The state pension is HOW MUCH???

[BeatieBourke]

Call me stupid (fair) but I've just realised how much the state pension is. £800 odd a month (£185.15pw).

As a non-means tested benefit. For EVERYONE.

I'm generally of the opinion that benefits are too low and too punitive. I usually advocate for universalism. I understand that people have worked their whole lives and paid in, and deserve a retirement. And that having pensioners in poverty does no favours to the economy or other welfare services.

But £800 a month / £9k a year for EVERYONE?? So a widower in rented accommodation with no other income or savings, £800pm. A wealthy 68 year old who's earned a 6 figure salary, has a huge property portfolio and investments coming out of their ears that pay a fortune out in dividends, £800pm. Seriously?

I understand that no party, least of all the Tories (because tory voters as a population are older) will ever go after pensions because it would be unpopular (and older people vote more generally). But in a time when the country is supposedly facing a financial "black hole" and everything else has already been cut to the bone for the last 12 years, why the hell are we paying out state benefits to millionaires?

Maybe if pensions were means tested (with a fairly high and tapering threshold) there'd be enough to pay pensions for women at 65, and more for people who haven't built up huge assets, can't afford to live, heat their homes or eat a hot meal every day in their later years. I can see the (cynical) political sense in it, but no economic sense whatsoever.

AIBU?

Yes the rate of the benefit being paid could be cut, increased or scrapped. The qualification criteria could be changed.

We all saw what happend to the WASPI women.

Woah. Easy.

I do not think that "pensioners don't deserve a pension". I think most deserve more. And the very rich could.probably get by just as well on a bit less.

I also don't think that most people on other benefits have "never paid into the system."

This suggests that the only people who receive working age benefits are "scroungers" who've never worked. It discounts the fact that many benefit claimants currently work, most have and will work, and most have also paid in to the system and therefore, by the same principal, deserve to be helped when they need it.

That narrative rather gives you away I'm afraid.

I think it is right because people pay in all their lives and should get a decent amount back. Like a private pension in a way.

However I also think other benefits should be much more.

You might not need it, OP but I will. And I've paid for it, so I'd like to have it.

Not everyone gets it.

To get a full state pension you need to pay national insurance for 30 years.

If you don't pay the full amount you do t get a full pension.

If you don't pay any you don't get a state pension.

Don't worry OP, it'll be nothing like this by the time most of us make it to retirement!

Which EU countries have the best state pension?
That would probably be the Netherlands.

In the 2020 Mercer CFA Institute Global Pension Index that awards national pension systems points for adequacy, integrity and sustainability to achieve an overall score, the Netherlands came out on top with a score of 82.6 followed by Denmark with 81.4.

The UK got a score of 64.9. This is lower than a number of other European countries, including Finland (72.9), Sweden (71.2) and Germany (67.3). However, the score is better than France (60.0), Spain (57.7) and Italy (51.9).

Further, in a 2017 OECD report that compares state pension to average earnings, it was shown that the UK only pays out 29% of pensioners’ previous earnings. That’s considerably less than other countries like the Netherlands (100.6%), Portugal (94%) and Italy (93.2%). It’s also lower than the average rate of all OECD countries which is 63%.

Bottom line
Comparative figures suggest that there several countries in Europe that provide a more generous state pension than the UK.

www.fool.co.uk/2021/03/19/how-does-the-uk-state-pension-compare-with-europe/

Id be interested to see if there are any stats on how many don’t claim it. I know my FIL dosnt, he uses his personal pension. He’s hard core Lefty though, he won’t claim what he dosnt need. I know there aren’t many like him but I’m sure there are some.

NI is a percentage of your income. Higher earners pay far far more than the 800 a month over their working life. They are effectively subsidising the rest of lower and non-earning population. Why shouldn't they get what they paid for? They earned it.

If the 800 per month is means tested and taken away, the corollary is for high earners to pay no NI or a much reduced amount of NI, same as everyone else. I am sure these high earners would be absolutely delighted to not be another money tree to be sucked dry.

You're only entitled to a state pension if you have made sufficient National Insurance contributions - it's 35 years worth for a full pension. Not everyone gets a pension.

If you have no other private pensions or savings over 10k you just get pension credit instead which pays you a minimum guaranteed amount to live off.

I don't have a private pension, my other income comes from another source but I pay tax on everything including my state pension.

My state pension is approximately £6500. I paid NI and topped up when there were not enough contributions, I am on the old rate of pension for some reason. I don’t know know how I will pay bills if anything happens to my DH. Electricity about £3500, council tax £1500, water bill about £400 which leaves about £1100 a year for other bills and food. That’s just over £20 a week.how will I manage? I agree that it shouldn’t be paid to people that don’t need it

pensions are paid by current taxpayers. The existing generation of pensioners have not paid anything like enough for their pensions due to longer life expectancy. You can bet that my dds generation who will actually pay for the boomers pension won’t get universal pensions.

Tell you what. YOU opt out of your state pension right now, so that those who are working like your dd when YOU retire, don't have to pay for you.

If you have other income that takes you over the threshold, you still pay tax at the standard or higher rate, whichever applies.

While it sounds like a lot, going by this report from a year ago the UK State Pension barely covers what is needed for a “moderate” lifestyle. And this report assumes no rental/mortgage costs which is unlikely to be the case for a lot of people in the future.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58883053

So by the time I’m of state retirement age I’ll have paid NI for 51 years, yes I was working and paying NI. From the age of 16 when I was still at school…THEN I started paying superannuation from the age of 21, you think I shouldn’t get a state pension, although someone who has pissed their life against a wall claimed everything and contributed nothing gets the same basic state pension….you can sod off with that thought!

I’m fed up to the back teeth of paying for everything because I’ve made allegedly sensible decisions through my life and getting nothing back, whilst other people who do nothing but make poor choices have the means to live hand to them on a plate.

You are completely and utterly out of touch if you think £800pcm is a lot of money! But the reason it is not means tested is that everyone who has worked and paid their due has paid for their pension. Those who haven't worked get pension too, mind, so maybe it's those we should do a means test on. Is that what you mean? Oh hang, but we do, they get pension credit to top them up to a living standard.

Seriously, you cannot stop paying people a pension that they have already paid for. At 56 I'm already fully paid up ie I am now paying for no further benefit and I won't get my pension until I'm 72.

Your post is completely and utterly unreasonable and it's something only a tory would suggest.
.

It is absolutely not given to everyone. It is only if you have thirty firve years of national insurance contributinos. People who have never done a day's work in their life do not get a single penny of state pension.

Also the state takes up to 45% of it away in income tax for pensions with other income/pensions. It is fully taxable at people's highest marginal rate.

What is with the obsession. With means testing everything in this country? The Nordic countries don’t do that. You know those countries that everyone holds up as examples of perfection on mumsnet.

Why does MN hate pensioners ( or Boomers as they are usually called ) ?
I worked and paid NI for more than 40 years so feel perfectly fine about collecting my State Pension which , by the way is taxable .

you pay tax on all income over your personal allowance until death so that millionaire who has paid in shitloads to a personal pension will pay tax on its income along with the income from the state pension
if your still working and recieving a state pension you still pay national insurance theres no opt out

Spot on, me too.

Absolutely. Because it’s a benefit paid by current taxpayers. The so called WASPi women had at least about 20 years notice that their pension age was changing. It’s crackers to think that women deserve a lower pension age just by virtue of being women

The problems with means testing is that the admin costs of carrying this out often mean minimal savings can be made.