Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

First family dog?

213 replies

gotelltheoldmandowntheroad · 09/08/2022 18:41

Husband wants a German Shepherd, he also likes XL Bully and Rottweiler.

I am open to a dog but...

small house
do not want fur everywhere

We have two cats already so would look into getting a puppy.
We have a big garden and both often work from home so wouldn't leave him alone.

I know about having dogs, had them before, but not too keen, I'm a cat person. Husband and child are keen. Husband spoke about "family protection" but ultimately we are animal lovers but that seems to be a factor for him.

My questions are:

Dogs that won't add the least to my cleaning burden (that's my bag)

Safest around the child (from puppy and trained)

Perhaps that a non-dog person might like best?

Given he's mentioned those three breeds, which would you go for? Child is 6.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
Bleepitandbleepitagain · 09/08/2022 21:38

@k1233

The bark really is enough! My big boy is a dope but jesus, few occasions it was needed his voice is enough to send shivers. Especially when he is standing loyally by your side.

Parents had a westie, lovely loyal breeds. And their bark is massive compared to their size!

So sorry you went through a stalker situation :(

Wolfiee · 09/08/2022 21:47

WiddlinDiddlin · 09/08/2022 21:34

Oh yep, this is very much my lane right now (sorting a breed database to give info to new owners)...

1 - under NO circumstances do you get a dog to act as protection for family. Do not do it, it is fucking dangerous. And certainly not if the plan is to send the dog off to be trained using shock collars and prong collars or if DH is a newbie to bite sports and fancies a crack at them. Just don't.

2 - those breeds, no no and no.

Gsd - damn near impossible to get a healthy one outside of working lines and you absolutely do NOT need or want a working line gsd at this point. So many have dodgy temperaments, do you want to be rehabbing a reactive fearful dog for the next four years?

XL Bully - unhealthy, poor temperament, 99% of breeders I wouldn't buy a soft toy from. Too big, too dribbly, don't do it.

Rottie - again, as puppies these are clumsy and daft, they are FAR too easy to misunderstand, mishandle and fuck up, and the only breeders willing to sell to someone who wants a protection dog, and has a 6 year old in the house is again, someone i wouldn't buy a soft toy from.

Examine EXACTLY what H thinks he wants from a 'protection' dog.

MY goal from a dog that will keep me safe is - big enough that people think twice, superduper incredibly easily trainable such that I can teach a big bark and a growl on cue, but of the temperament that ACTUALLY thinks everyone in the world is a friend.

This way I can cue the scary 'fuck off right now or ill eat your face' behaviours, but should an accident occur, no ones actually getting injured.

The probably with many of the 'protection' breeds is that they're either TERRIFIED and highly likely to make mistakes (GSD, Doberman, this is why police are now using Malinois) OR... they are high as kites off their tits wanting to BITE stuff, and if not intensively trained and super well managed will bite the wrong people (see, police dogs biting the wrong people, quite a lot).

So you want a dog that looks the part, can be trained to bluff, but is in fact safe as a dog can actually be.

If Husband actually wants to do some dog sports and training and isn't just thinking of his ego... then:

Picardy Sheepdog is a good choice, some of the same traits of the GSD, a courageous nature, very easily trained, sufficiently large most people think twice but not so large they're a pain in the arse to house, and being a rough coated shaggy breed they also take people by surprise... and don't shed like a GSD.

Superduper well bred Mastiff - not so easy to train, far better temperament and health than the XL Bully. They do shed needle like hair everywhere that is a pain in the arse to get up and they have a tendancy to smell a bit... cheesey.

Large Munsterlander - from the gundog group, not quite a setter, not a spaniel, bigger and more robust than the latter but less scatty than the former, very trainable, willing to do fun training and dog sports, easily trained to growl and bark on cue.

Briard - similarly capable as the Picardy, their roots are in droving and guarding livestock on the move, very trainable, very loyal to family, something that you would shit your pants if it growled or barked at you on cue. Downside is of course theres a LOT of grooming of one of these (but they don't shed much at all!).

If you discount the protection aspect (and i REALLY would) though I'd recommend a Standard Poodle if someone really wants to do some training, and a Deerhound if you want a big dog that is easy going, doesn't shed much, wouldn't thankyou at ALL for attempting dog sports and is generally very economical on space around the house (yes, I have had one in a very small house!).

I would wait until child is a year or two older for the latter two, and more like three years older for the rest, but you know your child and your ability to ensure child follows instructions and doesn't mither or become magnetized to the dog!

Interesting - why don’t they use Dobermanns for police work considering how intelligent they are? I’ve always wondered.

I love standard poodles - I’ve heard they’re surprisingly good guard dogs and massively intelligent. Won’t make OP’s husband look well ‘ard though

Minecraftatemychild · 09/08/2022 22:00

2bazookas · 09/08/2022 19:26

DH hasn't a clue. A " protection dog" is trained to threaten/stop a human being when the dog perceives risk. That training/dog outlook is totally incompatible with a family pet around small children (remember, normal 6 yr olds cry, shout, are loud, bouncy, unpredictable, and have small friends to play).

The three breeds he's picked are breeds commonly used as guard or protection dogs because of their powerful jaws, physique and breed temperament like strong confidence, dominance, assertiveness. A dog/child stand-off (misunderstanding over a toy, or food, or just an accidental shove / knock) is quite likely and the dog will win, because that's what it's wired for.

If you get a dog, choose some more compliant, less assertive breed, maybe a small labrador. Instead of a puppy, consider getting an 18 month to 2 yrs slightly older dog whose character and proper training are already established.

A degree of shed hair, foot prints, mud , smells and occasional mess is pretty much inevitable in dog ownership. Don't kid yourself , they do make more work.

This.

Your DH sounds kind of insecure. Why does he feel he needs “protection”? If you have young children and cats, I do not see happy family life in your future if you also get a dog that’s bred to respond aggressively and put it in a confided space with cats and kids. Accident waiting to happen.

wheresmymojo · 09/08/2022 22:02

We have a rescue that is German shepherd x Doberman.

I wouldn't recommend to a first time owner with children.

As guarding dogs they've been bred over generations to be highly intelligent but also very independent.

This means they get easily bored, if they're bored they will find ways to amuse themselves (and you won't like what this tends to involve which is destruction), they're demanding and while they learn tricks and commands very quickly they'll only do it when they want to.

Also they whine quite a lot - for attention, if they're bored, if they want to play, if they want the cats to play, etc, etc.

They're basically 35kg 18 month old toddlers with big teeth and no ability to speak.

I bloody love her but she's a full on handful and we have no DC!

And an XL Bully as a family dog is nuts. There's no reason on this Earth that a family needs such a crazily powerful dog.

It's like deciding you're going to learn to drive just to drop the baby at nursery and choosing to do it in a tank...just, why?

wheresmymojo · 09/08/2022 22:03

And she blows her coat a few times a year which means an entire other dog could be formed from her moulting.

ParvuliThankYouDebbie · 09/08/2022 22:03

Interesting - why don’t they use Dobermanns for police work considering how intelligent they are? I’ve always wondered
I don’t know what the actual answer from professionals might be, but based on my experience of GSD vs Doberman, I’d say that the Doberman, though intensely loyal and focused on one person (possibly too much) wasn’t that concerned about pleasing the object of his affections in the same way that the GSD was. So, highly intelligent and with a job to do, might do the job the way he wanted to do it not necessarily the way the handler wanted it done. The GSD absolutely would do it the way the handler commanded. Just an observation based on two dogs owned by the same person. There might actually be physical attributes though - Doberman’s might not be as physically sturdy as GSDs for example?

AsACloud · 09/08/2022 22:04

I have these three breeds. As per a PP, a GSD is a big dog if you’re worried about your house being on the small side and they do shed hugely! Fabulous dogs though. I think these 3 breeds are not the best option for a first family dog unfortunately. Personally I wouldn’t have any big breed in a small house as they need so much room, especially when they’re big bouncy puppies banging into everything 😂

Boxowine · 09/08/2022 22:06

Sigh. If people quit getting unsuitable breeds, breeders would quit breeding them. Get a nice friendly family dog that doesn't shed. If you have a dog in the house that you will be taking care of and cleaning up after you may as well get one that you can enjoy.

IHeartPepsi · 09/08/2022 22:07

An XL bully? Ffs why?

Sellie555 · 09/08/2022 22:14

Lurchers or any sighthounds are the most amazing dogs! They don’t need huge amounts of walking, they doze most of the day, are not renowned for barking and arr super chilled.

i have a chocolate lab myself but I foster rescue dogs and the sighthounds have always been my fave rescues are they are just so lovely

also just cos the dogs yoi mention are big breeds, doesn’t mean they are naturally protective towards the family. In fact, it’s a myth that dogs will always protect their owners - most would actually run away of their owners were being attacked

wheresmymojo · 09/08/2022 22:22

ParvuliThankYouDebbie · 09/08/2022 22:03

Interesting - why don’t they use Dobermanns for police work considering how intelligent they are? I’ve always wondered
I don’t know what the actual answer from professionals might be, but based on my experience of GSD vs Doberman, I’d say that the Doberman, though intensely loyal and focused on one person (possibly too much) wasn’t that concerned about pleasing the object of his affections in the same way that the GSD was. So, highly intelligent and with a job to do, might do the job the way he wanted to do it not necessarily the way the handler wanted it done. The GSD absolutely would do it the way the handler commanded. Just an observation based on two dogs owned by the same person. There might actually be physical attributes though - Doberman’s might not be as physically sturdy as GSDs for example?

I mean this would make sense for my cross. She clearly has a Doberman streak when it comes to choosing whether she may or may not decide to grace us with a faint whiff of obedience.

But my god - if you've got a treat in your hand you could teach her to do circus tricks. Until the treats run out.

wheresmymojo · 09/08/2022 22:25

If you absolutely have to get a dog (which you really shouldn't) then I would say a Staffy.

Can still look tough but a well trained Staffy from a good breeder, well socialised is a lovely thing.

They're very friendly, goofy little things.

I grew up with one and he was a brilliant family dog.

You still wouldn't ever be able to leave alone with DC though as per all dogs.

ohblowmedown · 09/08/2022 22:30

Why do I read half the threads on here lately and assume they're a wind up?

gotelltheoldmandowntheroad · 09/08/2022 22:32

WiddlinDiddlin · 09/08/2022 21:34

Oh yep, this is very much my lane right now (sorting a breed database to give info to new owners)...

1 - under NO circumstances do you get a dog to act as protection for family. Do not do it, it is fucking dangerous. And certainly not if the plan is to send the dog off to be trained using shock collars and prong collars or if DH is a newbie to bite sports and fancies a crack at them. Just don't.

2 - those breeds, no no and no.

Gsd - damn near impossible to get a healthy one outside of working lines and you absolutely do NOT need or want a working line gsd at this point. So many have dodgy temperaments, do you want to be rehabbing a reactive fearful dog for the next four years?

XL Bully - unhealthy, poor temperament, 99% of breeders I wouldn't buy a soft toy from. Too big, too dribbly, don't do it.

Rottie - again, as puppies these are clumsy and daft, they are FAR too easy to misunderstand, mishandle and fuck up, and the only breeders willing to sell to someone who wants a protection dog, and has a 6 year old in the house is again, someone i wouldn't buy a soft toy from.

Examine EXACTLY what H thinks he wants from a 'protection' dog.

MY goal from a dog that will keep me safe is - big enough that people think twice, superduper incredibly easily trainable such that I can teach a big bark and a growl on cue, but of the temperament that ACTUALLY thinks everyone in the world is a friend.

This way I can cue the scary 'fuck off right now or ill eat your face' behaviours, but should an accident occur, no ones actually getting injured.

The probably with many of the 'protection' breeds is that they're either TERRIFIED and highly likely to make mistakes (GSD, Doberman, this is why police are now using Malinois) OR... they are high as kites off their tits wanting to BITE stuff, and if not intensively trained and super well managed will bite the wrong people (see, police dogs biting the wrong people, quite a lot).

So you want a dog that looks the part, can be trained to bluff, but is in fact safe as a dog can actually be.

If Husband actually wants to do some dog sports and training and isn't just thinking of his ego... then:

Picardy Sheepdog is a good choice, some of the same traits of the GSD, a courageous nature, very easily trained, sufficiently large most people think twice but not so large they're a pain in the arse to house, and being a rough coated shaggy breed they also take people by surprise... and don't shed like a GSD.

Superduper well bred Mastiff - not so easy to train, far better temperament and health than the XL Bully. They do shed needle like hair everywhere that is a pain in the arse to get up and they have a tendancy to smell a bit... cheesey.

Large Munsterlander - from the gundog group, not quite a setter, not a spaniel, bigger and more robust than the latter but less scatty than the former, very trainable, willing to do fun training and dog sports, easily trained to growl and bark on cue.

Briard - similarly capable as the Picardy, their roots are in droving and guarding livestock on the move, very trainable, very loyal to family, something that you would shit your pants if it growled or barked at you on cue. Downside is of course theres a LOT of grooming of one of these (but they don't shed much at all!).

If you discount the protection aspect (and i REALLY would) though I'd recommend a Standard Poodle if someone really wants to do some training, and a Deerhound if you want a big dog that is easy going, doesn't shed much, wouldn't thankyou at ALL for attempting dog sports and is generally very economical on space around the house (yes, I have had one in a very small house!).

I would wait until child is a year or two older for the latter two, and more like three years older for the rest, but you know your child and your ability to ensure child follows instructions and doesn't mither or become magnetized to the dog!

Lots of very interesting stuff here, and this was a great post, thank you.

OP posts:
shrodingersvaccine · 09/08/2022 22:42

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ.

shrodingersvaccine · 09/08/2022 22:47

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ.

Chohlin654 · 09/08/2022 22:52

Have you got a grow on in your attic?

Milkand2sugarsplease · 09/08/2022 22:53

This is an accident waiting to happen. An inexperienced family, not 100% committed choosing an inappropriate breed for the household - what could possibly go wrong.....

Have a long think about whether you're (as the one not sure about having one) willing to commit the next 15 years to caring for this dog... if not, don't do it.

If you are, look at family oriented dogs and see if any of those suit your home and lifestyle.

Most dogs shed some fur, admittedly some more than others and some very little. We use a furminator to help.

Then there's the dirty floors from a wet dog coming in from the garden - we have a towel by the door and clean/dry his paws as he comes in which helps but everyone has to commit to doing it when they let him in when it's wet or there's no point.

Cold, wet walks on dark miserable days still have to happen and again, commitment is needed from everyone. An Un-exercised dog is a bundle of energy, letting that energy out in other, usually undesirable, ways.

Please think carefully x

gotelltheoldmandowntheroad · 09/08/2022 23:25

wheresmymojo · 09/08/2022 22:03

And she blows her coat a few times a year which means an entire other dog could be formed from her moulting.

Wow! I thought the cats were bad!

OP posts:
JustAnotherManicMomday · 09/08/2022 23:37

The only breed I would ever trust around my children is a retriever. Golden or labrador. Yes they malt but they are so placid and easily trained. Ours was toilet trained in 2 days. Bought him home at 9 weeks old. Has been amazing with our son who has ASD. Personally I was bitten by a German shepherd's a child, I asked to stroke her and was told yes she is very friendly the chunk she took out of my arm begged to differ. I was terrified of dogs for a long time after that it was o ly my nans retriever that made me consider having one. Now I would be lost without ours.

spanishsummers · 09/08/2022 23:51

shrodingersvaccine is unfortunately right. It doesn't say good things about a man if he is walking one of those dogs.Only my prejudice, but I'm not alone.

WishIWasOnHolidayAgain · 09/08/2022 23:55

Lurchers/whippets/other sighthounds are fabulous dogs. They come in different shapes and sizes. Tell your H to open his mind! Especially as you've already had experience.
Also, get a girl dog. ❤️

maggiecate · 10/08/2022 00:04

If you want to see how much fur comes off a “German Shedder” this is a good video from Girl With The Dogs, a Canadian groomer.
If you don’t want to be permanently befloofed a double coated breed is not for you.

QueenCamilla · 10/08/2022 00:08

Ltb

Maves · 10/08/2022 00:23

You are irresponsible if you have any of those breeds around kids...xl bullies have killed x amount of kids and adults this year alone they should be on the banned list. The 3 breeds are actually all on the list of killers multiple times, and you think a golden retriever is jumpy? Fucking hell.