To think the govt is mad for revoking the fracking ban?

[ShangPie]

That’s just it really - I can’t believe that the government has revoked the fracking ban.

It’s all kinds of wrong for loads of reasons:

Seriously damages the environment locally
Contributes to global climate change
Makes us more dependent on fossil fuels
Not-insignificant risk of manmade earthquakes near fracking sites!

To name just a few that come to mind…

Can we get this govt petition up to the 10,000 needed to reconsider it?

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/614611

Solar panels take up a lot of space (if in fields)
Surely we need to think about food security as well?

Burning gas is far less polluting than burning coal. This has helped the US reduce its emissions by 25% in a decade.

That would be an argument if we hadn't effectively phased out coal for electricity generation.

But given that coal is now an extremely marginal fuel in the UK, can you explain how shale gas would have a significant downward impact on fossil fuel emissions?

Do folks on this board really think that one can drill a hole anywhere and pump water in and oil out?
Most of the oil produced on shore flows from conventional wells that rely on natural well pressure. Including the biggest field Wytch Farm. Which has been flowing for about 40 years and one in Lincolnshire was started in the 1930s
These wild accusations about ££Millions to be made. How please?
Most of the companies are Capitalised at about £100 some at £20m.
They might be pumping sea water in to replace the volume removed. I sure the experts on here can correct me if I am wrong.

The problem with electricity is that once generated it cannot be stored. So on a cold dark night with no wind, as electricity demand surges, wind and solar power are redundant . Whereas gas, coal and nuclear facilities just turn up some dials and boom , more electricity.

So wind and solar are great for adding electricity into the grid when conditions are right but we could not solely rely on them.

Whoever can invent huge batteries that can store gazillowatts of electricity is on to a winner!

Whoever can invent huge batteries that can store gazillowatts of electricity is on to a winner

Absolutely. A way of capturing energy when it's produced in excess for when it's needed.

We could generate hydrogen from electrolysis from excess energy.
Or find other ways of capturing energy.

MikeWozniaksMoustache
The head of Cuadrilla has said due to the geological make you of the U.K. fracking is pointless and won’t help bring energy costs down.
Treaclemine
The CEO of Cuadrilla has said that there is no point in fracking in the UK as the geology of Britain doesn't have the sort of expanses of shales found in North America

In fact the article says the current CEO of Cuadrilla welcomed the announcement that the moratorium on fracking would be lifted, but the company has not yet said whether it will unseal any wells.

The other guy (academic geologist Chris Cornelius) resigned from the company in 2014. He appears to contradict himself here;
"There was an opportunity 10 years ago to look at this [fracking] sensibly, but that opportunity has now gone. It was worth looking at then, but it’s not practical now.”

Has the geology of Britain changed in 10 years?

The article goes on to say that Cornelius now has a business interest in a geothermal consortium.

The amount it could provide is so small that the savings in energy use could I expect easily be saved by proper insulation and a few other measures.

I don't understand why they have thrown their weight behind electric cars
Think about it, buying electric cars is someone else's problem. They don't have to do any work or spend any money, just leave it to the consumer to pay while hoping that private companies will sort out charging points.

Basically because we're so desperate that we're likely to start relighting mothballed coal-fired power stations.

Fracking cannot deliver for years and years if ever. We don't know if it's safe and it won't be any cheaper. Even the CEO of Cuadrilla said it was unwise.

That's is an unfounded comment. Do a little more research in areas where fracking is in play and look at the damage to local infrastructure. Listen to the CEO of Cuadrilla instead of populist politicians.

@GiltEdges
There are two sides to every debate. Some of the benefits of fracking include:

Improved economic activity- FALSE. The founder of Cuadrilla, Chris Cornelius, the geologist who founded Cuadrilla Resources, which drilled the UK’s first modern hydraulic fracturing wells in Lancashire has come out and said it won’t make any difference to the U.K. economy at all.

Higher house prices- FALSE. Homes in fracking areas lose value, they do not gain value.

Employment opportunities- NOT NEEDED. We have record high vacancies for jobs.

Lower carbon dioxide emissions- FALSE. Fracking causes the same CO2 emissions as natural gas BUT more global warming gas emissions than all other fossil fuels, even coal, due to the release of methane. Methane is 80x more powerful at global warming than CO2.

Lower energy prices- FALSE. Again, the founder of Cuadrilla, geologist Chris Cornelius who surveyed the shale beds has stated there’s not enough gas down there to affect energy prices at all.

Reduced dependence on foreign supply / increased energy security- FALSE. See above. Won’t affect our energy security.

Sadly, renewable energy sources alone will never be enough to meet demand.
Fracking, as well as increased use of nuclear power, are the inevitable future for the UK.- FALSE. Fracking isn’t inevitable any more than reopening coal mines is inevitable.

Politically damaging. The Conservative back bench seemed unhappy and have they forgotten about the Red Wall?

Ford decided to use batteries for their cars that give reduced range, yes reduced range so that they can use chemicals from USA/Canada and be independent of China or other countries.
It was a sound decision. That seemingly strange decision to reduce range shows how tight the entire energy industry is.
As I remarked earlier, a factory had a fire, lithium batteries can over-heat and 'runaway'. Remember early Laptops, some airlines were a 'bit off' about them in the cabin?

You believe Jacob Reese Moggs unfounded claims of this? The man who said everyone who went to a state school has the intelligence of a “potted plant”?
The man who has when I last looked £10million invested in Somerset Capital Management, (also founded by Rees-Mogg) which has investments in the fracking industry?

Not that old chestnut.
Fracking impact on CO2 cuts in US emissions 'a myth' reported the BBC in 2015. www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-33612293.amp

😆😆 Earliest we’d even see a farts worth of gas from it would be April. Too little and too late for winter.

The tories don't give a shit about green issues. One of their main objectives is to make as much money from the hydrocarbon industry as possible regardless of the consequences.

Shale gas is gas.
You burn gas, you produce CO2.

I am not sure how this fits in with Net Zero.

However, we do need energy security.

Is this the best way? Or could we find other ways - such as reducing the amount of energy we actually need / use?

I know right, what does a PhD in Geology who founded a fracking company, surveyed and opened the fracking wells in Lancashire know about the Geology of Britain & fracking compared to a Brexit politician with a 2nd class bachelors in medieval history?

Living near the fracking site I can assure you we felt the tremors very easily. There has so far been no increase in jobs unless you count the police brought in to monitor the protest site and the security team.needed for.the land owner who sold his land. The local tory MP is out already criticising JRM its the.most active he's ever been. Quite rightly I think he's scared he will loose his seat in the next election , and this is an area that would elect a sheep with a tory rosette. I think he will and if the local area need to agree to this it won't happen. Just on a note he also pointed out that one of the biggest reserves is under JRM constituency so perhaps he would like to fast track it there instead . This isn't nimbyism its lived experience of UK fracking.

Oh do read the thread. I have stated several times that I quoted a former NATO Secretary General - Anders Fogh Rasmussen.

www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/jun/19/russia-secretly-working-with-environmentalists-to-oppose-fracking

That's a this winter scenario, and still on the outside margins based on the current winter outlook. We fire up small amounts of coal to deal with margin issues every winter. Nowhere near the volumes you'd need to deliver the kind of 'savings' like 25%.

How is UK shale gas going to help this winter? How would it help in future winters when we know it wouldn't make a noticeable difference to non-Russian global gas stocks and therefore fuck all difference to the price?

If it's availability of gas this winter that's the issue that drives us to coal - shale won't help.

If it's the cost in future winters - shale won't help.

If it's European volumes in future winters - shale really won't help as much as a few extra LNG terminals on the Continent would.

Agree with everything above
I am over 5 miles from the fracking site and also felt the tremors. I was in bed at the time and was woken by one that according to the pro-frackers was equivalent to that of a book falling off a shelf or similar. I can assure you it was more than that
An elderly relative lives nearer to the fracking site and was completely panicked by the loud bang and tremor of the first one, thinking a car had crashed into their house

Your original quote was very firm in its assertion, zero mention of any ex nato chief.
It's worth noting that the anti-fracking campaign was funded by the Russians. It's not hard to see how it was in Putin's interests to keep us dependent upon Russian gas

Would have more credibility if you were also scathing of proven Russian links to Tory party funding and of course Brexit.

On electric cars though i agree, they are a stop gap and have an appalling carbon foot print.

Would be interesting to know the tory party's links to fracking.