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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

What to do about bad midwife experience?

101 replies

NotAgainPleased · 03/09/2022 23:10

Tricky and sensitive situation.

I’m a woman in a same sex relationship and am currently pregnant with our second child.

Wife had the first baby, at a big London teaching hospital where the care was generally really good, aside from the fact that it was covid and restrictions around going for appointments together etc applied. We did however have a few incidents of staff being clearly homophobic and I’m feeling quite scared that this is going to happen again with me and worried it will make what is already going to be a stressy birth (Im classed as high risk because of a medical condition) a really traumatic experience. The complicating factor is that the three staff who gave us a difficult time were all West African, and I know homophobia is more of an issue in parts of West Africa than it is here, so it feels like a bit of a common denominator. (Yes I do know they were West African, I’ve lived in Liberia and Ghana for a few months each, and I know the accents. Had an amazing time, aside from having to stay back in the closet.)

The worst incident was with one of the midwives who looked after us during my wife’s labour. She was only with us for two hours as was covering a break. A few examples of what happened though, firstly she asked me twice who I was and why I was there and once where the father was, despite me explaining that I was DW’s wife and the soon to arrive baby’s other parent and that there was no father. She said after each time I explained “I don’t know what you mean” then afterwards referred to me as DW’s friend or helper. Lots of dark looks when I was holding DW’s hand. And most upsetting of all when I was helping DW by changing the bed pad things they put under you to catch the amniotic fluid she actually physically knocked my hand away from DW, and snapped “I am the midwife, I look after the mother, you go and stand up there at other end by her head.” This last bit was so upsetting I had to quickly dash to the bathroom for a two minute cry, which I didn’t want to do in front of DW, before returning. We had both been awake for two days by this point, so the crying was unavoidable and I stopped very quickly and went back to DW. Had I been less tired / not where we were I might have pointed out that I was pretty well acquainted with DW’s nether regions and did not need to stay up by her head. Didn’t say anything at the time as she was only covering someone’s break and I didn’t want her to stop caring for DW somehow and soon we were being looked after by someone else who took us through to the end and was amazing.

Other incidents we had were with two staff members on the front desk of the maternity unit. (this was covid so for scans etc the pregnant one went up, waited to be called while partner hovered. Pregnant one then texted partner when called for appointment saying come up now at which point you went up to the front desk staff and signed in and got a pass). We saw both these two staff members twice for different scans and check ups and both got visibly confused when I had to go up to the desk and explain that my wife was upstairs waiting for her scan, and yes I was her wife not a sister. Cue the staff saying “I don’t understand who are you?” “If you are the wife why are you not upstairs getting the scan?” and “Fathers and partners only allowed upstairs.”

I’m worried something like this will happen again, but don’t really know how to try to preempt it without saying something that could come across as pretty racist. All three staff that gave us a hard time were definitely West African, and I know, from the news, as well as from having lived there that homophobia is a big thing. Not at all saying all first gen West Africans are homophobic or that no white people / people from other backgrounds are, but the reality is that was our experience and I don’t want a repeat of it while I’m in labour.

So what the bloody hell do I do? Nothing and hope for the best? Say something general about having had a bad experience with some seemingly prejudiced staff last time and not mention why or who?

OP posts:
Crocwok · 04/09/2022 12:39

NotAgainPleased · 04/09/2022 12:25

Thanks all for the advice / empathy. I think I will try to mention it, probably without referencing culture or backgrounds, but just in a “this happened, I don’t know if you’ll have a record of which staff member this was anymore, but can you let me know what steps you can take to make sure we don’t have to deal with any more “confused” or homophobic staff this time” sort of way. Will think about who to speak to and when.

I’m not too sure it will make a difference really as labour wards are understaffed and chaotic and you don’t know in advance who will be in charge of the ward when you do end up going in. So generally you just end up getting the staff you get and it’ll probably be down to luck.

I can see now that it would probably have helped to have complained then, both because the midwife might have been picked up on her behaviour and because we’d have it on record. At the time though I was just relieved when the midwife left, and we got someone great
to cover the next shift. Also felt a bit nervous about complaining during it all and then having to potentially go through loads of explanations while wife needed me and then having to still be on the ward and be treated by staff who know you’ve complained.

It is challenging to complain at the time so don't be hard on yourself.

Hvergelmir · 05/09/2022 13:30

Marvellousmadness · 04/09/2022 05:15

So.. they were homophobic and you went racist
Both beneath what it should be

Either you need to rise above the rediculous and petty comments or tell them she is your sister Or something

Because they wont change
But your sistuation of having to give birth wont
So you are the one that needs to change either your mindset by blockimg them out
Or having your partner immediately go above the head of the nurses if they are being homophobic.
Or just play dress up for the sake of mental peace.

The most important thing is a healthy baby

But it wont be a "traumatic" birth due to homophobia op. It could be a shitty birth for sure. But thats why you shouldnt let them in your head
You need to rise above
And have your partner advocate for you

I had my partner do all the talking in the hospital and i head my headset on with music
I couldnt hear the world. Bliss.

Of course OP shouldn't tell them she's her sister what a fucking disgusting suggestion.

ilyx · 05/09/2022 13:36

Definitely complain OP, I’m sure you aren’t the only gay people they’d treat this way in their care.

RedHelenB · 05/09/2022 14:03

If a midwife is there, I don't really see why you were changing pads ( unless possibly it's a homebirth) it's not really the partners remix of whatever sex.
However , it us unacceptable for Amy midwife nit to treat you the same as they would if it was a heterosexual relationship.

Babies do often look like their Dads though, and no amount of wishing will.change the fact that 50% of a child's DNA will be that of the man, he is the father even though he's a donor.

DiscoBadgers · 05/09/2022 14:08

re trying to change the pad - the reason the midwife needs to do it is to check that any amniotic fluid on it isn't meconium stained. The rest, however, sounds appalling. Are you having this baby at the same hospital?

lanthanum · 05/09/2022 14:16

I would explain to someone (perhaps at one of the prenatal visits) that you had problems last time as several staff did not seem aware that you were a same-sex couple, and ask what can be done to ensure that it's not an issue this time. It sounds as if most of the problems could have been averted if staff had just had their attention drawn to the fact that you were a same-sex couple. (I'm not sure you trying to help in the birthing room was an issue because you were female - it was just something they expect to do without interference.)

Dogtooth · 05/09/2022 14:24

(Half joking) can you wear t-shirts with 'lesbian mother' written on them in big letters?

YelloCar · 05/09/2022 14:31

Babies do often look like their Dads though, and no amount of wishing will.change the fact that 50% of a child's DNA will be that of the man, he is the father even though he's a donor.
It’s not about ‘wishing’ anything different @RedHelenB. It was obviously the fact they were using terms like ‘dad’ and ‘daddy’ and repeatedly asking about the donor that’s inappropriate. As a midwife surely you know that?

NotAgainPleased · 05/09/2022 14:31

DiscoBadgers · 05/09/2022 14:08

re trying to change the pad - the reason the midwife needs to do it is to check that any amniotic fluid on it isn't meconium stained. The rest, however, sounds appalling. Are you having this baby at the same hospital?

No that wasn’t it. We knew there was meconium staining, there had been from the start and the previous midwife had been happily letting me help, as it meant an extra pair of hands. The midwife could also easily see what was on the pads without needing to change them herself as they were those big pads you put on the bed, not sanitary towel type pads.

She just didn’t like me touching my wife / being close to her vagina. Hence why she slapped my hand away and snapped at me.

OP posts:
RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:32

Gee I thought you were actually going to say something terrible has happened, are you kidding me ?

As a straight woman I have suffered far far worse insensitivities than you have at the hands of midwives and just put it down to the fact that they’re busy. I’m quite keen on them saving my life at that point so they can just get on and do whatever they need to do. We just laugh about it later. Ex DH, got asked if he minded me having an episiotomy to save our daughters life and not to worry they’d stitch it up again nicely.
I don’t think he went for a cry in the toilets afterwards but I’ll ask him.

RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:36

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NotAgainPleased · 05/09/2022 14:38

RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:32

Gee I thought you were actually going to say something terrible has happened, are you kidding me ?

As a straight woman I have suffered far far worse insensitivities than you have at the hands of midwives and just put it down to the fact that they’re busy. I’m quite keen on them saving my life at that point so they can just get on and do whatever they need to do. We just laugh about it later. Ex DH, got asked if he minded me having an episiotomy to save our daughters life and not to worry they’d stitch it up again nicely.
I don’t think he went for a cry in the toilets afterwards but I’ll ask him.

It sounds like you had a shit experience and a crap midwife @RunningSME. Sorry to hear it 💐

I don’t think the fact that other people will have had worse experiences means that I should just be okay with the bad experience I and my partner had though.

There are women who lost babies, organs or their own lives due to medical mistakes, whose experience was undoubtedly worse that yours or mine. That doesn’t mean you or I can’t feel annoyed at our bad experiences and expect better.

OP posts:
RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:40

NotAgainPleased · 05/09/2022 14:38

It sounds like you had a shit experience and a crap midwife @RunningSME. Sorry to hear it 💐

I don’t think the fact that other people will have had worse experiences means that I should just be okay with the bad experience I and my partner had though.

There are women who lost babies, organs or their own lives due to medical mistakes, whose experience was undoubtedly worse that yours or mine. That doesn’t mean you or I can’t feel annoyed at our bad experiences and expect better.

I think you need to toughen up a bit and grow a bit of a thicker skin. And grow up tbh.

I didn’t have a shit time at all, I left the hospital in one piece with a healthy baby and literally that’s the only thing that matters. The baby grew up to be a lesbian and she would roll her eyes at your post.

YelloCar · 05/09/2022 14:41

Ex DH, got asked if he minded me having an episiotomy to save our daughters life and not to worry they’d stitch it up again nicely.
I don’t think he went for a cry in the toilets afterwards but I’ll ask him.
That’s obviously not him they’re offending with that question is it - it’s you. You’re the one who would have a cry in that situation. I hope you complained.

Just because you had a very shitty time @RunningSME doesn’t magic away anyone else who had a less shitty, but still shitty, time.

If you really want to argue that this is not homophobia then you need to have a word with yourself:
despite me explaining that I was DW’s wife and the soon to arrive baby’s other parent and that there was no father. She referred to me as DW’s friend or helper. Lots of dark looks when I was holding DW’s hand.

RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:43

@YelloCar of course I didn’t complain, that is half the problem with the NHS. Staff are too busy Fanning around dealing with shit like that and all the paperwork that comes with it, not to mention the relentless ridiculous courses and not enough time delivering safe care to patients.

NotAgainPleased · 05/09/2022 14:48

YelloCar · 05/09/2022 14:31

Babies do often look like their Dads though, and no amount of wishing will.change the fact that 50% of a child's DNA will be that of the man, he is the father even though he's a donor.
It’s not about ‘wishing’ anything different @RedHelenB. It was obviously the fact they were using terms like ‘dad’ and ‘daddy’ and repeatedly asking about the donor that’s inappropriate. As a midwife surely you know that?

Well it doesn’t really matter whether it was my remit or not. Partners (male or female) are generally encouraged to be more involved and help with little non medical things nowadays to support the birthing mum. It wasn’t something the midwife needed to do for a medical reason. If it had been she could have just explained and that would have been fine, it’s not like I was trying to take the episiotomy scissors off her or something. But it wasn’t something she needed to do for a medical reason. The previous midwife had asked if I could help with the pads a couple of times when she was also fetching something for my wife, and it meant my wife was being made comfortable faster by having dry pads under her in the bed.

If it had been for a medical reason she would have explained that, not slapped my hand and told me to go and stand up by the head.

I don’t think it was me who said a midwife had repeatedly asked if the baby looked like her dad. It was another poster talking about her and her partners experiences as a same sex couple. I imagine the issue wasn’t that the poster wanted the midwife to magically imagine that the baby shared half of each of the two mums DNA, and more that she found it a bit off for the midwife to keep using the words dad and daddy after she had repeatedly explained that the baby had two mums and a donor, not a dad.

Our baby for the record absolutely has our donors colouring, but my wife’s features and we love it. Nobody is denying biology here.

OP posts:
YelloCar · 05/09/2022 14:48

I left the hospital in one piece with a healthy baby and literally that’s the only thing that matters.
I don’t know if you know this @RunningSME but it is actually possible to have a healthy baby and not be treated like shit. They needed to perform an episiotomy but they didn’t need to make that disgusting remark to your ExH about ‘stitching you up nicely’.

If that’s the sort of thing you think you should accept then you need to raise the bar for yourself.

Quitelikeit · 05/09/2022 14:49

I would have reported this behaviour right after ensuring the baby was delivered safely!

Also not sure why you were down near your wives privates what was that about?

ilyx · 05/09/2022 14:50

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What an anal weirdo you are. Do you realise gay men use surrogates?! So they will also likely have to be around gay male couples, sorry I have to spell that out to you.

LuckySantangelo35 · 05/09/2022 14:50

RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:40

I think you need to toughen up a bit and grow a bit of a thicker skin. And grow up tbh.

I didn’t have a shit time at all, I left the hospital in one piece with a healthy baby and literally that’s the only thing that matters. The baby grew up to be a lesbian and she would roll her eyes at your post.

@RunningSME

urgh no

i hate your attitude

a healthy baby isn’t all that matters

Attitudes like yours is why women suffer horrendous birth injuries with ongoing issues like incontinence etc and no one gives a shit because of the “all that matters is a healthy baby and u should be grateful for that and complain” trope

RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:51

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LuckySantangelo35 · 05/09/2022 14:52

RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:43

@YelloCar of course I didn’t complain, that is half the problem with the NHS. Staff are too busy Fanning around dealing with shit like that and all the paperwork that comes with it, not to mention the relentless ridiculous courses and not enough time delivering safe care to patients.

@RunningSME

you should have complained

it was a disgusting and inappropriate comment

you must have a lot of internalised misogyny if you think that it was ok for a comment like that to be made about you

RunningSME · 05/09/2022 14:54

LuckySantangelo35 · 05/09/2022 14:52

@RunningSME

you should have complained

it was a disgusting and inappropriate comment

you must have a lot of internalised misogyny if you think that it was ok for a comment like that to be made about you

@LuckySantangelo35 course it’s not okay and as I said we had a laugh about it afterwards how very funny it was that it was not okay that they made that comment.
However, and this may be why there are cultural differences described in the original OP I was just really glad to just get out of there with a baby in one piece and I’d imagine if you ask most women from different continents they feel quite a similar way. we’re not there to have an experience, we are not there to have an Instagram moment it’s a medical setting and a good medical outcome is really the main focus of the event anything else is a bonus.

ilyx · 05/09/2022 14:55

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They will still be interacting with the father and so can be homophobic towards him 🤦‍♀️

“Took the bait”?! You need help. Get off mumsnet and go outside.

NotAgainPleased · 05/09/2022 14:56

Quitelikeit · 05/09/2022 14:49

I would have reported this behaviour right after ensuring the baby was delivered safely!

Also not sure why you were down near your wives privates what was that about?

What a strange remark@Quitelikeit ahhhh I was down near my wife’s privates because I was helping change the pads that had been spread out on the bed under her privates. I was also down near her privates about ten hours later when the baby was coming out and the better midwife was asking me to help my wife hold back her legs because she was so exhausted from her three day labour that she needs us to hold one leg each to get the baby out safely. Plenty of blokes do that too when their wife is in labour. There’s nothing sexual or odd about it at all. It’s birth, and it’s one of the purposes of the vagina!!!

Though I do also obviously get down near my wife’s privates in a sexual way, because we’re gay. In much the same way I imagine you also get down near your own partners privates.

OP posts: