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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

What to do about bad midwife experience?

101 replies

NotAgainPleased · 03/09/2022 23:10

Tricky and sensitive situation.

I’m a woman in a same sex relationship and am currently pregnant with our second child.

Wife had the first baby, at a big London teaching hospital where the care was generally really good, aside from the fact that it was covid and restrictions around going for appointments together etc applied. We did however have a few incidents of staff being clearly homophobic and I’m feeling quite scared that this is going to happen again with me and worried it will make what is already going to be a stressy birth (Im classed as high risk because of a medical condition) a really traumatic experience. The complicating factor is that the three staff who gave us a difficult time were all West African, and I know homophobia is more of an issue in parts of West Africa than it is here, so it feels like a bit of a common denominator. (Yes I do know they were West African, I’ve lived in Liberia and Ghana for a few months each, and I know the accents. Had an amazing time, aside from having to stay back in the closet.)

The worst incident was with one of the midwives who looked after us during my wife’s labour. She was only with us for two hours as was covering a break. A few examples of what happened though, firstly she asked me twice who I was and why I was there and once where the father was, despite me explaining that I was DW’s wife and the soon to arrive baby’s other parent and that there was no father. She said after each time I explained “I don’t know what you mean” then afterwards referred to me as DW’s friend or helper. Lots of dark looks when I was holding DW’s hand. And most upsetting of all when I was helping DW by changing the bed pad things they put under you to catch the amniotic fluid she actually physically knocked my hand away from DW, and snapped “I am the midwife, I look after the mother, you go and stand up there at other end by her head.” This last bit was so upsetting I had to quickly dash to the bathroom for a two minute cry, which I didn’t want to do in front of DW, before returning. We had both been awake for two days by this point, so the crying was unavoidable and I stopped very quickly and went back to DW. Had I been less tired / not where we were I might have pointed out that I was pretty well acquainted with DW’s nether regions and did not need to stay up by her head. Didn’t say anything at the time as she was only covering someone’s break and I didn’t want her to stop caring for DW somehow and soon we were being looked after by someone else who took us through to the end and was amazing.

Other incidents we had were with two staff members on the front desk of the maternity unit. (this was covid so for scans etc the pregnant one went up, waited to be called while partner hovered. Pregnant one then texted partner when called for appointment saying come up now at which point you went up to the front desk staff and signed in and got a pass). We saw both these two staff members twice for different scans and check ups and both got visibly confused when I had to go up to the desk and explain that my wife was upstairs waiting for her scan, and yes I was her wife not a sister. Cue the staff saying “I don’t understand who are you?” “If you are the wife why are you not upstairs getting the scan?” and “Fathers and partners only allowed upstairs.”

I’m worried something like this will happen again, but don’t really know how to try to preempt it without saying something that could come across as pretty racist. All three staff that gave us a hard time were definitely West African, and I know, from the news, as well as from having lived there that homophobia is a big thing. Not at all saying all first gen West Africans are homophobic or that no white people / people from other backgrounds are, but the reality is that was our experience and I don’t want a repeat of it while I’m in labour.

So what the bloody hell do I do? Nothing and hope for the best? Say something general about having had a bad experience with some seemingly prejudiced staff last time and not mention why or who?

OP posts:
TabithaTittlemouse · 03/09/2022 23:28

I think that you can both say that you had a bad experience from various staff regarding your sexuality without mentioning their race.

TabithaTittlemouse · 03/09/2022 23:28

Btw congratulations

lightcurtains · 04/09/2022 04:24

I'm sorry you've had this experience. We had something similar happen when we were at the hospital. Just had baby and a member of staff kept saying "aww does she look like her dad?" So I said "oh we have a donor as it's my wife and I who had the baby".
2 minutes later "does she get her hair from her daddy then?"

I repeated what I'd just said, and explained he isn't her dad, he's a donor and he does have dark hair but it's my wife and I who've had the baby. Then she asked again a few minutes later. I had to be really firm with her. I also filled in one of the feedback forms explaining what had happened and I didn't feel they were being very LGBT including.
Other staff members were fine.
I'd feed it back to them.
And congratulations!

MyNameIsNotMichele · 04/09/2022 04:26

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Justdancers · 04/09/2022 04:49

Id stick with names, specific circumstances

Had a similar experience where they wouldnt understand that we were married and kept trying to shoe me away as a visitor.

BritInAus · 04/09/2022 05:06

I'm really sorry you had this experience. I was very lucky when I had my DD, my (female) partner and I were treated just as I imagine a hetero couple would have been. I would absolutely share this feedback with the hospital. You don't need to name the race of the staff members. You just need to share the examples of what happened.

Sometimes - and we shouldn't have to - you need to be really explicit. So if they're doing the 'I don't understand' you need to talk as if talking to a toddler.
"we are both women. We are married. There is no Dad - I am the partner. She is pregnant, I am not. But we are wives." Really spell it out. No, you shouldn't have to... but if they continue to not treat you as partners/spouses after this, then even more reason to complain.

I really hope this time round is a much better experience for you!

Marvellousmadness · 04/09/2022 05:15

So.. they were homophobic and you went racist
Both beneath what it should be

Either you need to rise above the rediculous and petty comments or tell them she is your sister Or something

Because they wont change
But your sistuation of having to give birth wont
So you are the one that needs to change either your mindset by blockimg them out
Or having your partner immediately go above the head of the nurses if they are being homophobic.
Or just play dress up for the sake of mental peace.

The most important thing is a healthy baby

But it wont be a "traumatic" birth due to homophobia op. It could be a shitty birth for sure. But thats why you shouldnt let them in your head
You need to rise above
And have your partner advocate for you

I had my partner do all the talking in the hospital and i head my headset on with music
I couldnt hear the world. Bliss.

custardbear · 04/09/2022 05:16

Sone people really are rubbish! I'd do as pp said and toddler-splain everything if people are being stupid.
Congratulations and try to put that experience aside and enjoy your birth

autienotnaughty · 04/09/2022 05:18

It would be valid for you to make a complaint based on what you have said. It may be helpful to do so in terms of feedback for the hospital. I would mention race at all , it's really not relevant and stereotyping undermines your argument.

WB205020 · 04/09/2022 05:50

I wouldn’t put up with it at all. You state you are wives. There is no ‘father’ and if they continue tell them they are being offensive and homophobic. Call them out. Ask to speak to the midwife in charge and say you don’t want them near you.

When having our daughter we had a bad experience with a midwife. Not like your situation but she was not nice and during an emotional breakdown when the induction process wasn’t going to plan was really rude and unpleasant. Anyway a complaint was made and she got a serious reprimand.

unless you speak up this sort of thing continues. It’s hard I imagine so I understand it’s not easy but please try and call them out on it.

WB205020 · 04/09/2022 05:54

@Marvellousmadness OP did not go racist. They simply pointed out an ethnic origin and explained that a lot of people from that culture are homophobic of which OP is correct. Certain parts of Africa are very religious and anti gay. It just so happens these parts are predominantly black. Stating this is not racist. It’s simply describing a person or culture.

if OP was to say I don’t want a black midwife to come near me then that could be deemed racist but that is not what has been said.

Suzi888 · 04/09/2022 06:31

WB205020 · 04/09/2022 05:54

@Marvellousmadness OP did not go racist. They simply pointed out an ethnic origin and explained that a lot of people from that culture are homophobic of which OP is correct. Certain parts of Africa are very religious and anti gay. It just so happens these parts are predominantly black. Stating this is not racist. It’s simply describing a person or culture.

if OP was to say I don’t want a black midwife to come near me then that could be deemed racist but that is not what has been said.

100% this^

@Marvellousmadness OP was told only partner could be present? Have you actually read the OP post?

Surely there are loads of circumstances whereby a male isn’t present for birth and someone else attends. I would just say that - for an easy life.

LividLaVidaLoca · 04/09/2022 06:44

OP really, really shouldn’t be encouraged to say she is her wife’s SISTER for an easy life.

Really not on.

Dsisproblem · 04/09/2022 06:49

Yes saying OP is her sister is not good advice! Why should she need to do that?!

I would feedback to the other hospital. You don't need to mention race. They need to provide training to everyone on same sex relationships.

I'm sorry this happened to you and your wife. I'd mention your anxiety around it to your midwife so it can be put on your notes.

Suzi888 · 04/09/2022 06:50

LividLaVidaLoca · 04/09/2022 06:44

OP really, really shouldn’t be encouraged to say she is her wife’s SISTER for an easy life.

Really not on.

I know, I agree but giving birth is hard enough as it is. Without requesting a different team/hospital it’s a lot to deal with. Complaints take ages, then to have to deal with those staff whilst giving birth with them likely guessing it’s you who complained 😫 I can’t imagine going through that. 💐- For you OP I hope this time around is a better experience.

CrustyCrotch · 04/09/2022 07:00

Could you request a quick chat with the ward manager or whoever is in charge, and then ask them to please ensure that your notes clearly state your situation, so that staff don't get confused?

You could explain that there seemed to be some embarrassing and upsetting times when your first child was born, and that you're preempting this in advance, to save everyone from unnecessary confusion, although, of course, you aren't expecting that their staff will be confused.

Meklk · 04/09/2022 07:02

I'll never understand why some people think they can comment and judge at work. It's very unprofessional. Doesn't matter if you agree with something or your religion won't allow it. Midwifes should concentrate on their duties, not on their beliefs.

Dragoned · 04/09/2022 07:03

Goodness, I’m so sorry you experienced this. It is completely unacceptable. I personally would raise this with a senior midwifery colleague (head of midwifery or one of the matrons - contact details will be on their website) in an email so that training can be implemented or staff disciplined if necessary.

I would also talk to your community midwife about these experiences so that she can offer reassurance and make a plan for your birth. With my same sex clients (or single mums/other set ups), I usually make it abundantly clear on their notes (with permission) who their birthing partner is and their relationship with mum. Whilst it doesn’t completely prevent misunderstandings, it definitely helps.

Treesuphooray · 04/09/2022 07:25

Wtf with the homophobia on this thread!
Why on earth should OP and her wife do anything for an ‘easy life’. How would accepting discrimination lead to an easy life for them?

OP ask to talk with the lead midwife. Explain the experiences you had with baby 1 and ask how they can ensure that their staff treat you all with respect and dignity this time.

its really for the service to ensure that their staff are able to treat everyone with respect regardless of who they are.

congratulations on baby number 2!

chocolatesand · 04/09/2022 07:30

I agree that you should complain but I disagree with PPs that you shouldn’t mention the culture of the homophobic midwives. You highlight a very important observation that midwives from other cultures would perhaps benefit from some additional training into Western cultures. I’ve also spent an extended time in Africa and have first hand seen the homophobia. By ignoring the fact these midwives were from West Africa would not be highlighting the specific areas within the NHS where more training is required.

As another PP said, you’re not being racist by saying you don’t want a Black midwife. Race and culture are different.

chocolatesand · 04/09/2022 07:31

Oh and congratulations to you and your wife!

Moancup · 04/09/2022 07:37

I’m sorry you and your wife went through this.

I’m shocked some posters think you should “play dress up” and I hope you don’t give these ignorant comments any head space.

I think you should have complained soon after the birth. You don’t need to point out the race issue but you would have been absolutely within your rights to escalate homophobic behaviour.

I think this time around your wife will need to be super assertive - unfortunately - and explain at the earliest sign of “confusion” that she is your wife and the other parent. If that doesn’t work I’d say “this is not a confusing situation. Are we the first lesbian couple you’ve looked after?”

I’m sorry you have this extra stress to deal with.

Oysterbabe · 04/09/2022 07:40

If you mention race they will just assume that you are racist and not listen to what you're saying. It isn't relevant so stick to the facts and talk about what the people did and said.

chocolatesand · 04/09/2022 07:53

@Oysterbabe it’s not mentioning race though, it’s culture. There will be plenty of Black midwives not from West Africa who won’t be homophobic. It’s the culture of where these particular midwives are from that is contributing to the homophobia, not their race

BrownTableMat · 04/09/2022 07:56

And there are plenty of people from homophobic cultures who aren’t personally homophobic, and plenty of people from less homophobic cultures who are.

I’m sorry you had such an awful experience last time around. I agree with those upthread who say take race/culture out of it, and talk to someone senior about your past experience and ask them to ensure there is no repeat this time around.