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AIBU?

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Original poster

that the Man who killed a burglar he saw breaking into his house should not be jailed for 19 years

255 replies

LargeDeviation · 05/08/2022 17:59

He saw the man breaking into his house on a video doorbell, armed himself with a knife and went with his half-brother and killed the burglar. He has been jailed for 19 years.

Yes the violence he used was very extreme, but the burglar was breaking into his home! It is unreasonable to expect a dispassionate response. People should be able to defend their home and their family from intruders, including using force which would be considered unlawful or unreasonable in other settings.

Even if he must be found guilty by law, the sentence should take the circumstances into account and it should be a slap on the wrist.

OP posts:
Kedece2410 · 05/08/2022 18:14

Even if he must be found guilty by law, the sentence should take the circumstances into account and it should be a slap on the wrist

Have you actually read the circumstances of this case?

Agrudge · 05/08/2022 18:15

Do you have a link?

Sweatinglikeabitch · 05/08/2022 18:15

If they were home then I'd agree but he went out with the intention of killing someone that wasn't endangering his or anyone else's life. If he'd grabbed a knife during a tussle with someone who'd broken in it would be different but he wasn't protecting anyone he was punishing someone.

TeapotTitties · 05/08/2022 18:16

Agrudge · 05/08/2022 18:15

Do you have a link?

Link to Express story

Original poster
LargeDeviation · 05/08/2022 18:19

If it's true that this was revenge for an attempt to steal drugs, that changes things. In that case it's just another violent encounter between criminals and this man should indeed rot in jail.

However if it was just a normal person defending their home, I think they are allowed to be 'unreasonable' in their behaviour. I think it's a very understandable reaction to defend your property, and to make a plan to defend your property.

Assuming it's not some drug feud, I agree by the way that the root cause is that people no longer trust the police and the courts and the justice system. If the police actually caught burglars promptly and the courts locked them up promptly, fewer people would feel the need to have-a-go.

OP posts:
Antarcticant · 05/08/2022 18:19

Two lawless people paid a price for their actions. No sympathy for either of them.

SemperIdem · 05/08/2022 18:20

SkiingIsHeaven · 05/08/2022 18:10

You break into my house, you leave your human rights at the door.

The law doesn’t agree.

FrippEnos · 05/08/2022 18:20

Thatswhyimacat · 05/08/2022 18:05

I'm sorry but the law already is very much on homeowners side in this case.

However, you simply cannot have a society where someone proactively goes to stab someone who hasn't threatened them in any way. If the burglar HAD threatened him, he would absolutely not be convicted of murder for stabbing him.

In these cases, there is always more to it. The famous case of the man, I forget his name, who shot an intruder and everyone went all Daily Mail about it, what actually happened is he lay in wait and then shot a teenage boy who was running AWAY from his house, with an illegally owned weapon.

If you are talking about the Martin case, the bits that you are missing are

They had done it before
they had harassed the man before (alot)
the police had done nothing
the man had poor mental health because of it.

Should the boy have died? No
but lets not rewrite history and pretend that he was some innocent.

Jalepenojello · 05/08/2022 18:21

He deliberately set out to harm and/or kill someone. The prison sentence is just. His actions were horrific and incredibly violent and persistent. Any rational person would phone 999, he is clearly beyond that and is a massive danger to society with a response like that.

1dontunderstand · 05/08/2022 18:23

@LargeDeviation have you read the reports of what happened?
The burglar was savagely attacked in the house and when he fled into the street, trying to escape, he was brutally murdered!

Agrudge · 05/08/2022 18:23

I'm very much a" your home is your castle " and should be defended by any means necessary
But that's not defence that's attack

MrsTerryPratchett · 05/08/2022 18:23

If the police actually caught burglars promptly and the courts locked them up promptly, fewer people would feel the need to have-a-go.

The solution to a shitty legal system isn't more criminal and violent behaviour.

On a very basic level, if we allow this and celebrate it, you know vulnerable, old, female people will be targeted even more because they won't be able to defend themselves. It's not like my elderly, blind neighbour would be able to stab a burglar in the eye FGS.

SaintHelena · 05/08/2022 18:23

The answer is to kill them and dump the body somewhere where it hopefully won't be found. That's my plan.

Frequency · 05/08/2022 18:23

However if it was just a normal person defending their home, I think they are allowed to be 'unreasonable' in their behaviour. I think it's a very understandable reaction to defend your property, and to make a plan to defend your property.

A normal person does not gather back-up and weapons if they see their house being robbed. A normal person does not stab someone so ferociously that pieces of the knife break off in their victim's skull. A normal person does not chase someone down in a car with thbe intention of killing them. A normal person does not pin a man against a car and repeatedly stab him in the neck.

A normal person would call the police.

TeapotTitties · 05/08/2022 18:24

LargeDeviation · 05/08/2022 18:19

If it's true that this was revenge for an attempt to steal drugs, that changes things. In that case it's just another violent encounter between criminals and this man should indeed rot in jail.

However if it was just a normal person defending their home, I think they are allowed to be 'unreasonable' in their behaviour. I think it's a very understandable reaction to defend your property, and to make a plan to defend your property.

Assuming it's not some drug feud, I agree by the way that the root cause is that people no longer trust the police and the courts and the justice system. If the police actually caught burglars promptly and the courts locked them up promptly, fewer people would feel the need to have-a-go.

What do you mean 'if it's true'??

Have you not actually bothered to read the story you've started a thread about?

That's just weird.

PonyPatter44 · 05/08/2022 18:24

The reason it wasn't just a "normal person defending their home", OP, is that normal people don't react that way! Violent drug dealers, however, do this day in, day out. Scum kills scum, ends up away from civilised society for a good long time. Seems reasonable.

I don't think you'd be very happy if EITHER of these people were your neighbours.

RedHelenB · 05/08/2022 18:26

Yabu We've moved on from taking another's property = loss of life
More sympathy if he'd been awoken by a burglar and it happened on the heat of the moment.
That sort of violent man is probably better off behind bars.

Gymrabbit · 05/08/2022 18:27

Antarcticant

this just about sums the situation up.

I don’t have a even a tiny bit of sympathy for burglars killed or injured when carrying out crimes. They are human excrement who destroy people’s lives.

Agrudge · 05/08/2022 18:28

He probably would of had a good defence for self defence if only stabbed him the once and it killed him.

Thatswhyimacat · 05/08/2022 18:28

FrippEnos · 05/08/2022 18:20

If you are talking about the Martin case, the bits that you are missing are

They had done it before
they had harassed the man before (alot)
the police had done nothing
the man had poor mental health because of it.

Should the boy have died? No
but lets not rewrite history and pretend that he was some innocent.

Show quote history
  • He was also known in the area for threatening kids who came into his orchard with his gun.
  • The CHILD he shot in the back had never done it before.
IncompleteSenten · 05/08/2022 18:28

He was not at home. He was in no danger. He travelled to his house with a knife and a second person.

If he was at home and an armed intruder attacked him and he killed them fighting for his life then that would be different.

He could have called the police. He chose to go home and kill the burglar.

That's not self defence. It's premeditated murder.

Rushing back home to murder someone because they're taking your stuff deserves a long prison sentence.

EverythingHeadinSouth · 05/08/2022 18:29

Sorry, but I fundamentally disagree with you. Granted, burglars are scum but the punishment for burglary should not be death by stabbing, or by any other means for that matter. Not in a remotely civilised society anyway.

We have what I consider to be very pragmatic self-defence laws in this country and the individual concerned was so far outside the tests of reasonableness it shouldn't even have been mentioned as a possible mitigation. A reasonable person, on seeing by remote camera that their house was being burgled, would call the police. Getting some back-up and arming yourselves with knives to go and sort it out yourself is the domain of violent thugs, not reasonable law-abiding citizens.

I'm actually disappointed that the jury settled for manslaughter. Somebody who pre-arms themselves, proactively goes after their target and then stabs them multiple times is a murderer in my book and should have been found guilty as such.

MajorCarolDanvers · 05/08/2022 18:30

He killed someone. That's murder.

abblie · 05/08/2022 18:31

This is why we have police to phone to be fair you don't go armed with a knife and whatever else that is just a recipe of disaster to happen. I agree with protecting yourself and home but this got way out of controls because of a knife

BMW6 · 05/08/2022 18:31

1 burglar dead, 1 violet drug dealer imprisoned for a long time

Win/win

A good day