To be angry at my BF's response to the current issues around abortion?

[ConfusedatAmerica]

I've been with my partner for just around 2 years. I've always struggled with his strong opinions and attitude to some things that I am deeply passionate about. Mainly my stance around women's issues, sexism and the way that men treat women.

I messaged him today sharing a video of a Tory MP in the House of Commons stating that women should NOT have an absolute right to bodily autonomy, and that this should be a point for political debate. His response was as follows :

'I can't be too upset with that MP, he has a right to an opinion and he was discussing it in the right fashion in the right arena - I don't agree with him, but I can't be angry at him because his belief is different to mine.'

I told him that his response was upsetting to me because if the MP had been discussing something that took away his bodily autonomy I would be angry on his behalf, especially with something as fundamental as bearing children.

He responded saying that 'All it is is in opinion and that the MP's opinion has no influence on the current state of affairs.' He then went on to say 'Are you angry at the Pope for every time he speaks? His opinion has much greater influence, and the Pope has been spouting antiabortion and homophobic statements for generations - point your anger towards people with much power. Not towards people with much power, not towards insignificant back benchers whose ideals don't meld with the zeitgeist.'

I responded and said that actually yes, I am angry at the Pope for his stance and that he should also not use his platform of power to state what he does. I also stated that Trump ended up in power through the backing of small minded individuals exactly like this MP.

It's not the first time we have disagreed on these sorts of issues. He has an attitude that regardless of experience everyone should be able to voice whatever opinion they feel (including himself and yes he can have some very polarising opinions), my attitude is that if your opinion does harm to another faction or undermines or wishes to take away another persons human rights then no you should not be entitled to share that opinion and that as a society we have a duty of care to ensure that these individuals are stopped.

AIBU here?

But everyone is entitled to their opinion

Who gets the final decision on what opinion is acceptable and what opinion should be cancelled?

I'd rather live in a world where I can share my opinions than have them cancelled by someone because they dont agree.

If he has such strong opinions and polarising views, maybe you should consider whether you want to spend however long with someone whose views don't appear to align with yours?

Life is difficult enough without battling with loved ones over differing opinions

This is so on point that it hurts.

This isn't about free speech, this is about a man saying to a woman that another man has a right to hold an opinion that has potentially devastating consequences long term to women.

Sorry, but that's nonsense. Men are also entitled to their opinions. His opinion does not have any consequences for women other than perhaps some mild annoyance.

my attitude is that if your opinion does harm to another faction or undermines or wishes to take away another persons human rights then no you should not be entitled to share that opinion and that as a society we have a duty of care to ensure that these individuals are stopped

I think your opinion is downright dangerous and utterly naive. You are fondly imagining that whoever the powers that be are that decide which individuals are not allowed to speak and which views are not allowed to be expressed, will always agree with you and your opinion. What if the powers that be decide that it is not allowed to talk about the right of women to choose as that harms unborn humans?

It is the absolute bedrock of democratic civilisation that different views and opinions are able to circulate and debate.

You are completely unreasonable. You are also unreasonable as you are clearly one of those people who loves to stridently express their opinion and then gets in a huff if the other person does not agree with you. If you don't like being disagreed with then keep your opinions to yourself.

YABVVU

I'm not controlling but my partner is only entitled to express opinions I agree with. Isn't that the MN way?

He can't speak for every man but he is telling you who he is. I'd run for the hills!

Agree

And free speech means OP BF said what he said about men and violence, effectively issuing a warning, and free will means OP could heed that warning.

doesn't sound like OP wants to, which is her choice. I think it's handy when men say that stuff - you know to run away. Fast.

The MP in question was elected to represent his constituents in the place where our laws are made. I think you are being very unreasonable. There is nothing your partner has said which is untrue. You seem hurt that he's not as angry about it as you. The MP's comments don't challenge his right to bodily autonomy so it doesn't feel personal to him. Men are free to talk about abortion and I'm free to ignore their opinions.

I am a strong advocate for a woman's right to chose and for free speech. I think it's highly undesirable to create a list of things which are unsayable in parliament, a healthy democracy depends on open, honest and robust debate.

I might prefer it if that Tory MP STFU but that's not how democracy works.

Recent posters have not seen your update.

Mmm, the problem with this is that people are entitled to be anti abortion because it comes under religious beliefs and that is protected in our society.

For instance, doctors and nurses who object abortion are allowed to opt out of treatment on women who have had abortions because their religious beliefs are protected. It never occurred to me until I was denied treatment in the U.K. for a medical abortion that went wrong (granted my life wasn’t in immediate danger but I had had sepsis during Labour only 7 months prior, which I believe put me at greater risk and my bloods were showing signs of possible infection. Plus I was kept in hospital 2 nights away from my breastfed baby). To me this is absolutely despicable and absolutely should not be allowed for a gyne dept in a country where abortion is legal but I’m not sure how we protect the right to religious beliefs from spilling over into public life. It’s certainly worrying and I would never believe the right to abortion is 100% safe in the U.K. especially given some of our MPs!

The MP was voted in by democratic process.
He is not breaking any laws by voicing his opinion.

YABU.

This.
He sounds like a real Prince 🚩

I don't think people have an automatic right to free speech either. Some people's views are very questionable and best kept to themselves.

In light of your update re Sarah Everard, he gives me the ick. I can imagine he likes playing Devil's Advocate except he's not playing, only pretending to

This is disgusting 🤢

Do you genuinely believe that the opinions of MPs have no consequences? Have you heard of Brexit?

Actually need not totally incorrect when he says that about how men think
There's a"classic" forensic text called "bad men do what good men dream" which endorses what he's saying.

Here's the question- you've been in a relationship with him for 2 years- you know him- do you like him? Love him? Agree that he is entitled to slightly different opinions to you? See him as separate entity to you, one that you cannot control?
Do you enjoy the relationship? Share common interests? Like each other's family values? Have plans for the future?

It amazes me how quickly mnetters would do away with free speech as soon as it provides a platform for uncomfortable and disagreeable opinions without any regard for the cascade of unintended consequences that dissolves any robust democratic function.

He will never ever be impacted by these opinions. So that's why he doesn't care and just sees it as an 'opinion'.

Honestly? This would be a deal breaker for me. There are some values that I feel have to be aligned and this would be one of them.

FWIW, my DH and teen DS were appalled and concerned about the US news.

This is a genuine question: if the same MP had stood up and said 'I don't think black people should have the same rights as white people' would that be equally acceptable?

I'm unbothered by the MPs opinion. Because it is just that, an opinion. If he was impacting current legislation then I would care - he isn't.

I can either get mad at every twat with an opinion different to mine or do something practical to change the power dynamic in society. I do this this by mentoring young women to get into highly paid jobs of the future where they will be able to influence things. I also do this by working voluntarily with charities in the developing world to promote condom usage which will give them some health protection against draconian abortion laws. I do all this in my free time. It's a lot better use of my time than just getting angry at people I can't influence or change.

But I also believe in free speech and the right to express an opinion.

Yabvu your partner is allowed an opinion.

If this MP said there should be a law brought in that child abuse is made legal would your partner be so eager to defend his right to his opinion?

People only seem to defend people like this when the issue doesn’t effect them.

Also don't forget that bodily autonomy for all sexes is a highly debated thing as currently we don't have the right to kill ourselves or euthanise others even if they want it. So I don't agree with the politician but bodily autonomy has always been contentious.

Acceptable? No.

Of course it's not fucking acceptable. And I don't think it's acceptable to suggest women's bodies belong to the state.

But where speech isn't legislated against (for example, inciting hatred - which I'm almost certain your example would fall under) then robust debate is the only way that we challenge shitty opinions and don't just sweep them under the carpet.