To not send DD on Brownie camp?

[BrownieCampYesorNo]

This is not about them money I won’t be asking for a refund and will still pay the rest of the money if she doesn’t go. But I have to decide this week if she goes so that the space can be offered up if she doesn’t.

DD is 8, it’s her first ever camp in October half term and is for 3 days/2 nights. Here the Rainbows don’t do them and the one she should have had in October last year was cancelled due to covid and nothing else arranged since. It’s not just DDs Brownies going another Brownies unit and the Guides are going so if she doesn’t go the space will be offered up and most likely filled (there’s 20-30 girls in each unit but only 50 places on camp).

DD has some SN and has always regressed at times. She has dyslexia and severe joint hypermobility syndrome, she’s also suspected dyspraxic. She has processing and memory issues, she can forget something two seconds after you say it, she can follow instructions but they need to be broken down a lot.

I’m not worried about her behaviour bar there being a 90% chance she’ll lose at least 1 item of clothing, she’s pretty well behaved. School have said they have no concerns about her around fire and she's always been fine with not touching a hot oven when at home so she's not likely to be a danger.

But she’s suddenly unable to do even the basics. As I said regression is normal during the big long summer but it’s almost like she’s regressed 4 years and is just about to start school, not just about to start Year 4.

She’s now unable to put on trousers; she gets both legs in one hole, she won’t allow me to help her gets upset and cries. She’s struggling with none laced shoes – as in she can’t even do up the tape or get them to stay on her feet. She can’t do buttons and never has been able to, she wanted a zip up hoodie on yesterday and couldn’t do the zip. She keeps losing things including her glasses which are kept in the same place usually but she keeps putting them down and forgetting where they are. She’s also falling over a lot more again when I thought we’d dealt with these issues.

I am of course going to try and contact the various people who’re involved with her care including the GP but the chances of being able to get any actual treatment before the camp is slim.

There is likely to be another camp around Easter but I won’t know for sure until around Christmas when they announce the calendar for 2023.

So AIBU to not send her? I feel guilty as she’s really excited about it but I don't know if I can consciously send her when she might make more work for the leaders.

If she’s really excited about it then I would keep her place. The great thing about Brownies is how inclusive it is to those with differing levels of needs.

If she is still struggling by October half term then you can discuss how to help the leaders include her - it might mean you have to volunteer to go along.

My DD is a young leader in Brownies and she would have no qualms helping your DD and neither would any of the other n leaders. My DD looked after a Brownie with ASD at the last overnight camp and they had specific plans in place if the activities were too much for her so she could still take part but not be overwhelmed. The whole point of Brownies is to empower kids to do things they might not normally do. Speak to Brown Owl and explain your concerns and I'm 100% sure they will come up with a plan that works for you and your DD.

I think have a chat with the leaders. They will likely be supportive (and if not, there’s your answer, don’t send her!) Remember kids behave differently with parents/other adults/their peers - she might not sit on the floor and cry about her trousers if her friends are watching. It sounds unlikely that she has literally lost the skills she needs to get dressed if she had them previously, there must be something happening mentally/behaviourally to mean she is struggling, and again, you might find she is ok when away with others…

I’ve done guide camps and school residentials and everyone misplaces stuff - just don’t send anything valuable and make sure it is labelled and you’re likely to get it back.

Guide Leader here. Send her. We have literally all levels of needs - as long as you are upfront about it we can help. Girls are also very good at helping out others even with basics

Can you talk to the leaders? If they know in advance they will be able to help her with many of these things discreetly if that’s your worry - she won’t be left with no shoes and unable to do up her jacket! With the trousers that’s a bit trickier, I’d want her doing that herself. Would it help to walk her through it in a non stressed time? My son is autistic and I find a big stress is trying to teach him to do things when it really needs to be done. Like trying to get him to put shoes on when we’re stressed and in a rush to get out the door. Whereas if we walk through it at a calmer time when there’s no pressure he gets the practice he needs to be more confident in it. Maybe she could practice sitting down on her bed and holding her trousers correctly so that she’s putting one leg in at a time.

I would still send her, have a chat with the leaders I'm sure they will be very supportive.

When my dd was younger she had a huge issue with food, not an allergy but a problem regarding texture and food touching. I spoke to the leaders of dad's adventure camp and they said if they had to make a certain food each night to ensure dd was fed then they would.

She actually amazed them all with what she ate and only a couple of times during the course of the week did they have to step in and make something different.

Does your DD have an adjustment plan with Brownies? The Leaders do have access to a pro forma that you can fill in. Whilst all Leaders and Young Leaders are volunteers, they will try and help with any reasonable adjustments so your DD can access Brownies.

I agree first thing is to chat to the leaders, ultimatelythey have to be comfortablewith her needs. You say there's usually some regression during the holidays would she have improved more after being back at school ?

Don't stop her going! It's a great age to go away and build confidence. Just have a chat with the leaders. They will be helpful.

Can you volunteer at the camp?
I have a 9yo with less needs than your daughter and that's what I'm doing to get her there (refusing to try it otherwise, anxiety, similar concentration / processing issues to your dd)

Brownie & guide leader here, please send her. Your daughter will have so much fun and gain so much independence. Let the leaders know your concerns but I can guarantee they have seen it all before. We're used to taking just turned 7's away who have never stayed away from home, the other brownie rally round to help these girls get ready etc.

Oh my, if there was any camp I’d still send her on it would be Brownie. My 17 year old DD is a young leader, they have a camp starting a week on Monday for 4 nights. She’s specifically going as a 1-1 support for a wee lass of 7 (obvs other adult support to but it has reassured this little lass that she has DD all to herself (per se).

Thanks everyone

Leaders are aware of her difficulties but she doesn't have a specific plan in place other than her being able to finish things at home or sit out of games as she's never normally needed it.

Will have a chat though with the Leader and see what she suggests.

Is the camp local, so could you pop over if she needs some help, or she just stays for the day and comes home at night if necessary?

I don’t mean to worry you but that level of regression is significant. Are you sure there is not some sort of childhood neurodegenerative disease going on?? (I’m an ex-nurse).

I was a Cub leader until recently, I'd have been happy to accommodate her, and very appreciative of a chat about her needs beforehand. All my Cubs, even the littlest Beaver, would come back from camp little a bit more skilled and confident. (I know that Cubs and Brownies are part of different organisations, but their approaches to empowering young people with skills are similar).

Another brownie leader here. If she wants to go and is happy to be helped with some of the tasks she finds hard, then send her. She will gain so much from the experience and it's literally what Guiding volunteers thrive on.

Please ask for a referral to a paediatrician as loading skills should never be ignored

Loosing

My dd has dyspraxia she is an adult now, but loved going to Brownie then guide camp , her Brownie leaders were brilliant sure she might have come home with a missing pj top and her hair brushing questionable 😀 but that didn't matter she had a great time. Don't hold your dd back because you are worried that's not fair on her, speak to the leaders and let Dd go.

@AceSpades54321 agreed

My dd has some extra needs, when I wasn't sure if she would cope with her school residential I had a plan in place to collect her as the others went to bed and drop her back for breakfast in the morning. She still got to do all the activities and enjoy the evening excitement but then came home so I could help with wash/dress/routine - would something like that be possible as a back up? I wouldn't give up her place, a lot can change between now and then.

As a parent of a child of similar age with SN, I would say send her, after speaking to the leaders and confirming they are able to facilitate her needs.

My child just went on a sleepover and she adored it. She struggles in school but did really well in an outdoor activity orientated environment.

Quite likely that your dd will surprise you with how well she copes.

@AceSpades54321 She's always regressed in summer holidays or breaks from school/nursery. She usually does it when gaining a new skill too, by Christmas she'll be back to herself with even more skills. It's just the way she's always grown/developed. It worried me the first time it happened but I'm so used to it now.

@toomuchlaundry It's in the next village, we have to drop off at the camp and pick up from the camp after as it's only a 10 minute drive from home.