Religion, the Church of England and State Ceremonies

[cakeorwine]

I know we have an established church. I get that. And that's probably the answer to this question.

I do feel uncomfortable with the role that religion - specifically the Church of England - plays in State Ceremonies.

Watching the Cenotaph events on Remembrance Sunday. A moving event - but it does have a lot of religious elements. Prayers, hymns and The Lord's Prayer.

I think that anything religious should stick to events that are just for people of that religion. Or if it is multi-faith, then involve other faiths.

Remembrance Sunday is a national event. Keep religion out of it and just stick to remembering the people who died.

With regard the question though, yabu. As a confirmed athiest, I actually like the religious aspect.

I'm not religious, but I personally couldn't care less about singing "God Save the King". If you don't believe in it, God is just a word. I'm French and the words of the Marseillaise don't really reflect my beliefs either, but I don't have any issue with singing it!

I remember seeing the Russian Great Patriotic War remembrance event one year (I think it was 2015) and it was something else. "And here are the newest post-Soviet era tanks." "Here are some missiles, just to remind everyone that we have them."

Historically Remembrance is a more conflicted thing in France. There were so many deep divisions in society after the occupation and a lot of bitterness and recriminations against those seen to have collaborated.

Painful isn't it? 😬

Poems can be very powerful.

They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old:
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them.

It really is. I doubt the OP would go to any other country who used their state religion as part of their ceremony and demand they change it to represent all.

That's a definition. I am not sure if that is representative of the population as a whole.

As I said, it will be interesting to see the answers to the census in how many people in this county are Christian.

If the State religion is Christianity but not many people are Christian, is it a Christian country?

What is it specifically that you dislike about Christian hymns etc that are different in non-Christian ones? If you find the whole religious aspect offputting, why do you want more religion (as long as it's not more Christianity)? It sounds like you have a problem with Christianity rather than genuinely wanting a non-religious service as the other religions tenets are very similar in terms of being anachronistic in the modern world.

You are free to arrange a diverse, non-denominational service if you want, I promise nobody from the Church of England is going to hunt you down and force you to sing Christian prayers!

If you care to visit Manchester on Remembrance Sunday you may find that the service included prayers offered by Muslim, Jewish Sikh leaders.
Many of these groups fought and many died for our country

Poems can be very powerful

I don't disagree with that. In their place. Which, rightly or wrongly, isn't the national service we have every November

You could include this one

“Good-morning, good-morning!” the General said
When we met him last week on our way to the line.
Now the soldiers he smiled at are most of 'em dead,
And we're cursing his staff for incompetent swine.
“He's a cheery old card,” grunted Harry to Jack
As they slogged up to Arras with rifle and pack.

But he did for them both by his plan of attack.

As above.

You seem to have a very confused notion about the part the Christian church plays in your own country OP.

The Church (Christian/Church of England) and the state are completely entwined and the King/Queen is the head of the Church.

The Church of England is part of the state they cannot be separated. Hence any national occasion, like Remembrance Day, will have a religious element to it.

As the above poster says, perhaps you should Google the matter before posting on here as you clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

Speaking as an atheist, I really have no objection to any religious content on these occasion.

Nobody's making you watch anything that has a religious content. Maybe just don't watch them. And absolutely no one is forcing you to sing the national anthem.

Another fucking neo Marxist.

Other countries are available….

If the State religion is Christianity but not many people are Christian, is it a Christian country?

OK, we've gone from painful to excruciating! 🤦

I live in this country.

So it's ok for people in the UK to question how things are done.

I think it's more 'oh no, I don't like this, it should be all about what I like, what about my opinions?' Solipsism on a grand scale.

And narcissism.

That's not a very clear answer.

What do you think?

If less than half of the country are Christian, is it a Christian country?

I like the Socratic dialogue method. Lead them to it by baby steps.

Certainly outside of London on Armistice day (not remembrance sunday which is the c of e event for that) I see other faiths getting involved in remembrance events and parades. I think these are cities/ towns that have strong interfaith groups.

If less than half of the UK is Christian, is it a Christian country?

Ok op, 85% (in this highly scientific poll) think you're being unreasonable. Are you ready to accept, public opinion might not be with you?

It's not the first time public opinion is against me,

Doesn't mean that it can't be discussed though.

Please don't ask me what I think as I'd likely be banned.

It's been painfully explained to you more than once, exactly what a Christian country is.

I'm cringing inside out for you here.

"At services like Remembrance Sunday then of course our church will lead, just as in other countries their religion will lead."

Many other countries have a separation of church and state.