Child suffering - no doctor's appointments

[cofingalthetime]

So a friend's little boy aged 3 had a cold that hasn't gotten better - he has a chesty cough, and his eyes are very very sore with green gunk - obviously conjunctivitis. She just cannot get a doctor's appointment. Last night she rang 111 and they said they would send an ambulance, but it would take 6 hours so she took him to A&E but after 5 hours, without even seeing a triage nurse, she brought him home again. On the phone to the doc again this morning, and no appointments. I've just seen the little boy - he's totally listless lying on the sofa, his eyes glued together, breathing sounds awful and his cough is terrible. He just needs some antibiotics? She tried the pharmacist but he would only give her a cough medicine. My friend herself sounds terrible, with an awful cough and she looks terrible, I think she has a chest infection. This must be being duplicated across the whole country - I can imagine people ending up in hospital with pneumonia because they couldnt see a doctor. What should she do... I said maybe go to the surgery with the child so they can see how sick he is...?

She needs to go to a walk in centre/urgent care centre and stick it out. It’s awful but that poor child needs medical attention. I had the same problem last week, couldn’t get a gp appointment at all and ended up with pneumonia, please don’t take a chance on a child.

She needs to go back to A&E and shouldn't have left. I know wait times are long but he would've been in the best place.

Regarding the conjunctivitis did the pharmacist not give her eye drops? My DS (3) had conjunctivitis and I could buy over the counter eye drops which worked a treat.

Poor bubba feeling so poorly! It's so scary but she must go back with everything you've described is worrying. Not a health professional but that looks like a list of red flags.

I can't believe she left A&E, if he's that ill.

@HattyBatty oh dear, I can just imagine this happening all over the country and people with "simple" chest infections, not being able to see a doctor and ending up in a very bad state. My friend herself needs to see a gp - she looks awful. Everyone will say 'oh it could be viral' - but again she has been sick on and off for weeks, and is just getting worse. Her cough sounds like a coal miner's

They will give them out @cofingalthetime Just go in and say they're for an adult if they ask.

Go down to your gp surgery and explain she cannot get through on the phone, however if she was in the queue first thing at 8am I'm surprised there wasn't anything free for her child

Did you see the post above where the mum went to 3 different pharmacies and they wouldn't give her the drops? Is that just a case of 'jobsworth', it makes me think it could be.
Yes I didn't think she should have left A&E. I think she felt terrible herself, but her husband was with her, so she could have gone home and left him there with her son.

What a pitiful situation. All those saying that she should have stuck it out in the A&E after 5 hours wait! I really feel for the mother. Being ill herself and expected to wait for infinity hours in the A&E.
the nhs is just not fit for purpose

the nhs is just not fit for purpose That's the government's deliberate choice, but it is still not sensible to walk out before getting medical help.

I would advise all parents mentally prepare for a long wait if they need to go though - take food, blanket, a cushion, toys etc.

OP you seem obsessed with getting antibiotics.

Why? They don't instantly cure everything and don't work at all on viral infections. Conjunctivitis is just when a cold spreads to your eyes.

Antibiotics are becoming less effective because we use them far too much. We can't afford to keep using them to shorten the duration of children's winter bugs - they need to be saved for life threatening infections.

Not RTFT but has she rung the GP and demanded an emergency appointment? I have done this twice for my own children in the past.

I would tell them they need to make a space to see him cos ive got a sick child that needs seeing today.

But she shouldve waited in a&e really.

I agree Op, it’s ridiculous. I feel so sorry for this child and mum, but agree they shouldn’t have left the hospital. I’ve been diagnosed with a chest infection today myself, over the phone, as it’s been 6 weeks and I’m still worsening. I did go to see someone after 3 weeks who listened to my chest for a few seconds and said it’s likely viral. I have had pneumonia twice and been hospitalised, I truly don’t go to see them unless I’m ill. But here we are, after 6 weeks, and now GP agrees it must be bacterial without seeing
me. I don’t argue with them, they’re trying their best to help, but I’m terrified about the state of the NHS.

As for a couple of the comments on thread…. My goodness me, why on earth is the NHS struggling when there are people who can diagnose over the Internet?! Seriously, stop and THINK about the potential damage you could cause. Wow.

Because I've seen how amazing they are!!! My own eye infection I will never forget - green slime floating around in my eye - I couldnt read or even open them - a few doses of the antibiotic eye drops and it was very manageable and I could go back to work. According to a lot of people on this thread I should have continued with cold boiled water - until when? How long for?

I realise there is a balance, and antibiotics should be kept for "special occasions" but where there is clear evidence of bacterial infection why can't we have them? This child has never had antibiotics and clearly needs them asap. Obviously I'm not a doctor but I've cared for my own kids and usually you can just see when they are needed, but obviously a doctor should make that determination. I'm usually right though.

What the hell is wrong with this country that when a very sick child can’t get in to see a doctor in anything remotely resembling a timely fashion, everyone jumps on the child’s (also ill!!) parent to suggest it must be their fault for not persisting longer, sitting endlessly in a crowded A&E dept, spreading their germs to the elderly and vulnerable, picking up everyone else’s germs, and no guarantee of being seen within 10 hours? Or longer? Probably feeling guilty the whole time for using A&E inappropriately, or squandering valuable NHS resources by having the audacity to be ill, since this seems to be hardwired into every British brain?

My friend’s toddler died in a situation like this. With a chest infection that could have easily been treated by antibiotics if they’d been able to get to see or even talk to a GP, or if they had been sensibly triaged at urgent care.

I am so fucking sick of the endless gaslighting - and people’s mindless complicity with it - that the NHS is fit for purpose in its current state and any problems are down to patients’ unreasonable expectations.

Jesus.

@Vallmo47 that's terrible - another person on this thread has ended up with pneumonia because of not being diagnosed sooner.

My 'old' doctor used to say to me 'look it's probably viral, but if after another week, and you notice yourself not getting better, and in fact getting worse, you should fill this script'.

I think a lot of us know our bodies - I do - I can tell when it's "just a cold" and when it turns into something more serious. Saying that it's been years since I've had an antibiotic, thank god.

The poor little kid, needs taking to A&E or urgent care- he sounds really sick
I hope he gets help ASAP

Any urgent care centres near you? My mother went to A&E for a nasty dog bite and they advised it was a 6 hour wait. The urgent care centre saw her in 1.5 hours on a Saturday, they gave her a tetanus jab and antibiotics.

You can check here: www.nhs.uk/Service-Search/other-services/Urgent%20Care/LocationSearch/1824#

Wow, that is so terrible, but honestly I'm not surprised that tragedies have occurred. The balance is WAY OUT. Of course you 'treat' with paracetemol and fluids and ibuprofen - but we KNOW when our kids are sick, or when we are sick - and IMO it is a crisis, that a simple thing like a child with an infection cannot see a doctor, and ends up in A&E should not be acceptable - we should be marching on the streets and not accepting this. Let alone my poor friend - no chance for her to see a doctor - she just laughed when I suggested it - she's really poorly.

He's too sick to go to hospital???

The service from the GP is shit, ours will always squeeze a sick kid in even with a nurse and then on to a doc if needed but if he's that bad she calls and waits for an ambulance at home or she goes up. She can't just sit there and let him deteriorate and then say "well I did call the GP but they were busy"

I don't mean to sound mean but if you attend a+e with a small child struggling to breathe you are seen by the triage nurse right away, it's a medical emergency. I've attended with one of my children with these symptoms around 10 times between the ages of 2 and 4, everytime we haven't even sat down in the waiting room we are sent straight into a room. I don't believe you'd be sat with a child struggling to breathe (gasping) in a waiting room, it just doesn't happen. For what it's worth it's always a viral wheeze my child has, no antibiotics are given. It always starts with a very chesty cough and progresses to breathing difficulties over a week or so. They treat with nebulisers over couple of days until the symptoms reduce and O2 readings come back up. Also gunky eyes I've taken my children to the doctors with this too, cleaning with boiling water was the instructions, antibiotics aren't just handed out anymore. My children's always cleared with regular cleaning.

Antibiotics don't fix everything (viral infections cant be treated with antibiotics), overusage is also making some serious bacterial infections resistant, so doctors don't just hand them out like once upon a time.

And yes urgent care or out of hours gp too

This is extremely irresponsible advice. Please stop.

Pulse oximetry is notoriously unreliable in small children. Also, for the same reason pregnant women shouldn't be using Doppler's, a little knowledge is extremely harmful. Someone may not seek care when needed because the pulse oximeter said everything was fine.

The child, at least, needs to be seen by a GP, whether you believe their condition merits it or not is irrelevant.

For conjunctivitis, she can see the pharmacist, who can prescribe antibiotic ointment without needing to see a GP.

For the chest infection, she needs to ring 111 and request an out of hours appointment. I've never had trouble getting one within about 2 hours of calling. Or go to an urgent care centre (rather than A&E). The reality is that A&E is rammed with really serious cases and a toddler with bronchiolitis, if stable, isn't going to be first on the list when there are complex fractures and cardiac issues and diabetics having hypos, overdoses, etc.

Does she have an urgent care, out of hours service via her GP. A long wait usually but no appointment needed.

Conjunctivitis can be bacterial, my adult child had it recently. The eyes were both very red, gritty with pus. So antibiotic eye drops were prescribed. If your LO is listless then you need to be seen by a doctor, I'm afraid I would camp out at A&E. I took the same adult child to A&E once, to find that it was sepsis, not to worry you, but sometimes things progress quickly.