Liz Truss has resigned. Part 4: The Desolation of Boris

[sunnydaytoday0]

Continuation from last thread, for those of us following all the action on Monday.

And yes I'm a LOTR fan, so tried to continue the theme in the thread title 😉

The appointment of Braverman and the dusting off of Johnson gags from two years ago on the North London elite don’t fill me with confidence.

Also he needs to be careful. Claiming everyone in Islington is rich when it has some of the most deprived people in the country and he has a multimillion pound house in Kensington and is a the SIL of a billionaire will come back to haunt him.

He needs better advisors.

Actually I'm a swing voter. I should be labour through and through, working class, union rep, wanting the poorest in society to be housed and able to buy food.

Unfortunately I've not always agreed with their policies or direction so I look at what my local MP is offering and vote accordingly.

They lost me with Johnson and rather than trying to win me back they insist on alienating me, along with a vast amount of the population.

That’s interesting - your last line is how I felt about Corbyn and Labour.

They don’t need anyone who has never voted for them but they do need many who did last time. Johnson then Truss have made it very hard for Sunak so we’ll see (plus racism etc).

@Notonthestairs - actually you would be surprised how friendly they are with each other, collaboratively working on bills. PMQs not representative of Parliament

It comes down to the middle ground voters who switch, not if you are Labour supporter already.

I think tactical voting will also play a part in a lot of areas, especially where there is anything except a relatively large majority. I think there will be more tactical votes next time than last time, as seen in three recent by elections which overturned huge tory majorities.

I'm heartened to read that. PMQs probably isn't the best advertisement for Parliament! I can just about listen (with sound down) but I can't watch it at all.

I do like a modern debating chambers though. I have a trip booked to Edinburgh in May and hope to have a nosey in the Scottish Parliament.

I had high hopes for Sunack, bringing some morals back into No 10 and Parliament. His answers at PMQs plus rehiring SB shows he’s just like the rest of them.

If it helps, PMQs is like a fencing match. Can you score a point against the other?

The rest of Parliamentary business and what MPs do is very much more dull. The last few years has been very hysterical and very unusual.

There is a line which you can cross, which was Johnson's attempt to state that Starmer was directly responsible for the failure to prosecute Savile. Had he not been PM, I think Johnson would have been suspended.

But you’re all Labour voters? Bar Derxa iirc

I’m certainly not an habitual Labour voter. I’ve voted Labour once in 50 years of being eligible to vote.

I would vote Labour if there were a GE tomorrow because it’s the only way to get these dangerous ideologues out of government. I disagree with some of Labour’s policies, particularly around identity politics, but beggars can’t be choosers, and our electoral system forces beggary on most of us.

Born and Lizzie did you vote for Johnson?

@MarshaBradyo no I’ve never voted Tory in my life.
I can see how you thought that from my post, I just meant after the absolute horrors of Johnson and Truss, Sunack may bring some stability and morals to the table.

They lost me with Johnson and rather than trying to win me back they insist on alienating me, along with a vast amount of the population.

I missed out the conservatives fron the above post.

Continuing to connect Starmer with a Corbyn leadership from 3 years ago, whilst insisting Braverman can make a fresh start after 6 days, is just a no from me. The hypocrisy is revolting and sugggests that Sunak just brings more of the same.

On Corbyn, he was too extreme for me on foreign policy but when people demonise him they forget that he galvanised and excited young people (whose futures have been complely fucked over) more than any other politician in years.

Let face reality here, Derxa, you'll never support Labour, if i cut you in half, you'd bleed blue blood and have conservative written right through you.

...... which is bizarre because its the Tories that will get Sturgeon her independence, which apparently you don't want and Gordon Brown which won the last vote for you... .... go figure.

I’m another swing voter, I’ve voted for all 3 main parties (if you can call the LD a “main party” anymore!) at some point in the last 23 years that I’ve been eligible to vote. Born and lived in a Labour stronghold (Dawn Primarolo’s campaign office was on our street!) and now live in the East Anglian Tory heartland with a certain cheating former Health Secretary in the neighbouring constituency.

Right now I don’t know who I’d vote for, none of them fill me with any confidence and yes the fact that the Labour front bench seem incapable of defining what a woman is is a massive concern to me.

Born and Lizzie did you vote for Johnson?

Absolutely and totally not.

I would never vote for such a charlatan, a proven liar, and the face of Brexit - the most disastrous act of political self harm to have ever happened in this country.

I have respect for some Conservatives. I believe their intent is honourable, though I don’t agree with them. But for Johnson I have nothing but detestation and contempt.

That’s how I see things too right now, sadly. Voting Labour is the only way to get the Tories out, certainly where I live!

I agree with @LexMitior , they do all generally rub along quite well, in the slowly falling into the Thames, dodgy toilets and leaking pipes, HoC. I suspect the more machiavellian stuff happens within the parties as opposed to between them.

It's posting on here that's done it 😂 I used to be quite flexible in my voting but the views here have really annoyed me. Maybe I'm turning into my father. We used to have screaming rows about politics. I mean throwing chairs level of rows. He was an old fashioned Tory. Although he did say that farmers did better under labour due to the weak pound 😳

@Notonthestairs - sure you will enjoy the trip to the Scottish Parliament! These are special places to a lot of people. I liked that it was trying to do something consciously different from Westminster in presenting a circle of debate. The inside is very elegant, beautiful light wood. Organic.

Westminster has very intense interiors. Psychedelic wallpaper! Pugin is a strong drug for Parliamentarians. I think it affects them sometimes!

I was there today for work. Very different to Westminster!

What views have you found annoying/frustrating on here derxa?

But you’re all Labour voters? Bar Derxa iirc

No, not me. I voted Conservative for a long, long time, nowadays if anything I'm Lib Dem. That's not to say I wouldn't vote Labour if they were the best chance to get a Tory MP out, but I haven't been in that situation so far.

The idea that the UK is a terrible place to live. The idea that other countries are not facing the difficulties we are. The demonization of all politicians when in the main they're decent people trying to do a good job.

Absolutely not my reading of these interesting, informed, wide-ranging and generally balanced threads.

The idea that the UK is a terrible place to live.

People don’t say this. People do rightly comment on terrible situations, for example the understaffing in the NHS, which is dangerous. The UK is in many ways a very good place to live, and people acknowledge that.

The idea that other countries are not facing the difficulties we are.

Different countries face different difficulties. Pointing out that (some) other countries do (some) things better (even if only marginally better) doesn’t constitute believing that other countries don’t face difficulties. Since Brexit the UK has consistently proved to be underperforming on the international stage over a range of comparators.

The demonization of all politicians when in the main they're decent people trying to do a good job.

Not on these threads, which are generally nuanced. Disliking what a particular politician does at a particular time doesn’t constitute demonisation. For example, I dislike Johnson. I think he has done untold harm to the country through his ambition and duplicity. His wrongdoings are real and documented. But I don’t think he’s evil. Braverman too is judged by her actions, which appear to be cruel and spiteful. She also appears to have broken the ministerial code. But to say this isn’t demonisation, it’s an expression of (widely shared) opinion and confirmed fact. Similarly, I disagree with or disapprove of politicians from other parties and countries, but I don’t believe that all politicians are dreadful.