To think Britain is heading towards economical and social collapse

[Cheesecakeandwineinasuitcase]

It feels like we are living in strange times, having come out of a global pandemic, the war in Ukraine and now the cost of living crisis and the added pressure from Brexit.

Ive barely slept tonight, worrying about what might happen with energy prices. I’ve heard the energy price cap is expected to rise to £3,850 in October. A few months ago I’m sure they predicting it would be £2,400 and that was horrifying enough.
Now I’m seeing people on the energy support Facebook group talking about monthly energy costs of £900 per month. It feels like this is escalating out of control very quickly and the Government are allowing us to sleepwalk into a disaster.

I realised tonight that if the price cap does keep increasing at the rate it has then what will happen to all the businesses once people can’t afford their energy bills anymore? They will probably increase their prices to try and cover their costs but that will drive down sales even more as people won’t have as much money to spend anymore. Eventually it will only be the essentials that we can afford so that surely means that all the other businesses won’t be able to afford to keep going?

Then what? Unless our government actually get their heads together about this then the whole country will end up in financial ruin and we will see the breakdown of society. Why so much focus on the leadership contest, surely that must take a back step.

Ive just checked the parliament website and the House of Commons has now gone into summer recess so they won’t meet again until September! I think this is an emergency situation and that they should be called back to focus on this. They get paid enough.

I think it’s outrageous that they can claim for utility bills on their expenses when there are people out there with young children who are worried about being cut off and put onto a prepayment meter.

concluded it was bad that the energy industries were privatised in the 80s in the first place.

Yup, all Thatcher’s pigeons are coming home to roost now. And still the prospective PM candidates vie to emulate her.

Erm, nope. 1kg of fresh British chicken and 1kg of scottish porridge oats.

I am not ignorant, I am, and I work with (for 15 years), families on low incomes. There are cheaper and healthier ways to feed a toddler and a family. I'm a single mum who works full time and I have working class parents and live in one of the most deprived areas of England.

I taught myself to budget.

Budgeting should be taught in maths as part of the secondary curriculum, cooking should be taught as a compulsory subject. Instead people are left to founder and make crappy choices. I've done it in the past, I see it all the time.

Multinationals have a lot to answer for as does government policy. They want people to keep buying this crap. Therefore they won't educate people away from hit. Hence people's money doesn't go as far as it could, their health deteriorates, they can't level up, they are trapped.

@Cameleongirl I don't believe any government could impose price caps and expect them to hold because this is a situation where global market sentiment is more powerful. If there is a shortage of power/resources, and everybody wants/needs then the price rises to the highest point anyone is willing to pay/

I dont know one poster from another, but it appears @ticktickticktickBOOM is on the right lines to me.

@XingMing this is not directed at you or any sane person just people like @hattie43 who thinks no one is in dire straits so clearly is rolling around in money and therefore it was a tongue in cheek post directly entirely at her so that’s why she was tagged - think you misunderstood

Because it shows that people are willing to go on tv and moan yet they have absolutely no idea how to budget so they can't even make a point.

They don't have absolutely no idea how to budget. Both tories and champagne socialists seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of this. The former likes to believe you lack discipline / responsibility while the latter likes to believe you lack education / understanding.

In most cases this is bullshit. What you lack is the will to care anymore. Why NOT have coco pops and chicken nuggets? Seriously what difference does it make in the grand scheme of things?

It's relatively easy to scrimp and save on food for most people, but when it's the only money you have to spend on your kids from week to week would you rather give them the bowl of chocolatey cocopops they like, or hand them a bowl of plain porridge? That's without touching on the practicalities of how much each costs or how long each takes to prepare and clean up.

The only real difference choosing porridge oats and chicken thighs would make to their situation is that it would seem a bit more miserable. That's literally it.

Are people really this thick or is it easier to just refuse to understand?

Because it shows that people are willing to go on tv and moan yet they have absolutely no idea how to budget so they can't even make a point.

They don't have absolutely no idea how to budget. Both tories and champagne socialists seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of this. The former likes to believe you lack discipline / responsibility while the latter likes to believe you lack education / understanding.

In most cases this is bullshit. What you lack is the will to care anymore. Why NOT have coco pops and chicken nuggets? Seriously what difference does it make in the grand scheme of things?

It's relatively easy to scrimp and save on food for most people, but when it's the only money you have to spend on your kids from week to week would you rather give them the bowl of chocolatey cocopops they like, or hand them a bowl of plain porridge? That's without touching on the practicalities of how much each costs or how long each takes to prepare and clean up.

The only real difference choosing porridge oats and chicken thighs would make to their situation is that it would seem a bit more miserable. That's literally it.

Are people really this thick or is it easier to just refuse to understand?

And yet many people don't have a lot of savings.

1 in 5 people are in negative disposable income.

So maybe you should get out and meet some more people?

Survivor bias.

Do you know the lives of people who aren't out and about socialising?
Who aren't you seeing?

@XingMing I’m assuming that any price caps would need to be a very temporary measure, or we’ll end up with energy shortages.

Of course I do it’s a community where people talk to each other.

There are two things which could affect an area like mine - first wfh brings lower childcare costs which are very high, and second (although this is more commuter towns) wfh lowers travel costs which are high.

Savings were made during pandemic too

So you are talking about your area?

As I said, who aren't you seeing...

The point is - talking about local areas and how they are doing ok misses the fact that as a country, many people have low savings / no savings and quite a lot spend more than they earn.

Just because you don't see that in your area does not mean that it does not exist.

And we are all connected in this economy. On a local , national and yes, global scale.

You quoted me it wasn’t a long post

It’s the same in this area

It was clear. I don’t get the question over that. Other areas will have different factors

The poster you replied to seemed to be saying that there was not much of an issue because she had seen people out and about in her area and you commented that it was the same in your area.

So as I said, there are plenty of people out there who people aren't seeing. The ones with no savings, no disposable income. The ones hidden in their homes.

Commenting that it's the same in your area to a poster who thinks there isn't a problem or it's only a problem for some people might come across as bit crass,

There are people who will get through this fine. But there are a lot of people who will find this hard, as well as businesses. The wider economic effects will affect a lot of people.

This is one of the most out of touch threads I have read in a long time.

If you needed more proof that Mumsnet was a forum for the middle class, you have it here!

I am disabled and on PIP/ESA, cannot work, in a 2 bed council house in rural Scotland. EVERYONE I know will struggle this winter, I wont be able to pay for heating and I'm already stocking up food (tins, dry goods) for winter so I can still cook warming meals. I am NOT at risk due to generous family, but most of my peers have no safety net or safeguard, and will simply spend the winter trying to keep their kids fed and not sick.

Those saying they don't know anyone (nor do their family/friends/colleagues) who is actually in the shit financially with the CoL crisis, feel free to take a look over my finances, I would LOVE to have the mumsnet opinion on what parts of my budgeting are examples of laziness or lack of effort/thought.

Govt MUST put a cap on energy prices, the cold in the north will easily kill folk this winter when they cannot afford to put their heating on. Council houses here are STILL being fitted with 'Modern, economical heating systems' - that DO NOT WORK IN OLD HOUSES.
I have one of these, last winter I turned it off after keeping my house at 16C last winter costs me £10-15 a DAY last November, they have fitted solar panels for me but refuse to connect them before October (despite them being on my roof since April), because apparently I 'don't need to use them yet'.

The only thing I hope comes from this is a long, solid labour govt. Or maybe Scottish Independence.

Exactly. My elderly parent's local a and e has a 12 hour wait to see a doctor. Every day, all hours. Regardless.

I'm a single parent to two teens. I've just had to take on a second job to pay my bills now. One child turns 18 shortly so no more tax credits even though they're still at home snd at school. I'm not sure I'm going to be able afford to have the heating on for more than an hour a day this winter. And I know I'm in a better position than many - eg not currently needing to use a food bank.

As another PP said I think many people are very worried but it's just not very British to talk about money worries...

I am worried about this winter.

100% this. It’s sickening and so out of touch because it’s not happening where they are. One look at the average income and some critical thinking would expose the issue.

I am fine, my friends, my neighbours are fine; So? The families I work with who have a high level of deprivation are not fine, hidden away in the leafy shires.

It’s not an issue to say what is happening locally. It doesn’t mean other areas are the same.

We can all talk about what’s happening - I’m not going to try and speak about somewhere I haven’t visited, but others can.

One thing is if people are highly anxious about social and economic collapse as the op is there’s still strong spending for various reasons.

There are various people addressing CoL talking about North being hit harder than SE due to reliance on cars, different housing or reverting to wfh in SE. There’s nothing wrong with looking at where might need extra help due to different factors.

100% this. It’s sickening and so out of touch because it’s not happening where they are. One look at the average income and some critical thinking would expose the issue

The issue with the UK, as has been alluded to in the previous comment, is the income disparity between regions as well within a region. The median income varies between regions - and within a region, the median income can mask a lot of variation between rich and poor.

I live in a reasonably rich Northern city - and I know there are issues here. I only know the statistics for other places as well as hearing the stories of people who are finding it hard - and the thought of these increased price increases and the choices some people have to make is hard.

@colouringindoors so you've taken on a second job now, to pay bills, why not sooner?

Apologies as I don't mean this to you personally as I don't know your situation, but far too many people work PT etc and happily claim benefits when actually they could have worked more hours. Now they are disgruntled that they have to increase their hours, when they could have done that years ago rather than depend on the state. I work 40+ hours per week as a single parent of young children, I never want to depend on the state.

Chris Packham asked this question today. I totally agree with him.

'Could someone please post a link to a clear explanation of why the energy price caps are being increased . Because superficially it seems that it’s providing the suppliers with colossal profits and a counterproductive dependence on dirtier fossil fuels.'

The energy regulator is not regulating energy prices- they are allowing suppliers to make vast profits. It is time the government stopped saying 'Oh but that's OFGENs job' and stepped in and forced down prices and capped them, so that suppliers profits are significantly smaller and we pay much less.

They should also slash VAT on energy. They need to do both things- we are filling government coffers and the pockets of suppliers from our own money while the government shakes the hand of its energy supplier cronies.

What you think eating roast chicken is miserable compared to chicken nuggets? What planet are you on 😆

If people think that spending £2.05 on 220 grams of chicken dippers is better than spending £2.10 on 1kg of fresh British chicken - then they absolutely don't know how to budget.

Simple as that.

I think when people have very little satisfaction in life and low in mood the cheap and easy options are often taken

you know your children will enjoy the nuggets

I think it’s hard for many to understand just how poverty grinds people down. To not be able to afford to do any thing nice for your children. My local park now has a fancy cafe with high price organic ice cream nice for the mc families moving into the area but not for many of the families already there

how depressing is that not being able to afford an ice cream for your child when out at the park but chips and nuggets is something a child will look forward to

people know what is the heather choice