To think that very few people can manage £4200 energy bills

[Butterflyfluff]

news.sky.com/story/energy-bills-forecast-to-rise-even-higher-than-previously-thought-12668906

This simply isn’t manageable for the majority of people.

Where’s this going to end?

Here we go Spain and Portugal keeping prices down for their people. Angela Rayner was right "Tory Scum".

balkangreenenergynews.com/portugal-spain-cap-gas-prices-for-power-producers-to-reduce-wholesale-prices/

For those who think that most people can absorb the increase by cutting back on luxuries, here's how it looks from the other end of the income scale
I work full time as a nursery practitioner (qualified, SEND diploma, studying for a Masters) and earn £20.8k. I live alone, have a mortgage, do not receive any benefits. I do not have a TV, my phone is old and costs less than £5 a month, I have cancelled all subscriptions, no longer eat meat, never go out or get haircuts etc. My only possible thing left to cut is my 15 year old car in which case I would have an hour's walk either side of a nine hour shift. My energy costs have quadrupled despite the heating being off, no dishwasher or tumble dryer, light on in one room at a time.
So no, I can't absorb these costs and I am going to be very cold this winter.

I see the few tories on MN have deserted the anger threads. Funny that - they will still crawl out from under their stones and put their x on the fuckers though.

What are you on about?

What do you think the price cap is, genius?

What are the ‘anger threads’ when they’re at home

I can't afford it. I'm on a prepayment meter. No idea what I'm going to do.

I've seen people say to put a tent up inside the house and sleep in that as it'll be warmer.... but I don't really want to subject my DC to that.

What the hell is the government doing?!

As I mentioned before, diesel is going to be a problem soon.

Ah! I thought it was si gle person. I think that for 5 people that is actually good. We are just 2 of us. Sorry!

I worry that it’s all deliberate. The books Britannia Unchained by Truss, Raab and Patel and Blood on the Streets by William Rees-Mogg promote disaster capitalism. Reduce everything to ruins, remove our rights (anyone heard about leaving the ECHR recently) and sell everything off to your mates. I am frightened by the prospects of charter cities. Sometimes I think it’s all far fetched, and then I think this is exactly how things would be ifthis was actually what they were doing. I can’t work out if it is.

I’m also very very happy for people to tell me I’m wrong if they can produce reasonable evidence/ argumentation. Nothing would make me happier than to think this fear is unfounded.

I'm in exactly the same boat, except i cant afford to run a car and live in a freezing cold house in rural Wales (no mains gas here and i suspect no insulation in the roof))
I'm getting so stressed about how i'll cope, especially as i have Raynauds and Arthritis, so the cold damp months are already painful for me.
I have no heating upstairs and use a tiny oil filled electric radiator for the evenings in my bedroom, just to take the chill off.
Not this year though, i live and run my house on £12,000 a year!!

@Liebig
Cool. So if we go the energy isolationism route, you can say goodbye to all that American diesel and LNG we’re currently getting as they follow likewise. And they have people proposing the same idea in Congress right now
That torpedoes Europe’s entire economy instantly

Err we export during the summer (because we have a surplus) but then continue exporting gas during the winter (when we need it) & then buy back what we have just sold in the Euro energy market.

Maybe explain why 50% of 'lecky is produced via sustainable production, is then sold and bought back to be used in the UK having never really left our shores? (like the gas)

Its a false market and clearly doesn't work.

I'm all for working together (and we should) but we told europe to FO .. so we have chosen the isolation route long before now.

Contracts for difference exist in the U.K. too, although for renewables (so not quite the same as this scheme - but the principle is similar) - there’s a strike price and until last year, suppliers have paid into a pool which is distributed amongst generators to guarantee an income. Currently it’s the generators paying in, which is passed to suppliers and back to consumers. Energy companies also hedge their contracts for difference obligations/receipts.

With that scheme, I assume the network operator would pass the higher cost back through to consumers ultimately.

Wholesale prices are high, so any government who offers their population rebates and grants will have to fund it somehow, probably through general taxation in the longer term. Consumers will pay one way or another unfortunately. The best strategy is to fix the root problem - increase gas storage so the U.K. isn’t dependent on buying gas at times when prices are at their highest and invest in nuclear (takes time) and renewables (not always available).

@Mumtofourandnomore But didn't our government refuse to subsidise gas storage a few years ago, so we are left with very little now?

@Midnightblack I hadn't heard about charter cities, but just had a look now. Yup, that is worrying, particularly as Sunak is a strong believer in them. I think there really is an element amongst the Tories who want a small state, everything privatised, an enslaved working class and to get rich in the process. What I am not sure about is how many there are. I don't think they are all so extreme, but wonder how much power they have in the party.

@gnilliwdog yep gaz storage well no one was bothered

www.theguardian.com/business/2021/sep/24/how-uk-energy-policies-have-left-britain-exposed-to-winter-gas-price-hikes

@cuddlybear21 I like the way the energy minister said it would all be fine because a diverse range of energy supplies would ensure the public received 'reliable supplies of electricity and gas at minimum cost.' Ahahaha. Who put these people in charge?

Yes, which was pretty short-sighted of them, but it has been recently reported in the press that Centrica have been granted a licence to reopen it (it will require maintenance first so I doubt it will be available this winter).

@gnilliwdog I think we did ;-)

I can afford it although I don't particularly want to pay it! Single parent with one child. Monthly income is £2450 which includes salary, Universal Credit and child maintenance payments. My rent is £470 so I'm left with pretty much £2000 which is plenty to cover bills. No car or commuting costs and DC is a teen so no childcare cost.

It's still a sickening amount though. Something needs to be done for those who can't absorb the cost.

@cuddlybear21 Not me, not that I'm a fan of any party right now, but I have never voted for the conservatives.

Heat banks/warm banks seem to be becoming a thing in some areas

metro.co.uk/2022/07/14/warm-banks-to-be-set-up-this-winter-but-what-are-they-16998804/

@BigWoollyJumpers I wouldn't sell them for a fiver each, though. Some might.

@ChilliPB Well British Gas (Centrica) are doing pretty spectacularly if you look at their posted profits!

www.independent.co.uk/news/business/british-gas-profits-centrica-energy-prices-b2133672.html