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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

For thinking SAHMs are making themselves financially vulnerable

655 replies

PeasOff · 24/07/2022 18:25

Would or do you depend on your partner financially?

Do you have a backup in place in case of breakup or for your retirement?

OP posts:
MsTSwift · 27/07/2022 07:35

Nonsense. Almost everyone I know who took a few years out to sahm is back at work. Good jobs too. As are several friends dhs who were made redundant and took over a year to find new roles. If you are smart and have professional skills that are valued by employers it’s absolutely fine to take a career break.

TartanGirl1 · 27/07/2022 07:41

MsTSwift · 27/07/2022 07:35

Nonsense. Almost everyone I know who took a few years out to sahm is back at work. Good jobs too. As are several friends dhs who were made redundant and took over a year to find new roles. If you are smart and have professional skills that are valued by employers it’s absolutely fine to take a career break.

So the actual stats on this subject is nonsense due to your little bubble? Ok then...

blueshoes · 27/07/2022 09:59

MsTSwift · 27/07/2022 07:35

Nonsense. Almost everyone I know who took a few years out to sahm is back at work. Good jobs too. As are several friends dhs who were made redundant and took over a year to find new roles. If you are smart and have professional skills that are valued by employers it’s absolutely fine to take a career break.

'@MsTSwift What are these 'good jobs'?

Many of us who are 'smart and have professional skills' (lol) who are actually doing these good jobs are saying that is not true but we won't know every job there is so do elaborate.

Topgub · 27/07/2022 10:11

@SleepingStandingUp

No, I don't think that's true.i don't think a 5 yo is any less vulnerable than a 3 yo.

@BessieFinkNottle

I dont want to think badly of sahms. As individual people they are as varied as wm. I dont think they come across well on these threads. I find the denial that they think being a sahm is best odd. The complete ott reaction to any perceived slight towards being a sahm while ignoring all the actually awful comments to wms.

@MrsBwced

It wasn't unpleasant. I dont think sahm mean (every time) to have a dig at wms but I think its often unavoidable because there's no way to say you want to be a sahm because you think its better (for what ever reason) without implying wms don't have the same priorities.

@MsTSwift comments being a prime example.

Implying wm must be jealous that they didn't manage to prioritise their kids and take a career break to raise them. (Who the fuck does she think is raising the kids of wp?!)

I post 1 reverse comment like that and you're outraged. The countless comments from sahm. Meh. Not worth a mention

Topgub · 27/07/2022 10:12

@MsTSwift

You do know not everyone lives in middle class bubble right?

SleepingStandingUp · 27/07/2022 10:20

@Topgub but generally they're more able to vocalise it. I know lots of people who say they'll send DC to school when they can tell them what happens. Of course that's a massive simplification of abuse etc and it doesn't necessarily work that way but a non verbal child is vulnerable in a different way to a verbal child.

SleepingStandingUp · 27/07/2022 10:25

I dont think sahm mean (every time) to have a dig at wms but I think its often unavoidable because there's no way to say you want to be a sahm because you think its better (for what ever reason) without implying wms don't have the same priorities this works both ways. Plenty of posts on these type of threads baout how SAHM are a bad example, not showing their children how to be responsible adults who work for their money instead of living off someone else, waste of an education, going to be screwed over when he runs off with someone more independent, etc.

For us, it was right given the circs. I think the majority of people would have made the same choice. The rest would have found their own solution.

Topgub · 27/07/2022 10:35

@SleepingStandingUp

I think being unable to leave your child because you're worried about abuse is irrational tbh

this works both ways.

It does

I think its more often about the effects on the woman/society though than the child

Youre much more likely to see sahm say its for the good of the child

milkyaqua · 27/07/2022 10:45

MsTSwift · 27/07/2022 05:52

There really does seem to be a subset of people who are very keen to see sahm brought down - revelling in tales of poverty stricken old age and abandoned wives. It seems to upset some that parents can take a pause in a long working life and take the time to raise young children then return to work. Win win. That’s what literally what I and every sahm I know did. Sorry (not sorry) if that upsets anyone 🙄

That might be a subset of older and wiser women wanting to warn of some potential pitfalls. But I guess the old and abandoned, unable to afford rent, who are sleeping in their cars are not relevant to those living in a strange bubble...

MrsBwced · 27/07/2022 10:57

@Topgub
Change unpleasant for goady if you want. My reason is the same.

You want it acknowledged that they think they are doing the best thing but admit if they say that it will be perceived as a criticism of working parents. So whatever is said you'll take offence.

I think the language used is the difference, I don't think me saying that being a SAHM is best for my family should be taken as meaning anything but that. I'm not saying it's the best thing for all everyone.

Topgub · 27/07/2022 11:07

@MrsBwced

Since when was proving a point unpleasant lol.

Sahms don't just say it was best for their family though

You said, I could see my children needed more of my time and input.

I also often wonder why sahm think what's best for their family wouldn't be best for everyone

What do they think other people are doing thats so different?

howmanypets · 27/07/2022 11:30

I think the issue here is that it doesn't really matter what SAHMs say. Just their very existence is aggravating and triggering for some people on here (clearly) because, even on an unconscious level, it essentially triggers the question, "What does she think she's doing with her kids that I'm not?" This is the crux of it really.

The unavoidable fact is, that where there is the choice to be a SAHM (there isn't for everyone), there is no getting away from the fact that those families have taken that decision because they think it's better for their kids. This is the whole point of having a SAHP. Why else would they be doing it?

It's similar to someone whose financial situation affords other choices - such as the choice to use private schools. In a sense, you've voted with your feet there. It's obvious you've chosen the independent schools route because you can and you think it's the better option than the alternative.

This is why even a seemingly innocuous comment such as, "I wanted to be the one there for my kids" (which is, of course, true for a SAHM and the whole point basically) incites such a backlash - "I do all that and a job!" "You are controlling!" "Do you think I'm a bad parent then?" And all kinds of convoluted projections about the husbands of SAHMs and what they are like; or statements about their financial vulnerability. All mums are super-sensitive where their kids are concerned. Projecting is a way of feeling better about yourself - "eg. Well I have to work, but oh, all their husbands will all have affairs and they'll all be destitute ... yes this HAS to be true...."

Most families in the U.K. today are struggling financially or are broadly in the category of the "squeezed middle". These families need two incomes. Also, a lot of people in here will earn more than their husbands, so no wonder they can't comprehend being a SAHM. It doesn't matter whether they want to or not - it's simply not a choice most women can make anymore. Many women on here are in marriages with separate finances. No wonder they can't begin to comprehend how other husbands are happy to financially support a SAHM and think nothing if it. How can they grasp this? The most vociferous SAHM critics in here are probably with husbands who can't or wouldn't financially support them even if they wanted to be a SAHM. No wonder SAHMs provoke suspicion and defensive vitriol.

This is why these threads always run to 1000 posts.

In short, the truth is, yes, SAHM are SAHMs because they think it's better for their children. There's no getting away from that.

BUT - it does not follow that, because of this, they think they are better parents than women who work. They understand that not all women feel the way they do, or even have the choice. What other families do or don't do is irrelevant. There are as many ways to be a good parent as there are women in the world.

Topgub · 27/07/2022 11:34

@howmanypets

Its impossible to think being a sahm is better for your children but not that you're a better parent

Especially given your post so heavily implies wm secretly wish they too could be sahm/are jealous that they're not.

Jumpstark · 27/07/2022 11:35

You're right, women can't win whatever we do!! That's why it's important to support and respect each other's choices rather than tearing each other down.

For what it's worth I have personally found it much easier than I thought to get back into well paid work after a long career break. But this is only my individual experience and followed a period of self employment and building contacts.

MrsBwced · 27/07/2022 11:37

@Topgub

Since when was proving a point unpleasant lol.
I was replying to your previous comment. Don't know why your laughing!

Sahms don't just say it was best for their family though
They probably all say different things because they are all different people. I was speaking for myself.

You said, I could see my children needed more of my time and input.
I did. It was as part of an answer to another comment. You said yourself you thought children needed more input as they grow up.

I also often wonder why sahm think what's best for their family wouldn't be best for everyone
Because all families are different. No family I know has exactly the same set up.

What do they think other people are doing thats so different?
Again people are all different. Do you only know people who do the same as you or something?

gatehouseoffleet · 27/07/2022 11:38

blueshoes · 26/07/2022 19:03

A few posters mentioned well paid jobs that women can walk back into even after a break of more than a few years.

Can someone elaborate because they would be good jobs for dds to go into.

I think there are loads - even things like being a lawyer. There are returner schemes and if you can keep ticking over in a part-time role, so much the better.

But otherwise teaching (even if you don't go back to school teaching, you might be a swimming teacher or teach English as a foreign language) seems an obvious one.

Also any medical-related career from nursing to being a GP to physio.

Hairdressing

Quite a few of these can be done part-time or on a freelance basis to keep your skillset current eg doing hairdressing at home.

Any job which is in sector where there are shortages. It depends how long a break you take but 3-5 years is ok.

Topgub · 27/07/2022 11:39

@MrsBwced

Yes, they need more time and input but not just from me

I dont think you have to be a sahm to give them the time they need, you do.

Topgub · 27/07/2022 11:44

@howmanypets

I also love the particularly snide insinuation that wm ohs just aren't man enough to provide for them 🤣

Now, thats how you goad

😆

MrsBwced · 27/07/2022 11:49

@Topgub

Yes, they need more time and input but not just from me

I dont think you have to be a sahm to give them the time they need, you do.

No I don't.

Topgub · 27/07/2022 11:51

@MrsBwced

That's how your comment came across

Flutterbybudget · 27/07/2022 11:51

I was 100% the following in this one. Packed in university when I found out I was pregnant with our son. Was a stay at home mum for over 20 years. My now ex had a lucrative career, while I worked evenings in a supermarket and paid for the household day to day expenses (food, petrol, clothes etc), while he paid for the mortgage and direct debits.
Come our divorce (he left me for my friend) I was left high and dry. He pays child maintenance for the youngest, but nothing towards the older ones (some working, some uni). I now work full time and more, on minimum wage. I’ve left my youngest at home crying this morning, because I have no time off to spend with her through the holidays (her older brother works nights, so is in the house) I feel like a crap mum and an absolute fool.
I will struggle financially for the rest of my life now, while my ex lives a life of luxury. His pension pot will be in the millions by the time he retires 🤷‍♀️
Now, I’m trying to encourage my daughters do take control of their own careers, and never to rely on a man to be true to his word.

howmanypets · 27/07/2022 12:00

You can think bring a SAHM makes YOU a better parent. It does not mean you think bring a SAHM makes all women better parents! This is obvious.

By 'better parent' you are saying - "I'm a better parent as a SAHM than I would be if I was working.' That does not translate to "I am a better parent than YOU!" Of course not! Loads if women aren't cut out to be SAH anyway. A good mum is a happy mum. As long as you're happy - what's the issue? Why the need to project and over-analyse other mums?

CecilyP · 27/07/2022 12:02

No, I don't think that's true.i don't think a 5 yo is any less vulnerable than a 3 yo

The powers that be think otherwise! Which is why the legal staffing ratios are completely different for 3 year olds and 5 year olds. I’m surprised that never occurred to you, having worked in nurseries.

gogohmm · 27/07/2022 12:03

Have you had a child with additional needs? If not you cannot probably understand why I simply couldn't hold down a job - there's no childcare available, school expect you to be able to collect multiple times a week at a moment's notice and there's constant appointments. My now ex husband understands this completely and I receive spousal maintenance for me (kids are over 21, I get maintenance for my dd with asd in addition)

Dinosauratemydaffodils · 27/07/2022 12:05

I also often wonder why sahm think what's best for their family wouldn't be best for everyone

Because it's circumstantial and there are multiple reasons for being a sahp. I'm a sahm because of postpartum psychosis, by the time I was due to return to work I had zero bond with dc1 and it was the opinion of my mental health team that I'd be making a huge error in judgement if I returned then. At points, I regret it but they were right I think regarding our relationship. However the circumstances which made it best for our family, hinged on the fact that in the aftermath of my illness I felt nothing for dc1. For everyone with a "normal" bond at the point of return to work, it would hardly be applicable.

Of my social circle who are sahms, there are those who ended up here due to birth injuries (incontinence for example or mental health like mine) or because their child/ren has extra needs. Then there are those whose partners work away, either offshore or abroad, potentially for months at a time. One friend saw her husband for 3 weeks in 2020. The sharing childcare model doesn't exactly work when they are 1000s of miles away for roughly half of the year. Obviously yes, just like my own father (military and then oil industry), they are mostly hands on when they are home but they aren't a lot of the time.

Unless you have exactly the same economic and/or social factors, there would be no point comparing or telling other women what to do.