't, and plenty are. Those in the control room are band 3/4, I believe, and that is a skilled and highly stressful job even if you are on the end of the phone.

Also I think there is a common misconception about ambulance staff. They are not "drivers". Any member of an ambulance crew is trained to deal with almost everything they come across. There are some things only paramedics (degree qualified) can do, but most things an EAT (Emergency Ambulance Technician) is also trained to handle.

It's not something anyone with a driving licence can do.

Brown / Labour bailed out banks anyway, so yeh if people want to blame them go for it.

YABU

Stupid newspaper headline today saying '...but we can't have any Fun...' because of ambulance strikes. If you want to prioritise Fun, either support the strikers or pay for your own private healthcare.

Then as someone who works in primary care you I can tell you you are in the absolute minority.

Does it matter who bailed out the banks if the result is that it cost the country hundreds of billions and people are now claiming that bankers are the ones keeping the country afloat?

Bollocks.

@Whatafool123 they are
Call handlers band 3, dispatch band 4 when I was there

The benefits alone are better than many other occupations. Full pay for 6 months if off sick then half pay for another 6months (topped up with esa), the pensions, the holiday allowance, the OH support they get WHY do you think conditions are good? It's to improve retention via several different means. Firstly, if you get sacked after having a couple off sick, the amount of money and effort expended in recruiting and training a replacement is huge. It makes much more sense financially and logistically to take the short term hit, make sure someone is well enough and have them back at full capacity. But if you work behind the till at Tesco, no offence but you're cheaper and easier to replace, recruit and train. And why give people OH support? It's so they are able to PERFORM, eg operate effectively to save lives. Holiday allowance? Everyone has a stat minimum. If you don't like it join a union and get it for yourself.

YABU

Tory voters voted for a party that have a history of underfunding, dismantling and selling public services and of doing everything in their power to transfer state wealth into private pockets.

If you voted tory you voted for this and if you genuinely didn't know that I'd ask you to stop voting completely in futur for the good of the country.

Exactly. There was a harrowing thread yesterday, by a poster who couldn't get an ambulance for their aunt who had broken their hip. That was yesterday, before the strike, so that's a 365 day a year problem in our health service as it stands. If you worked as a paramedic and you knew that every day of the year there'll be elderly people in pain that you can't get to for hours and hours, what would you do? Just continue to put up with it, accept that's the way it is, and just do your job as best you can? Or would you protest about this absolutely shameful situation in any way that you can, in the most effective way that you could? And those who say this strike isn't about conditions, it's about pay, how else would you suggest we get the needed staff into the NHS? We don't live in a dictatorship, we can't force anyone to work within our health service, they need to be persuaded. A pay rise will improve care, as we'll hopefully stop hemorrhaging staff. We might well need to do more than just improve pay, but it's a start.

I am sorry to say but I graduated into a Blair/Brown government who strongly encouraged the financial sector to flourish in this country. Quite a few fellow students who had studied medicine ended up as bankers under that Labour government.
People in this country voted for Brexit and voted for the Tories, overwhelmingly so quite recently. We all need to blame ourselves not some weird Tory concept.
The whole Western world became too dependent on the financial markets and now tech billionaires and their antics. The energy crisis and housing crisis has also been decades in the making.

Like I say I don’t care if people are critical of their own party. Go for it.

It doesn’t solve the issue of tax receipts now and which sectors bring higher funds.

And King Hammurabi of Babylon or The Duke of Zhou would have chosen a different approach too.

Doesn't change the fact that Torys are all about small state so voting for Tory governments will result in underfunded and failing public services.

You cannot blame Tory voters for this.

they voted this shit show in for 12 year, Tory’s are deliberately trashing NHS

Ok but what about those that don’t have anyone to take them to hospital? What about those elderly people like my mother, who lives alone. Would you really expect someone who’s nearly 80 to go in a taxi with suspected heart attack or stroke? Would a taxi driver even want that responsibility.
Yes there are an awful lot of people who abuse the system, and I’m all for charging people who do this. But tax payers pay for this service, and it’s unacceptable to not have it.
Yet again it’s the innocent who will suffer.
If really is that bad for the health care workers then nothing is stopping them from leaving, there’s plenty of jobs going in Hospitality and retail.