Kier starmer! He hates strivers!

[Bucketheadbucketbum]

He wants to introduce a policy to put up the cost of school fees 10 to 15%. This is a tax on hard-working parents! We slave away cutting cots everywhere living hand to mouth to try and improve our childrens future . Live in an average house average area 1 shit car no holidays work like a dog to get our kids through. We are easing the burden on the state system by choosing independent schools. We're not sending them to Eton paid by our trust fund! Why does he want to punish strivers! Tax the energy companies! So disappointed. We need a new political party. What's the point in trying to better your future.

I agree with him. The sooner it happens the better. Private schools are businesses.

And your suggestion that your striving is superior to that of those who could not get anywhere near affording private schools is thoroughly offensive.

This.

Try reading this, which looks at some of the claims about the potential consequences www.newstatesman.com/quickfire/2022/11/daily-mail-private-schools-education-class-labour

Spoiler alert: they're mostly bollocks.

OP - having a two tier education for children depending how much their parents earn is discrimination. It is morally wrong - and it’s discriminative to suggest parents who can’t afford private school aren’t strivers.

You don’t help anybody in state system. by sending kids to private school - you help your kids. You help yourself by feeling like a better parent. Don’t pretend it’s a magnanimous act.

Here you go: www.thenationalnews.com/world/uk-news/2022/11/28/private-schools-vital-amid-uk-charity-status-row/

Labour claims the £1.7 billion in savings — other estimates put it at £3 billion — would be used to recruit 6,500 teachers, as well as give children access to mental health counsellors and career advisers.
There are currently 544,000 children being taught in the private sector, but during his budget statement earlier this month, Chancellor Jeremy Hunt stated that Labour’s charity status proposal would lead to less wealthy parents sending 90,000 pupils into the state sector.

Please tell me where and how - and how quickly they will be recruiting these 6,500 teachers and how quickly they will be implementing the positive changes you're all hoping will happen.

As for Rolls Royce's - I live in a fairly well to do middle class area with plenty of private schools mixed in amongst the state and I can assure you I have never seen a Rolls Royce.

The parents are NHS doctors, vets, and small business owners. A fair number do drive Tesla's because they offer a tax break to business owners. Business owners who work hard employing other hard working people. A lot of them also drive battered up old cars because they cannot afford a new one because they are choosing to invest in their children's education.

Hope it happens. Private schools are toxic for society. Standards should be better for everyone, not just the wealthy. Taxing those schools raises funds to help the rest of us and that’s fair game.

Excellent comment

If they are charities, there aren't any profits going into anyone's pocket.

Quite. I was one of those deprived a decent education despite being pretty bright and above average in all areas. I just couldn’t do the exam. The education I received was incredibly dumbed down. I think the standards are now a lot higher. But this was a time, where ofsted did not exist and there was zero accountability. I was only allowed to take 5 O levels, the rest CSE’s as the funding wasn’t there.

The school I went to is ofsted inadequate now but I’m sure is far better than when I went there. I always said any child of mine would go there only over my dead body. Bullying and violence was rife. 50/100 kids smoking on school grounds at breaks. Kicking someone’s head in was a literal term. Misogyny and inappropriate sexual touching was rife. It was seen as a compliment for the boys to stand just outside the door and touch us up as we left the room. No one complained. That would have meant immediate ostracism. The maths teacher spent at least 1/3 of the lessons chatting resulting in parts of the curriculum not being taught. A levels were a massive struggle for me due to a chasm of lost education, catching up a life long endeavour.

Goodness this is embarrassing OP. Private school parent here who also happens to work in the actual charity sector with children who are severely disadvantaged.
I think it is an utter insult that private schools have charitable status. They aren’t charities and as someone who knows MANY private school parents, I haven’t met one yet on the breadline- and actually poor.
Worst case scenario- some parents opt back into the state sector. They aren’t all going to. Those that do will potentially drive up the standards in the state sector. The rest will just tighten their belts.

Standards? Unless it’s the top 5-10% academic selective ones honestly they are not worth the money. Unless of course you are looking for the time consumed in chasing ball with stick. I think they sort of time wasting brings the standards down as they have to be chartered around in a shuttle to play other similar places of learning. Seriously if your kids are average or bright they should still do well in state. I can not comment on SEN, this varies from school to school.

Oh and before someone says ‘what about the nursery’s!!, in my experience the children getting them are NOT the disadvantaged children living in poverty, but those of well educated but poorly paid parents who know how the system works! Not Jayden and Caiden from the teenage single mother living on benefits 🙈

Bursaries!

SparklyMistleToes

I refer you ReginaVagina’s post up thread re how the 90,000 figure came about. Excellent article.

The figure is based on income rather than wealth. They haven’t taken into account assets or extended family wealth.

The Rolls Royce example, whilst true, was unusual- only one knob head had one. However, most had second homes. Many had more than two homes (bringing in rent). Most had expensive cars and bigger than needed houses in nice areas. Lots were doctors, lawyers, dentists etc but all had assets. I can’t think of a single family from our year who couldn’t keep their child in, even it meant making some sacrifices.

It is clear that the 90,000 figure is a badly calculated estimate that is unlikely happen.

My dd went to a private school due to SEND. I still support this policy. Private schools are not charities and all state schools should have the funding to provide a good education for all pupils including SEND pupils. It's a very sensible policy.

Anyone objecting to this should study some of the annual accounts of private schools- many are sitting with millions of pounds in reserves. They aren’t poor by any means.

Of course 90k children won't be 'forced' into the state sector; what rubbish. The impact on fees would be unlikely to be more than 10%, after claiming back VAT and cutting some costs

Surely 90% of any school's running costs are teachers salaries, which don't have VAT on them. So charging VAT would be pretty close to a 20% increase?

What are schools currently spending half their income on, that results in 10% of fees going in VAT to the government, even before this change?

I would guess utilities and maintaining lots of old buildings and extensive grounds and facilities.

If you're worried about fee increases I'd buckle your seat belt now. I imagine due to energy, staff wage increases, increased cost of food and everything that private school fees are going to go up significantly in the next few years. The lack of charitable status is only one issue.

You do realise that the extra VAT that would be raised would be used to pay for public services?

Like extra teachers for kids whose parents can't afford private schooling?

This isn't about aspiration, it's about having the funding to meet the basics for everyone.

We have homeless people on the street, but yes, private schools charging 40k a year need a tax free status ... 🙄

Starmer's "we'll get £1.7bn to invest in schools" very much reminds of the Boris&co "after Brexit we'll have an extra £350mil a week for the NHS". It's all populist bollocks.

The best way to get rid of private schooling is to make state schooling so good that there is no demand for a private alternative.

Diddums.

I thought that studies on this topic indicated that adding VAT onto school fees would cost the state more than it would generate?