Disclosure made in therapy is being passed on as a safeguarding risk..

[Idontwantthat]

I'm having counselling and last week I disclosed that there had been S.A when I was young (this was 16 years ago)

During the opening few minutes of my session today my therapist said what we discussed was flagged as a (historical) safeguarding issue and it had to be passed on to social services as he's still out there. She wanted me to give his name and I very reluctantly did as it felt like I didn't have much choice and was under pressure.

I made it clear I don't want to speak to the police and I don't want my name mentioned to anybody and she said she would make a note of that.

I have a bad feeling now. I don't want her to do anything with the information. I know the statistics for prosecuting historical sex crimes and they don't weigh in the victims favour. I don't want to go back there. I mentioned it purely in a therapeutic manner so that I could process it and move on.

I don't think I'm going to feel comfortable disclosing anything else now.

Can somebody tell me if this is procedure or whether it's unacceptable?

I'm so, so, sorry. I know and can feel the damage. I'm afraid they do band together.

Very similar story. Removed from home and one set of abuses, straight into another set actively overseen by social services. (Was also on a CPP)

Seeking therapy years later. Very naive about it all and equally shell shocked by the response, especially as she effectively tricked names and detail out of me before announcing her supposed reporting duty.

I was contacted directly by police who wanted to interview me. Given one of the abusers had been in the police, I didn't find them people to put my trust in, though they seemed to think because they were a different force, it made it different.

They also wanted to involve the social services department that had actively overseen, allowed, and smoothed over what was happening to me.

I was made to feel if I didn't give a full statement I was responsible for other victims. I told them it was all too late, there would be other victims and I couldn't make it not have happened to them. They made me feel like a criminal for saying it.

It was pointed out my older children could now be DNA tested as walking evidence of who'd fathered them and they would be dragged into it all.

I broke completely and became so terrified and overwhelmed I'm afraid I ended up saying I'd actually made up everything, and getting told I was lucky I wasn't being charged with wasting police time.

I desperately don't want to make things worse but think it's better to be forewarned than blindsided.
Local social services subsequently contacted me to investigate if I was able to safeguard my later children.
I was eventually able to make them leave us in peace but not before another horrible layer of damage after being forced to acknowledge 'cycles of abuse', and how 'abusers are often the previously abused' and write an action plan etc.

but in the UK there is NO licence or qualification! The best you can do is look for a counsellor who is a member of one of the reputable associations and knows they will be expelled if they breach their requirements. I can right now call myself a counsellor, founder member of the Godmum Association of Counsellors. I can train other counsellors and certificate them as having undergone my specialist training course (taked 5 minutes and a large cheque).

BTW the compensation carrot as a reason was waved at me as well. No interest in being paid to say as an adult what they chose to ignore when I told them as a child.

Jesus christ that gave me chills, you poor woman. I am incandescent on your behalf. We have alot of similarities in our past I could have written some of what you wrote word for word.. that even goes as far as me thinking earlier on that if I was put under pressure I would just say I made it up because being 'told off' for lying and then left alone feels much less daunting than having to be dragged over the coals providing statements and dealing with all of that.

My DC1 who was adopted - was placed for adoption predominantly due to risk of future emotional harm on the basis their father had been extremely abusive to me. During the proceedings social services actually used my childhood abuse against me to further secure that adoption. The hypocrisy and injustice of it all is largely what lead me to seeking counselling now all of these years later. They allowed me to suffer abuse, left me there to endure it, and then later weaponised that abuse and used it to their advantage when seeking the adoption. Heartless and cruel.

I'm so glad you got them out of your lives. Well done you. It's no mean feat.

I went on to have another 3 DC with my now H and have no SS involvement whatsoever now but the terror of being told that they may be coming back into my life for the same thing they already failed me for twice over has scared me so much I've vomited 😞

OP- Just wanted to say that this sounds horrifically distressing. I’m so sorry that this is happening to you. It may well be that the counsellor is required to pass on this information, but it sounds like the way this was communicated to you has been awful. Your agency has been completely removed and you’ve been made a passenger. No wonder you feel re-traumatised.

Exactly what I thought - inexperienced therapist who’s got the wrong end of the stick on what they’re supposed to do when abuse is disclosed. Her supervisor should correct her, but that doesn’t erase the trauma for you, @Idontwantthat

Depending on what the supervisor says, I’d ask to be seen by them, or referred elsewhere.

Op can you refuse social services intervention? I believe that they can't force themselves on you and inside your house unless they have a court order.

Frame it calmly and politely and don't give in. I agree with your post. Absolutely not needed. The fact that this is going to do more harm to you than any good .

I’m so sorry you are dealing with this OP. From the look of the PAC UK staff profiles page, not all those working as adult counsellors are registered with the relevant professional bodies, and not all state formal training. You may be speaking to one of their social worker colleagues (I’m not saying they are doing anything wrong, but it’s important to know, I know). It would definitely be worth querying this with the most senior person you can get to speak to.

The information is going to the social services department where I used to live and not where I live now, but there's nothing stopping that local authority from getting in touch with my now-local authority here if they felt so inclined iyswim? I don't know what they're going to do with the info when they get it.

The counsellors manager was at pains to suggest that its nothing to do with me as a person or my parenting but something that was done to me many years ago which needs to be addressed and also to prevent harm to others but once you've been burned by SS numerous times no amount of reassurance will ever make you want to speak to them again in any capacity.

Full disclosure I do know one incredible social worker so I'm not tarring them all with the same brush but that lot where I used to live were ghastly. There was actually an investigation into their department this year and the findings were that they were woefully inadequate and not fit for purpose so have had to couple with another local authority for training and guidance as they couldn't be trusted to do their jobs .... and that's the people this counsellor wants to give this information to 😐

I’m shocked at what has happened to you, and so many others in this thread. It really does feel like there is nowhere safe to talk.

Not an exact parallel but this reminds me of when my DD had blood in her stools, we were absolutely terrified and immediately sought advice by calling 111. The doctor I spoke with referred us to a clinic and ended the conversation by saying she would immediately notify social services as sexual abuse could not be ruled out. I nearly passed out from the shock, I couldn’t believe she would say this without even having seen or spoken with my DD. It was just awful as we were already terrified and worried about the bleeding and now we had this accusation hanging over us (this was during lockdown so obviously only her father and I had been with her). We went straight to A&E to have her examined and told them about our 111 call and how social services were already involved, they couldn’t believe it either, they said this never happens unless there are any findings during an examination, it would never lead to an automatic referral to social services based on a phone call regarding a health concern. They made a note in her journal to say there was no cause for concern in that department so when social services called us it was only to say they would not open a case.

Our family had never had any contact with social services prior to this.

I understand the need for safeguarding but this would make me think twice before I open up about things in the future - not my childrens health of course but in general

I am a sex therapist and I often work with historic sexual abuse. I have never asked for the name of any perpetrators, nor made contact with social services. I would if there was a current safe guarding issue, say if you and a child lived with the perpetrator, but I have never had a situation that I have to report.

I think it is really unprofessional to badger you to disclose a name and certainly if my professional body received a complaint of that nature, I would be fully expecting disciplinary action, probably to be kicked out.

You havd the right to make a complaint. The therapist must help you access the complaints procedure.

I am sorry this happened to you. Therapists do have a responsibility yo safeguard where possible, but the first duty of care is to you, the client and it seems you havd been badly let down.

I'm so sorry OP.
Your rights are being violated as well as being retraumatised
Her treatment of you is appalling.
I would file a complaint against her and the organisation.

You'd very likely get much better advice and support with a name change and discussing what you wanted to talk about here than with some bulldozer like that so called therapist.

It's so validating to see so many people tell me that they have over stepped and that it shouldn't have been done. When I spoke with her manager on the phone I got the very clear (albeit sugared with faux understanding) message that they simply have to report it and there's nothing I can do to stop it as their hands are tied.

To add insult to injury she said they wanted to offer me additional sessions of counselling to work through THIS that they have caused and help me process it.

I definitely want to pursue a formal complaint.

Reading back over the comments I can see that a PP has discovered that the vast majority of the staff working there are ex social workers which doesn't surprise me in the slightest as its all safeguarding safeguarding and to hell with anybody we damage in the process.

I didn't actually know about that when I reached out to them and if I did then I never would've bothered. I was under the impression they were a completely unbiased organisation who are there solely to support birth parents, not self appointed do-gooders operating from a social workers POV and on a crusade to dig up and hash over historical sex abuse.

CatCat that is absolutely batshit. I'm not surprised in the slightest sadly as I've read a few accounts over the years saying similar, parents being told that if they don't attend A&E (after just calling for advice about something minor) they'll be reported to social services. I'm sorry you had to deal with such a twit on the phone that day. I'm glad the doctor was able to put a stop to all of that rubbish.

You'd very likely get much better advice and support with a name change and discussing what you wanted to talk about here than with some bulldozer like that so called therapist.

You're not half wrong you know. I have spoken about a few things on here over the years and got alot of well thought out and helpful replies. I tend to keep most things "birth mum" away from the site though as birth mums are in the same league as step mums on mumsnet; IE we simply must be horrible / neglectful / abusive etc.

You've been treated appallingly., OP. The way it's been handled particularly. Offering more sessions when it's extremely unlikely you'll return!

I hope someone here can advise you on what you need to do, in dealing with this, going forward.

It's so difficult isn't it? You reach out for help that you know is clearly needed. You build up to sharing & then end up in a position where you feel unable to interact with services.

I ended up in the same position, I made a disclosure & because it involved abuse & me being a vulnerable adult my choice didn't matter. There was no child involved.

The place I receive support from now have agreed with me if I come close to making a disclosure of a safeguarding nature they will make me aware, allowing me to shut the hell up. I'm still pretty nervous which means I cannot get the advice & support I need.

It's incredibly difficult to continue to trust SS & other professionals when you have been let you down, especially when SA was involved. I wish I could say I'd found a way to build trust back up, but my involvement with them as an adult was in many ways as bad as my childhood experiences.

Your posts point to your life having been difficult at times. I hope things are improving for you, well done for seeking out support with your past, it's not easy.

You have very proactive, reaching out here, making contact with with the organisation involved. Worst case scenario make it clear you do not want to be contacted by anyone & ignore any you do receive. You aren't responsible for the abusive behaviour of another human being, if it that easy to speak out, we would.

Idontwantthat I'm so sorry to have scared you further. I think if I'd seen it coming I could have protected myself better.
I would have separated it out from the police better, and certainly wouldn't have let them just waltz in and treat me the way they did. But caught off guard and vulnerable and suddenly reliving a lot of past, I didn't feel able to stand up to them saying that everything they'd allowed to happen to me then, now reasonably made me their target, in order to not fail my children too.

They only looked at my actual parenting after they'd labelled me.
With hindsight I should have demanded they got reports from school, Dr etc first, as there were no actual allegations of poor parenting to defend or disprove. Just unspecified 'concern' because I'd 'come to attention.'

Yes to it being less daunting to be seen as a liar automatically, than to drag it all up and go through it all again and risk being seen as a compensation driven liar. I think you can get so used to not being believed, and you understand how that goes so it feels safer at the time.

I'm afraid using the past against you seems to be a common thing. When I tried to say I was being abused by someone in authority at thirteen, it was dismissed
as I'd said the same thing when I was eight. Apparently two different men in two different places was a ridiculous claim.

A child psychologist looked into why I might say such things and his reasoning was all explained to those in charge of me, who were then able to use it to keep the status quo. No one even believed I was pregnant until it reached a point where saying I was making it up was making them look naive at the very least.

Op I'm really sorry about what has happened to you here. Apologies if I'm repeating any PP, I have read all your posts but not the entire thread. I just wanted to say that in my area (not therapy but somewhere that disclosures aren't unusual), giving names or identifying information - even if historic (unless we know the perp is dead) would be enough to report. However for that reason we always remind people not to use names, give addresses etc, unless they're ok with information being passed on. It is common for people to talk about abuse without identifying anyone.

In our area if social services were passed this information and the person sharing the information didn't want it taking further, the information would essentially lie on file but attached to the alleged perpetrator. That way if say, there were concerns about that person around children, the earlier allegations would be known about. I believe the police can hold similar intelligence about individuals and that can be shared in appropriate forums (eg meetings where child sexual exploitation is discussed) but in both cases it is very much about 'information held about alleged perpetrator ' rather than in reference to you.

I do hope you have the energy and headspace to pursue a complaint. They shouldn't have pushed you for a name or specifics. They also shouldn't be naming you on the referral without your permission. There is no reason they couldn't have said 'information shared during a therapy session by a patient who wishes to remain anonymous and the information has been shared against their wishes on safeguarding grounds'.

This sounds much more appropriate to me. Your therapist acted very poorly OP.

@Idontwantthat I know you don’t need more hassle, but I think trust between you and this therapist has irretrievably broken down. If I were you I would contact the head of service, explain that your therapist handled this badly (perhaps through inexperience) and you need to be referred to someone else.

It’s not unusual for people to need to move practitioners and it shouldn’t be a problem. If they aren’t helpful contact the trust and put in a complaint.

I'm really sorry to all that's been done to you, both earlier and now.

You sound like you have strength and the knowledge of how wrong this is to challenge it.

Because of the life lived I certainly don't assume 'birth mum' to mean neglectful/abusive etc. When someone uses it about themselves my first assumption tends to be young, vulnerable, coerced, and probably heartbroken. Yes it can carry stigma but I'm sure there are a lot of others who read it like that too.

(I only didn't loose my older children because it was agreed I should marry my abuser when I got old enough and he was in a position to pull that to protect himself, and it certainly didn't end well.)

Reading back over the comments I can see that a PP has discovered that the vast majority of the staff working there are ex social workers which doesn't surprise me in the slightest as its all safeguarding safeguarding and to hell with anybody we damage in the process.

Is the person a qualified therapist? I ask because you’ve not been able to find her on any register and it’s not unusual to find third sector organisations employing social workers to do therapeutic work who have next to no counselling/therapy training. It’s also not unusual to find such organisations prioritise “safeguarding” over all else and in doing so fail to safeguard their clients.

Theres nothing in law that says they need to share this information, there’s no mandatory reporting procedures in the U.K. so they’re working within their policy and procedures rather than anything legally.

I really feel for you. I’d formally complain, ask for the qualifications of the person you were seeing and for a copy of their confidentiality and safeguarding policies. I’ll bet you can drive a bus through both.

Complain. This is a complete over reaction and abuse of their position. Pressuring you into disclosures is not the work of a competent therapist. I’d make a formal complaint and ignore any requests or letters. You have no obligation to further traumatise yourself and they ought to be ashamed. They don’t sound like they know what they are doing. And now sadly you can’t trust them. I’m sorry this has been your experience. Disclosure: I’ve worked as Mh professional for 20 years including lots of child protection and no way would I have reported this of put pressure for disclosure unless there was an immediate serious risk of harm.

Friends ex is a social worker. She really is unhinged. The stories coming out now her ex has escaped, well if you'd reversed it you'd be talking about emotional abuse, controlling behaviour, etc. Luckily she wants to party, go out a lot so he has the children a lot. He's finally building a relationship with them in peace

I don't know if social worker mental health workers are broken by the system. If they are then they shouldn't be loading a broken psyche with these sort of jobs

@Idontwantthat and @Elleherd 💔

It's really shocking. If they call you ,I think you can refuse to talk about the incident,is that something that would help? I can understand how betrayed you must be feeling and it's completely justified if you don't want to talk about any more things in detail. I just hate the fact that they continued to go ahead with it even though you asked to them not to. It's appalling. Therapy and any intervention has to be patient centric.