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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think a 3rd cousin isn't really a relative?

204 replies

CallMeNutribullet · 13/09/2022 15:37

Not really a Royal family thread but inspired by some of the conversations I've seen online since the Queen's death.

I've seen lots of people suggesting the fact that the Queen and Prince Philip were 3rd cousins is creepy and incestuous. To me it's such a distant relationship that I honestly wouldn't even consider myself related to a 3rd cousin. Google tells me you share less than 1% of your DNA with a 3rd cousin and I can't imagine the vast majority of people have any idea who their 3rd cousins are.

Would others see it as a deal breaker in a relationship if you found out a potential partner shared great, great grandparents with them?

OP posts:
Paigeycakey · 23/09/2022 06:57

@Farmerazza I agree with you. Once you start marrying cousins people will move to step relatives morally it's not right especially if you have known each other for years

Checkitoutnow · 23/09/2022 07:06

Farmerazza · 23/09/2022 06:55

I am close to my cousins and will at some point have their children over and probably grandchildren. Our grandchildren cannot get married.

how many cousins do you have, and are you close to all of them like this? Is it a small family?

Checkitoutnow · 23/09/2022 07:11

Checkitoutnow · 23/09/2022 07:06

how many cousins do you have, and are you close to all of them like this? Is it a small family?

For context, I’m from a smallish family and I have 8 first cousins. I’m close with down but not all. The chance of my (future) grandchildren being close with the grandchildren of all 8 cousins seems unlikely.

Checkitoutnow · 23/09/2022 07:14

Sorry, close with some, not close with down

RedToothBrush · 23/09/2022 07:26

I've met my 4th cousin.

I do a significant amount of research into my family history.

What struck me was how closely life paths in our families were. There were definitely family traits in terms of interests and occupations although the split in the family occurred over 100 years ago. Our overall beliefs were similar too.

Its hard to know how much of that is social and how much genetic. But the product is a shared understanding and cultural heritage of beliefs (not just religion). So I can totally get why 3rd cousins might marry.

Im currently researching part of DH's family. There is a family member who lived to a very old age. The newspaper lists which family members attended the funeral. Its been really useful for being able to trace family members.

What is fascinating is, having been able to identify grandchildren and great grandchildren is how and where they lived in the community. There are 33 grandchildren. Half of them lived in a small suburb of Sheffield, literally next door to each other, which I'd never known without the research. Tracing the families through, many seem to still live in the area. Its utterly fascinating.

I've looked at similar families before. The newspaper will often say how many grandchildren and Great grandchildren they had at the time of their death. I think one I've come across in my family had over 80 grandkids alone! (Fun for tracing!)

With much smaller family sizes the chances of marrying your distant relatives, are much less likely. Over 100 years ago, it would have been a lot more likely, as people tended to stay in the same communities for generations more often and having large numbers of children (keep in mind that until 1840 people were a) not allowed to leave their parish unless they could demonstrate they could be supported financially b) the population was stable due to the limitation on population growth being food production.)

We are aware of the Royals doing it because their family trees are particularly well documented. The same goes for aristocratic families really. But I don't think that it was significantly less common in ordinary families if you go back 4 or 5 generations. The change in how people move about and mix has been fairly recent.

We are much less aware of who is related to who as we no long live in small communities in the same way. And its not as well documented in lower social classes.

Farmerazza · 23/09/2022 07:32

Paigeycakey · 23/09/2022 06:57

@Farmerazza I agree with you. Once you start marrying cousins people will move to step relatives morally it's not right especially if you have known each other for years

Exactly I wouldn't marry my step cousin either - I have some and we are family so to us morally unacceptable.
For the 2nd / 3rd / 4th cousins I do not know, my Aunt/ Mum/ Uncles will know them and I can't see how they would allow any marriage to take place if I married one of us - It just wouldn't happen.

I appreciate those who do not know, in my family we gather for many events and holidays - someone is bound to know you are dating a cousin or a cousin's child.

schnubbins · 23/09/2022 07:43

My first cousin recently found out through a chance meeting of third cousins that her very best friend for years was her third cousin .Their grandmothers were sisters !Through a family rift they had both never got to meet the extended family .Their families were intertwined for years the kids going to school together etc.It was quite an emotional experience when they both found out .If by chance they had been married it would have been very difficult.

cakeorwine · 23/09/2022 07:59

Paigeycakey · 23/09/2022 06:57

@Farmerazza I agree with you. Once you start marrying cousins people will move to step relatives morally it's not right especially if you have known each other for years

We are ALL cousins.

If you go back far enough.

At what degree of separation of a cousin would it be morally acceptable to you?

Fifth? Sixth? Seventh? Hundredth?

Farmerazza · 23/09/2022 08:18

cakeorwine · 23/09/2022 07:59

We are ALL cousins.

If you go back far enough.

At what degree of separation of a cousin would it be morally acceptable to you?

Fifth? Sixth? Seventh? Hundredth?

As I said I do not see my grandchildren marrying my cousins grandchildren - they will know each other. It's unlikely to happen in my family - for us morally unacceptable.

Your family might be different. Others might marry their cousins and uncles - it's perfectly normal in other cultures. We don't do that.

charliee112 · 23/09/2022 08:19

All my 3rd cousins are well known to me and see them regularly so would be weird to me. We just sat we are cousins because we are all close.

charliee112 · 23/09/2022 08:30

Wait now I'm confused what third cousins are. I thought it was my cousins kids are 2nd cousins and then their kids are my 3rd cousins? Does it not work like this?

gogohmm · 23/09/2022 08:32

I have no idea who my 3rd cousins are. As I have over 60 2nd cousins alone, goodness knows how many I have. Dp could be among them for all we know (he doesn't know his either, though highly unlikely as we are very much from different sides of the tracks, mine are working class londoners!)

BarkylLoner · 23/09/2022 08:38

charliee112 · 23/09/2022 08:30

Wait now I'm confused what third cousins are. I thought it was my cousins kids are 2nd cousins and then their kids are my 3rd cousins? Does it not work like this?

I'm never sure either but the Queen and Philip had the same great great grandparents.
So their great grandparents were first cousins and that somehow makes them 3rd cousins so it looks like it counts down the number of generations?

watcherintherye · 23/09/2022 08:40

Sorry, I haven’t read the full thread, so the point has probably already been made. 3rd cousins aren’t that distant. It’s the relationship of my grandchildren to my cousin’s grandchildren. I’m sure lots of people would be aware of that link within their own family?

Checkitoutnow · 23/09/2022 08:43

Farmerazza · 23/09/2022 08:18

As I said I do not see my grandchildren marrying my cousins grandchildren - they will know each other. It's unlikely to happen in my family - for us morally unacceptable.

Your family might be different. Others might marry their cousins and uncles - it's perfectly normal in other cultures. We don't do that.

do you have a specific cultural background that makes it so? I’m genuinely interested. In my family (and I’m not holding this up as normal), we know some cousins, but others not so well. If a generation is 25 to 30 years on average, the distance in time between great great grandparents and the great great grandchildren is then 100 to 120 years (I think)

watcherintherye · 23/09/2022 08:49

Wait now I'm confused what third cousins are. I thought it was my cousins kids are 2nd cousins and then their kids are my 3rd cousins? Does it not work like this?

Your cousin’s children are your 1st cousins once removed, but your children’s 2nd cousins. Your cousin’s grandchildren are your 1st cousins twice removed, but your grandchildren’s 3rd cousins.

Mummyboy1 · 23/09/2022 08:52

Can I check if we have third cousins here...so my cousin has a child, and I have a child...are the two children 3rd cousins to each other?

BarkylLoner · 23/09/2022 08:53

Yes @Checkitoutnow by the time Elizabeth and Philip met the relatives who were 1st cousins (great grandparents) were long since dead

ScottishLavender · 23/09/2022 08:55

Samcro · 13/09/2022 16:03

so my cousin has a child.....what are they to me? (googled but still confused)

Second cousin.

ScottishLavender · 23/09/2022 08:56

Mummyboy1 · 23/09/2022 08:52

Can I check if we have third cousins here...so my cousin has a child, and I have a child...are the two children 3rd cousins to each other?

Yes that's my belief.

watcherintherye · 23/09/2022 08:57

ScottishLavender · 23/09/2022 08:55

Second cousin.

First cousin once removed. They would be 2nd cousins to your children.

Dinoteeth · 23/09/2022 08:57

3rd cousin is a distant relation

It would be like Prince George marrying Lady Chattos granddaughter.(Princess Margaret's Great granddaughter)

Ie Charles and her are 1st cousins.
William and her child 2nd cousins
George and her granddaughter 3rd.

And no I don't know the names. Most people don't know their 3rd cousins. And they'll be a fair bet most people have someone who's married a cousin of sorts somewhere in their family tree, esp in more rural areas.

Rapidtango · 23/09/2022 08:58

Scottish lavender and Mummyboy1, no, they're 2nd cousins.

DappledThings · 23/09/2022 09:00

Mummyboy1 · 23/09/2022 08:52

Can I check if we have third cousins here...so my cousin has a child, and I have a child...are the two children 3rd cousins to each other?

No, second cousins.

watcherintherye · 23/09/2022 09:00

ScottishLavender · 23/09/2022 08:56

Yes that's my belief.

Your cousin’s child and your child are 2nd cousins. Your cousin’s grandchild and your grandchild would be 3rd cousins.