WFH with children

[Annie232]

On many threads I hear women pop up and mention how they WFH x number of days and so don't need childcare on x number of days. Incidentally, within my NCT group on discussions on return to work a few of the women have said similar and that they plan to WFH 1/2 days a week and therefore save on childcare. Is this a thing now?

My DH had to look after 2yo DS while WFH while I recovered from a bug (it was my day off so DS wasnt in nursery) and I've never seen him so stressed. Highlights included DS getting lost in the house (he was in the garden) and DH trying to do a call while DS screamed his head off about getting the wrong colour plate. He called his mum at lunchtime to come help.

Once they can crawl and walk everything is bloody difficult, I can't understand how anyone could consider working with a toddler or preschooler around.

A lot of the posters who WFH whilst looking after children are not working full time hours and I really doubt that their managers and/or colleagues are aware.

I would be beyond livid if I was a colleague in this situation.

I work from home full time.

My children (2 years and 8 months) are going to a childminder when I'm working.

No way they could be around when I'm working. I wouldn't be able to do any work and my employer would never accept it.

I (among many others) worked from home whilst trying to juggle childcare during the first lockdown when schools and nurseries were closed (DC had just turned 3). It was a nightmare because DC obviously wanted and needed attention but I also had to try and work, attend meetings etc which DC would inevitably interrupt. I honestly don't see how it's possible if DC are young, you end up being both a crap parent and a crap employee, or that's how I felt anyway. If the children are old enough to amuse themselves then maybe, but surely they'd be in school by that age? A friend of mine wfh with DC in the house but her mum is there to look after him (1YO) so it's a bit different. Still challenging though because he knows that she's there and wants to see his mum.

If we’re talking WFH don’t forget employers can take advantage.

I’ve got a close frend about 5 years into stroke recovery. I don’t think she’d admit to it but her job as comms person for a religious organisation means she’s full on at work and I do believe she works at a slower pace. She’s required in the office some days usually weekends. She starts work early and finishes sometimes late at night. She could never do the job with kids and her main boss is bullying her.

Don't do it. Yes childcare is expensive but your sanity is priceless. DD was 9 months when covid hit and I was about to go back to work. It was a relief when I was furloughed. DH was WFH and that was nightmare enough looking after DD around him on calls and his boss being an arse about DD making noise in the background 🙄 let alone if we had both been working!

DD is now 3 and in childcare 8-6, even on the one day I WFH. The times when she's been off ill or 48 hours post vomiting bug are only just now bearable because she can be reliably entertained by the ipad for a few hours. Even so I still end up making up hours, stressed and not a good employee or mum on those days. I have a very understanding boss and colleagues who don't mind being interrupted by DD asking for snacks/to wipe her bum and so on but I still feel guilty for both parties that I'm not giving 100% during that time albeit it rare!

I really think it depends on what job you do and how much flexibility you have.

I'm very lucky that my manager doesn't really care when people are online as long as they get their work done that day. I've been on at 5am and 11pm and everything in between.

The entire tech marketing space is being impacted by skills shortages, across multiple sectors and countries.

You see, that's the bit I find odd about your situation. I also work in a skills shortage role. That means that if I can finish something more quickly than planned, my employer is ecstatic and gives me something else to do (because we have more work than people on account of the skills shortage).

What never happens is that I get given a piece of work and told I have 10 hours to do it, so if I actually finish it in 3, I just put my feet up for 7 hours. So I'm assuming that you are telling your employer that things take longer than they do, so they don't give you more stuff. Or you take on specific pieces of work and charge to do the work regardless of time taken - though you've said that's not the case?

@MolliciousIntent "I can guarantee you that the women looking after babies or small children while working are spending most of the time failing their employer, failing their children, or both.

You need childcare if you're going to work. End of."

Exactly this. You can't possibly look after your child whilst working and you can't work whilst looking after your old. You're effectively stealing from your company by doing this.

I don't know anyone doing this full time with preschool children but I do know people doing it a bit:

One person I know had a toddler with a very secure and lengthy afternoon nap - she put him in nursery in the mornings, he napped in the afternoon and she would put him in front of the TV for an hour at the end of the day. She stopped when he dropped his nap but it worked well for her for about 18 months and halved her childcare costs.

A couple I knew both WFH on Fridays around their toddler - they would juggle their diaries and make up a bit of time in the evening. Nursery was flexible so if they needed the extra day they could book it.

We will see more and more of this with cost of living issues

This would not be acceptable in my work - babies and toddlers have to either be looked after by another adult in the home or out of it.

Younger school aged children would be considered acceptable for an hour or two after school but no more.

kids that would stay at home alone normally if working elsewhere would be fine.

how on earth can anyone do any work or attend Teams meetings properly whilst caring for a toddler???

I'm very lucky in that I'm one of the closes houses to school. I log out of work at 3.29 for a 3.30 school pick up. I'm back logged in by 3.35 but I do log out for that time. We are monitored to the minute but can log in and out as much as we like. So if DC needs me I log out of work and work later. It's not ideal and I'm glad school will now accept him in breakfast and after school club.

I have not read the entire thread, but several different pages, and it seems to me that it depends, on a) the number and age of children, and b) the nature of the job

Fucking hell I can't believe so many people do this / are thinking of doing this. Maybe possible for a bit if you have a young potato baby, but mine was a live wire and would not tolerate not having attention and input, and / or would amuse himself by getting into all sorts of trouble. Crazy thinking - you'll be a crap parent and crap at work.

Yes I can’t understand how being contracted for 37 hours, and presumably paid for those hours, and then only working say 15 hours isn’t skiving. You’re contracted to do hours, not sets if work. Unless you’re SE and charge per hours for the work you’re doing and however long it takes, your a great big skiver and I can’t imagine your employer is OK with that.

Although I do laugh that is mere mortals just don’t understand This modern way of working 😂

I don’t tell anyone things have taken longer than they have

as no one asks.

I don’t work on ‘tasks’ either and I’m never given a piece of work. I define my role, my deliverables and my output. Which is actually common for even those working under me.

Really not sure why some are finding this hard to understand, but then again I’ve not worked in a role where I’m ‘given a task and told when to complete it by’ since I was 19

We must move in very different worlds.

I don't know anyone who doesn't work their contracted hours, and your work pattern doesn't seem to be something many on this thread are familiar with.

Good for you that it's worked out so well.

But even picking up a primary aged child means being out of work for a while - takes me 10-15 mins to get there, 10 mins waiting around / cajoling them out / chatting to teacher and then another 10-15 mins home, sorting them a snack and activity if they need it etc. That's the best part of an hour away from my desk.

That’s good but I think you’re probably the exception! Most people walk a while or drive to their kids school and if it’s anything like my kids’ school they take fucking ages to boot them out.

I’m about 20 minutes and just work later. Ours are allowed to walk out on their own from age 8-9 so I meet them half way.

It’s causing issues fir many employers mainly because people are not being truthful. A parent at my office WFH - has three under 8 including a toddler. Has said they uses a CM, they don’t. The toddler runs riot around the house, disrupts calls to customers and to a Government body that they need to speak with as part if their job role. Then there’s the ‘oh I can’t call for this customer can someone else do it, the kids are all here because of’
a) they’re all ill
b) the (non existent) CM is ill
c) they got let out from school early (the two oldest boys are 4 and 7)
d) inset day (8 since September 😂😂😂)

The reality is the parent cannot afford any child care at all.

Yet the rest of us pick up the slack.
Funny how BC (before Covid) she was in the office every day and the 2 boys went to Nursery.

Don’t worry @LydiaBennetsUglyBonnet will be in soon to tell you this is BS

apparently flexible employers don’t exist and everyone is lying about it

@CherylCrows but if there’s such a skills shortage in your industry, you are so super duper at your job and they pay you a lot of money … why would they be happy with you working 1.5/2hrs a day? Here’s a crazy idea, why wouldn’t they just want to to work more?

I really refuse to believe your employer is happy with you only working 2 hrs a day when you could just work more for them?

Any employer is concerned about making money at the end of the day, you could work 3 or 4 times more hours and still not be working close to a heavy week.
Seems stupid on behalf of your company to not just ask more if you. Unless you are pretending to be busy for large chunks of time every day while on play dates and at the park in order to not be given more work.

Exactly this.

I was WFH when DD2 was in Y6. Perfectly capable of entertaining herself when I wasn't working but I couldn't do the school run in the allocated time so I put her in wrap around care. We had set hours so I couldn't just log off for an hour and log back on later. If work allowed that flexibility I would have done it.

Theoretically I could have taken my laptop and kept my hotspot on (I know someone who did this) but I can't bring myself to take the piss like that!

The more people try and play the system, the more employers are going to turn away from allowing people to do this which is a shame. I loved not having to commute, being able to put a wash in before work (won't leave it while we are away from the house), being in for parcels etc.

I define my role, my deliverables and my output. Which is actually common for even those working under me.

This is actually fairly true for me too in a non tech sector role and I totally could get away with working fewer hours than I am contacted to do. But I view it as that I am being trusted to use my contracted time effectively and so I work out what I can achieve in my working hours and do that. Anything else would feel dishonest to me.

Now it's not a transactional exactly 37 hours type thing, there is give and take but what you're doing seems like a total pisstake