AIBU to think MN enables obsessive hygiene

[Cheeselog]

And wonder what we can do to stop it?

When I was a teenager and suffering from an eating disorder I sought out ‘pro-ana’ material on Tumblr, which has rightfully been banned on many sites as it essentially encourages people to give in to their disorder instead of challenging it.

I can’t help but feel the regular threads where people declare if you don’t wash your hands/ shower/ change your sheets/ change your clothes/ deep clean your toilet every 15 minutes or whatever then you are GRIM are the equivalent for people with hygiene-focused OCD (and other threads do the same for health anxiety) - these threads validate and normalise obsessive behaviours.

IMO this content is just as bad for individuals as my pro-ED content was. How can we stop this and make MN a safer environment for people who are suffering from or susceptible to these illnesses?

It does happen. There’s literally one ongoing at the moment that I posted on last night - I highlighted a person that called letting linens get to the two week stage ‘grim’. Needlessly overused.

I just personally find that MN is not representative of any person I know. Most people are pretty balanced. And most people don’t read the OP and immediately start drawing up a fantasy of what ‘might have actually happened’ which ALWAYS happens in posts where someone is annoyed with someone else!

thinking about a(nother) family member who has recently been diagnosed with OCD and a discussion I had about not enabling the compulsions but helping them to challenge the underlying thinking instead.

The problem I have always found with this is that often the people who want to "challenge the assumptions" are the ones who are the least hygienic on the spectrum of 'normal' and want to challenge someone being more hygienic than them, rather than OCD-type thinking, and this isn't particularly useful. The other problem is that ideally when and how you challenge should be adapted to the programme the person with OCD is following, which often includes graded exposure or working on one set of problems before another. Forcing cold-turkey on them, or insisting that they deal with it in YOUR way to YOUR programme, isn't usually helpful. It's very complicated.

I have seen little evidence of Mumsnet being a hot-bed of people who have extreme, OCD-level hygiene habits. Government guidance is currently to wash one's hands when one comes into home or work. It's good practice and not OCD to do so. But whether it is OCD is more about WHY you are doing what you are doing rather than what you are doing (e.g. perceived consequences of not getting it right) anyway, except in extremis. Someone with contamination-based OCD can be less hygienic overall than someone who doesn't have it.

It doesn't happen that people claim if you don't do that every 15 minutes or whatever you're grim.

That's the point @Whadda was making.

@TheSheerCheekOfSomePeople

I don't think anyone would disagree with you on hand-washing, that's pretty orthodox.

The thing that really freaked me out was these people the other week saying it was unhygienic to sit on a bed with "outdoor" clothes on.

I highlighted a person that called letting linens get to the two week stage ‘grim’.

For them it might be.

Different people with different habits can need to change their linens at different times as it depends on so many factors, too numerous to list but including how much they: sweat, bathe before bed or not, have sexual activity of any sort, eat in the bed, have makeup or creams get on the sheets, vacuum/mop the floors, have pets or children come into the bed, get dirty in the day if not bathing before bed, sit in bed in the daytime, etc etc.

Well it must be somewhat unhygienic to sit on a bed with outdoor clothes on or in hospitals they wouldn't be telling you not to sit on the patient's bed for that very reason! And were doing so pre-Covid.

It is unlikely to do anyone with a normally-functioning immune system any harm. I did it through my teens on my bed and others throughout my teens and 20s as did many of us.

We don't now though, and it means our bed linen stays cleaner for longer, and smells nicer. It's not OCD not to do this. Lots of people do this.

It can get a bit ridiculous, especially the poster who was disgusted her partner lay on the bed in clothes he'd worn outside and he was feeling sick. She had zero sympathy. Also, quite a few posters have an obsession with using bleach to clean the house on a daily basis.

Ah okay, don’t think I fully understood.

@TheSheerCheekOfSomePeople

It's not OCD not to do this. Lots of people do this.

I think it's incredibly OCD.

The standards you apply in a hospital, which is prone to microbes and full of sick and vulnerable people in no way apply to the standards you apply in a home full of people who are freely sharing microbes anyway?

The point about hospitals is that they are trying to stop superbugs and people bringing infections to people who are ill. That doesn't work in a home setting and it would be crazy to apply that approach.

Also why only on beds? If you're determined to avoid bringing bugs in the house, which people justifiably were during the pandemic, surely you take your clothes off and wash your hands. Under normal conditions with healthy people why would the bed in particular necessitate any particular special treatment?

Another thing that happens a lot on MN I find, is that posters are unable to see nuance, or hyperbole, and take absolutely everything at face value.

Agree totally.
Most of the "have you tried showering/washing your bedding more often/cleaning your loo" posts seem to come as responses to posters who appear to be engaged in competitive filthy houses/bodies tbh.

Strong agree! That OP was totally off the scale insane!

The one who moaned on about outdoor clothing that is!

Do people really take their hygiene cues from the MN hive mind? Seems bonkers to do so.

But the PP could see the hyperbole and that's why they pointed it out. Or at least that's how I read it anyway.

Far better to cut out hyperbole if an OP wants people to take what they're saying seriously.

I agree OP. I have seen some downright madness on here with regards HAVING to shower / bath every day.

We are probably in the minority though.

What kind of madness is related to showering daily?

I haven't seen all these threads but I think the complete opposite: I think MN enables poor hygiene and I think often there is competitive underwashing rather than overwashing. I don't comment on anyone's washing posts as I don't care enough, but definitely see plenty of posts by people saying they bathe once a week and they will fight anyone who thinks that's "grim":)

Most people surely wash their hands after the toilet and being outdoors, change bedsheets once a week and shower daily?

The above is just normal. If you don't want to wash your hands after the toilet or have a shower regularly then .. don't

And the amount of posts I see where grown women aren't changing beds from one month to the next and aren't cleaning themselves is pretty high. I can't help but find that pretty disgusting

Absolutely!
And then say "I know I don't smell"
(While everyone round them holds a nosegay)

And the poor guy was unwell at the time, if it's the thread I remember!

Basically - grown ups need to be handle other grown ups forthrightly disagreeing with them! As long as no name calling then saying “you change your bed every 4 months! 🤢. Shudder at the thought”.

If you “enabled” (bloody hell I hate that word!) by an anonymous poster saying “it’s gross to wash once a week” then a) you need to seriously woman up a bit and b) I suspect you’re upset / defensive because you aren’t particularly happy with the way you do things, whatever that may be, but sure as heck don’t like anyone not voicing any opinion that doesn’t fall with that other hated (by me at least!) term “Be Kind”

He had just had surgery to remove his wisdom teeth and op was disgusted that he lay on the bed in his normal clothes.

Queue a poster saying how vile that he had been in a dentist chair covered in other peoples blood and saliva 🙄