4 year old saying nasty things

Longtimeposternc · 2022-08-16T12:33:13+00:00

My DS is usually a very well behaved child. He has randomly started to tell his younger sibling, me and DH to “shut up”, “go away” and calling us “stupid” “idiot” etc. he fully understands these are naughty words and laughs because I get cross. I have absolutely no idea where he has learnt this stuff - it’s not the sort of thing we ever say at home and I assume it’s from a couple of summer clubs he has done. I’m feeling a bit down about it as he keeps doing it and I would really love some advice on how to handle please. He does say sorry afterwards but then he just does it again so 🤷🏻♀️🤷🏻♀️🤷🏻♀️ He’s my first as well so not sure if everyone just does this or it’s just him! Thanks all

phishy · 16/08/2022 13:41

I can see why it would upset you. He is pushing boundaries, so don't let it get yu down.

What consequences does he face when he says these things?

Porcupineintherough · 16/08/2022 13:43

4 is when your child starts to really be exposed to outside influences and when they start to pick up undesirable behaviour. In that sense it's totally normal. It's also a good age to start teaching him to control his behaviour regardless of the behaviour of others.
What sort of consequences do you usually use for bad behaviour or is this the first time you are really encountering any?

PollyRockets · 16/08/2022 13:46

He is 4, this is very typical behaviour

But key is what consequences does he get?

If he keeps repeating the bag behaviour I'm guessing they're either non existent or not effective

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 13:47

Porcupineintherough · 16/08/2022 13:43

4 is when your child starts to really be exposed to outside influences and when they start to pick up undesirable behaviour. In that sense it's totally normal. It's also a good age to start teaching him to control his behaviour regardless of the behaviour of others.
What sort of consequences do you usually use for bad behaviour or is this the first time you are really encountering any?

This is really the first instance we have had of poor behaviour, which i suppose is why it’s upsetting me.

i have tried a few things over the week (it started approx 1 week ago) so have been quite inconsistent. When DH is home he takes him to his room, and then they have a little chat. But I can’t do that home alone with 3 of them, so I have been doing more of a “we don’t say that, that’s not kind. We aren’t playing together if you’re not kind”
and he says sorry. But clearly it’s all pretty ineffectual. We did say we weren’t taking him to the playground at the weekend as he said shut up to his brother, but then he was crying and saying sorry and I had lots of chores to do so needed him gone…

all ideas extremely welcome because I’m failing

OP posts:

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 13:48

PollyRockets · 16/08/2022 13:46

He is 4, this is very typical behaviour

But key is what consequences does he get?

If he keeps repeating the bag behaviour I'm guessing they're either non existent or not effective

Guessing correctly!

OP posts:

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 13:51

Btw the other issue is his 2 year old brother is now copying the bad words and I can’t exactly meet out the same punishments so I’m not sure what to do with that either 🤦🏻‍♀️

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Stickmansmum · 16/08/2022 13:55

Actually I disagree with some of the above.

My 4yr old (4th child) does this when he’s looking for ‘the consequences’. He’s actively trying to make me mad and send him to the hall or deny him a screen so that he can unleash the almighty rage he is needing to let out at that moment. The easy thing to do is a sharp reprimand and a punishment of some sort but actually the best solution I’ve found….

Instead of reacting exactly as they are driving you to I go to their level with a soft/pitying face and say ‘aw pet, we don’t speak like that in our family. Now I think you need a hug’ and he is both deflated by my non reaction and crumbles because actually what he did need was a hug or a reason for comfort.

won’t always work if your child really wants to see a temper through but with my current youngest it always works because he is looking for major levels or attention in a negative way but I give it in an unexpectedly positive way while communicating that what he said doesn’t fit with the family tone.

Iwanttoliveonamountain · 16/08/2022 13:57

Try benching him each time he does it. 1 minute for each year of his life. Not in his room. make sure he can see the fun the others are having. Explain to him what will happen if he uses those unkind words. Then when it happens do not get into a discussion/ sorry chat. Make the benching your only response.

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 13:58

Stickmansmum · 16/08/2022 13:55

Actually I disagree with some of the above.

My 4yr old (4th child) does this when he’s looking for ‘the consequences’. He’s actively trying to make me mad and send him to the hall or deny him a screen so that he can unleash the almighty rage he is needing to let out at that moment. The easy thing to do is a sharp reprimand and a punishment of some sort but actually the best solution I’ve found….

Instead of reacting exactly as they are driving you to I go to their level with a soft/pitying face and say ‘aw pet, we don’t speak like that in our family. Now I think you need a hug’ and he is both deflated by my non reaction and crumbles because actually what he did need was a hug or a reason for comfort.

won’t always work if your child really wants to see a temper through but with my current youngest it always works because he is looking for major levels or attention in a negative way but I give it in an unexpectedly positive way while communicating that what he said doesn’t fit with the family tone.

You may be right/that’s why I’m struggling very badly to find the way to address it - it’s so unclear to me what’s going on. The fact that he is giggling afterwards suggests he knows he is going to get told off and is looking for a reaction so perhaps you are right and I can give that a go. Although there is the risk of essentially rewarding bad behaviour/my 2 year old seeing that happening and thinking “shut up” gets a hug!

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Iwanttoliveonamountain · 16/08/2022 14:00

just noticed my post is completely the opposite of the one before. different things work for different personalities.

Stickmansmum · 16/08/2022 14:01

The giggling is a power trip and punishment doesn’t work well with that mindset. Sounds cruel but you want to frame it as their behaviour is embarrassing to them to get them to stop that particular one.

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 14:04

Stickmansmum · 16/08/2022 14:01

The giggling is a power trip and punishment doesn’t work well with that mindset. Sounds cruel but you want to frame it as their behaviour is embarrassing to them to get them to stop that particular one.

hes actually someone who does laugh when he’s been told off and I’ve always assumed it’s embarrass laughter but I am not sure if he can be embarrassed when he’s doing it deliberately like this!

re “benching”, is that like a naughty step or something? Tbh I think if I told him
to sit somewhere he would just say “no”
a nd if I put him on a chair he would get off.

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KettrickenSmiled · 16/08/2022 14:11

he fully understands these are naughty words and laughs because I get cross
Oh poor OP, it's exhausting & enraging & I feel for you!
But you will get through it by reminding yourself that this is just a phase, & it will pass.

Meantime you need to school yourself not to get cross (seethe inwardly as much as you like though).
Crossness is rewarding him with negative attention. Informing him that he has the power to wind you up. Letting him know that he can control the family dynamic by acting out.
Next time he does it, try @Stickmansmum excellent response -
Instead of reacting exactly as they are driving you to I go to their level with a soft/pitying face and say ‘aw pet, we don’t speak like that in our family. Now I think you need a hug’ and he is both deflated by my non reaction and crumbles because actually what he did need was a hug or a reason for comfort.

We did say we weren’t taking him to the playground at the weekend as he said shut up to his brother, but then he was crying and saying sorry and I had lots of chores to do so needed him gone…
Lovie I'm not gonna scold you for being human & grabbing the easy way out - on one occasion! - because you already know you can't keep doing this, right?
Try Stickmansmum's technique.
Keep at it for a few days (be prepared for an Extinction Burst).
If that still doesn't work - impose the cosequences AND STICK TO THEM.
Then get back to the "aw pet" pitying/soft technique.
www.parentingforbrain.com/extinction-burst/

You'll get there OP.
It's really hard when they get smart enough to know which buttons to press

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 14:15

KettrickenSmiled · 16/08/2022 14:11

he fully understands these are naughty words and laughs because I get cross
Oh poor OP, it's exhausting & enraging & I feel for you!
But you will get through it by reminding yourself that this is just a phase, & it will pass.

Meantime you need to school yourself not to get cross (seethe inwardly as much as you like though).
Crossness is rewarding him with negative attention. Informing him that he has the power to wind you up. Letting him know that he can control the family dynamic by acting out.
Next time he does it, try @Stickmansmum excellent response -
Instead of reacting exactly as they are driving you to I go to their level with a soft/pitying face and say ‘aw pet, we don’t speak like that in our family. Now I think you need a hug’ and he is both deflated by my non reaction and crumbles because actually what he did need was a hug or a reason for comfort.

We did say we weren’t taking him to the playground at the weekend as he said shut up to his brother, but then he was crying and saying sorry and I had lots of chores to do so needed him gone…
Lovie I'm not gonna scold you for being human & grabbing the easy way out - on one occasion! - because you already know you can't keep doing this, right?
Try Stickmansmum's technique.
Keep at it for a few days (be prepared for an Extinction Burst).
If that still doesn't work - impose the cosequences AND STICK TO THEM.
Then get back to the "aw pet" pitying/soft technique.
www.parentingforbrain.com/extinction-burst/

You'll get there OP.
It's really hard when they get smart enough to know which buttons to press

Thank you!! Will try that - and will read the link now.

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Iwanttoliveonamountain · 16/08/2022 14:19

Its a bit like footballers being 'on the bench' maybe he's too young.

but the consequences have to be immediate and meaningful - watching others have fun is not a punishment more an opportunity for learning.
He is repeating this behaviour because somehow he enjoys the reaction.

good luck

Cannotmakeadecison · 16/08/2022 14:20

Sorry OP, no advice but this did make me chuckle. We’ve all been there.

We did say we weren’t taking him to the playground at the weekend as he said shut up to his brother, but then he was crying and saying sorry and I had lots of chores to do so needed him gone…

Icanstillrecallourlastsummer · 16/08/2022 14:24

My DS does this when he is angry/ upset. It's just a 4 yo version of a tantrum, and often it's testing the conditionality of our love (he will often say something mean, and then say we don't love him). I try go with the don't rise to it and name the feeling. "I can hear from your words you are feeling angry/ sad/ upset" and then try to react to that feeling. 4 is still very very young, and it's normal for them to be exploring their negative feeling with those they love the most.

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 14:24

Cannotmakeadecison · 16/08/2022 14:20

Sorry OP, no advice but this did make me chuckle. We’ve all been there.

We did say we weren’t taking him to the playground at the weekend as he said shut up to his brother, but then he was crying and saying sorry and I had lots of chores to do so needed him gone…

Thank you - it wasn’t my finest moment but good to know it’s not just me…

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2bazookas · 16/08/2022 14:25

Take him to his room, and say "You have been rude and unkind. You need to stay here because we don't want that talk in this family. When you're ready to be nice again, you can come downstairs". Then leave him there.

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 14:26

Icanstillrecallourlastsummer · 16/08/2022 14:24

My DS does this when he is angry/ upset. It's just a 4 yo version of a tantrum, and often it's testing the conditionality of our love (he will often say something mean, and then say we don't love him). I try go with the don't rise to it and name the feeling. "I can hear from your words you are feeling angry/ sad/ upset" and then try to react to that feeling. 4 is still very very young, and it's normal for them to be exploring their negative feeling with those they love the most.

Yes - I do keep reminding myself he’s only little. It just feels very hard as I haven’t experienced this yet and the default response to being told to shut up etc is generally “wtf?!”. I’m sure by the time my youngest is at this stage I’ll be rolling my eyes!

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Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 14:28

2bazookas · 16/08/2022 14:25

Take him to his room, and say "You have been rude and unkind. You need to stay here because we don't want that talk in this family. When you're ready to be nice again, you can come downstairs". Then leave him there.

This is essentially what we do when DH is home but he just lets himself out of the room. He says sorry but he does it again so I don’t think it’s working! Worth trying the cuddling approach

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Kikospeedo · 16/08/2022 14:29

We ar going through exactly the same with our 4 year old so these replies are so useful to see. Op, I’m with you in solidarity!

Original poster

Longtimeposternc · 16/08/2022 14:31

Kikospeedo · 16/08/2022 14:29

We ar going through exactly the same with our 4 year old so these replies are so useful to see. Op, I’m with you in solidarity!

Solidarity helps. God speed…

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PollyRockets · 16/08/2022 14:48

@Longtimeposternc

If you put him on a naughty step and he got off you simply put him back on

And you repeat until he stays on for the time you've decided on.

Parenting takes effort unfortunately, you seem to have faced a small challenge when trying to teach him consequences and give up

PollyRockets · 16/08/2022 14:49

@Longtimeposternc same applies for putting him in his room

If he comes out he is put right back in there.