To object to "She's not peddling on the back"

[ArseOnSaddle]

DH and I have ridden a tandem for about 10 years. We absolutely love it, it's much more social than having separate bikes, and there is a brilliant teamwork thing where you have to work together and synchronise your actions to maximise your speed.

Tandems are generally set up so the stronger rider is at the front, as it takes a lot of upper body strength to steer the combined weight of two people. So generally in heterosexual couples, the man is on the front and the women is the "stoker".

However, it makes us an irresistible target for the inevitable shout of "She's not peddling at the back". It's always some smartarse bloke, often not looking like he does any exercise at all, and it's started to really wind me up. Especially when we've just slogged up some endless mountain climb (which is really tough and slow on a tandem) and I've been working my arse off for hours. It just feels really discouraging and sexist - like my effort is invisible.

However, we recently had a quite unpleasant interaction where I expressed my frustration with the comment and the guy took massive exception - because it was only a friendly joke - and I really wished I hadn't said anything.

So is the only possible response to ignore it? It is so frequent and so very irritating!

YABU : It's a joke, get over yourself.
YANBU: It is pretty sexist and annoying.

^ Wrong thread!

Given you're not naturally athletic:

"He knows how privileged he is that I come along"
"He's keeping me sweet"
"He's the brawn, I'm the beauty"
"Somebody has to admire the countryside"

I'm totally athletically declined but do (exercise) stuff I can because ... I enjoy it. Enjoy it At my level. I don't like feeling out of control on a tandem, so you're doing wildly better than I can manage to have fun on it.

I love to see a tandem but, really sorry for my ignorance, what exactly is a stoker in this situation?

Oh it doesn't have to be the same every time. I remember an alternative version my Dad taught me. Ahem.

Daisy, Daisy the coppers are after you.
If they catch you they'll give you a month or two.
They'll tie you up with wire
Behind a Black Mariah.
But you'll look swell
Pedalling like hell
On a bicycle made for two.

Meh, it's just a joke.
Maybe not an original one but a joke nonetheless.

I love to see a tandem but, really sorry for my ignorance, what exactly is a stoker in this situation?

Presumably the one on the back who isn’t steering.

Lunar270, I think you've hit the nail on the head. It is sensitive for me because I'm not naturally athletic and it has an emotional weight that isn't there with other "banter".

Sorry to hear. Fwiw I don't think it's malicious but clearly it's a sensitive issue and so isn't as easy as just brushing it off.

I think in situations like this, the sad thing is that you're never going to change people's behaviour as it's so fleeting and you're not in a position to realistically educate (not that you'd want to whilst cycling anyway).

You say you're not naturally athletic but I'm a cyclist and it's bloody hard work so you're doing yourself a disservice. I'm no athlete either but enjoy it all the same. That's all that really matters and your OH clearly enjoys going out with you as there's no escape on a tandem. As you say, it'd be obvious if one person wasn't doing their bit so you must be his equal or it wouldn't be much fun at all.

You can't change others but neither should you be hard on yourself.

Get a T-Shirt printed with

“I am peddling and you’re not funny”

on the back?

Call back 'That's original!'

I do love it when parents point us out to their kids though, they always get an extra enthusiastic wave from me 😊

On a classic tandem set up, the one at the front is called the pilot - because they steer. The one at the back is the stoker because they just provide power - i assume like the stoker of an engine. It's a lovely name for being on the back because it does recognise the effort you put in!

In a comparable situation I sometimes find myself in, I adopt my best teacher look and ask "Did you think that was funny?"

Tandems are great, I used to ride one with a friend occasionally years ago.

What about "he's only pulling, I'm pushing!"

Peddling what? Drugs?

Usually when I read these things I think, ah, let it go, but reading your post OP I had a different response. I'm not averse to language but tend to keep things polote with strangers, however in this case I'd be tempted calmly say fuck off. Maybe it's the heat.

Yabu for writing peddling. It's pedalling, as it involves pedals.

I've ridden tandems with DH (taller and stronger than me) and a female friend. I've found that it's not necessarily the strongest person who should be at the front: it's the person less able to trust the other. The person at the back has to not steer, which is quite hard when holding handlebars! They have to basically submit to the steering of the front.

So the dickhead comments are just that - and annoying - but the reason most men sit in the front IMO isn't because they have to have any great skill at steering (it's just like steering a bike - as long as the person behind isn't also trying to steer), it's actually quite inherently sexist. Plus, the smaller person behind means they have less of a view.

Why don't you experiment with you in front and see what comments you get. I actually think you'll get the same, but about him not pedalling. However, I'm going to get that you can steer it just fine, but he won't be as able to relax and let you be in charge. How many times will he manage not to swerve "for you" or turn "for you"? And I also don't mean he's a big old sexist, I think it's quite deep-rooted and most men don't want to sit behind the woman in charge.. I'd love to be proven wrong!

Always pleasef to give the pedants their moment! Did realise as soon as I'd posted but no way to edit a mumsnet post. Glad you enjoyed it.

Interesting thoughts here. DP has always said that it's harder upper body work than steering a single bike because if you over steer it's quite a lot of effort to correct it. Particularly on rough ground, that does seem to me to be true. And our tandem is very much set up for the longer legs at the front, so I don't know how easy it will be to reverse that. The view thing is less of an issue as I'm quite long bodied and certainly don't feel I'm just staring at his back the whole time. But you make some good points. And I wouldn't share a tandem with anyone I didn't trust.

The general principle for safe tandem management is that the heavier person needs to be in front. There's only 5-6 kg between me & DH (he's heavier). He definitely should go in front of me. As someone who has ridden a lot with big kid(s) in back, it does take a lot of strength to steer the long tandem with lots weight to manage in back. And yes of course, my kids got comments about not pedaling. They put their feet on bottle cages if bored/tired, fine by me. I was just happy they were comfortable.

The person in front also supplies the majority of the power, btw, on average, they have to do that to provide safe steering & control, never mind hauling their heavier body along. I do agree with PP that there's a lot of trust invested in the pilot, which is why you need to know that you have a safe set up.

On the tandem theme, we were in the Lakes at the weekend doing some Wainwrights. On the way home we had to drive over the Kirkstone Pass and overtook a bike-packing tandem couple slogging their way up the pass. We gave them a shout (not banter) of encouragement on the way up and got a wave back. We stopped off for a drink at the pub at the top, which has a kind of beer garden/viewpoint/car park - oh my word, the cheering that couple got from about fifty people who had been watching them head up the hill was amazing, and about five people offered to buy them a beer :-)

I know how a tandem works. If this is how you respond to chat then it does not surprise me that you blow up when someone tries to have a laugh with you. Maybe have a sign on your bike telling people not to engage you. Its not worth the trouble.

Tessa, I think you've misunderstood my post.

I genuinely thought you didn't know how a tandem works. Because both legs have to go round together, being able to see the back person is irrelevant. It literally is not possible for an observer to see whether the stoker is pedalling or not, while the front person definitely knows how much effort is being put in.

So my comment was that it is a truly fatuous joke because it's not possible for "her" not to pedal.

I really wasn't calling your post fatuous and wouldn't dream of doing so. I'm so sorry if that's how it came across.

Lovely!

You can't put your feet up if you're an adult though because the pedals drag on the floor!