.... in feeling it's a bit eeerrrgghh to discuss money with little children?

[welliemum]

dd1 is 3 and has a little friend (let's call her Susan).

Susan's just turned 3. I was chatting to her about her birthday presents. She said "mummy bought me this, and daddy bought me that, and granny bought me that, and auntie bought me..." etc etc.

Whereas dd1 would have said "mummy and daddy/gran/ auntie gave me this".

Susan's standard response on being shown a possession of dd1's is "Who bought it?"

Susan's mum's standard response on being shown a possession of dd1's is "Was it expensive?"

This just makes me squirm. Am I right in thinking that little children should learn to appreciate things for what they are, rather than because they cost money? Or am I just being "a bit English about this" as DH would say?

My children see those ads on TV - there is one which seems to be telling you that you can spend as much as you want and presto get an IVA and be debt free after all that Xmas spending .
Another one goes on and on about how someone cut his mortgage payments and had money left over for his family holiday all by going to some new type of mortgage. So DS is advising us in all seriousness to call these numbers and solve all our money worries

These ads are all on children's channels btw (bad mother letting them watch Nick Junior and the like I know).

Honoria - I think the issue of maintenance payments, and who pays for what in a separated or divorced family, is very complex, and I don't think children should be kept in ignorance. I think that children should probably be preserved as far as possible from being hurt by the knowledge that one parent doesn't contribute (or contribute enough) towards their upbringing, but it is also important for them to know when both parents are contributing, and to what extent.

I'm in marketing so I take great pleasure in telling DS1 that the toy ads he seems are tring to persuade him to buy their toys even if they are not fun toys. He seems to get it.

The mother is perculiar and of course it is not about the cost of the gift, it's about the pleasure. Teaching children about money doesn't mean teaching them to be consumers imho.

peculiar i mean ..

Yes I agree Anna - it's just that in the scenario here it was a bit stressful for the child I thought, who immediately offered to ask her dad for shopping money. It puts them in the middle.

Straight answer to a straight question, I don't have a problem with but I think this was a bit different for the child who perceived it as a criticism of the other parent and who felt they had to DO something. Not their responsibility. I fully understand I'm asking people to be superhuman in not making this sort of remark though when they have to put up with the other parent not taking responsibility.

Except that, Honoria, children do have a responsibility, as they get older, for asking their parents for what they need - it is not just up to parents to be responsible for their children and to leap in and do/decide for them, or else for things just not to happen.

Re VS and the maintenance issue - we were fully aware from a young age that my dad wasn't paying maintenance. Whilst my mum struggled with the debt that he left her in, he found money to dye his hair (I kid you not) while we went to school with holes in our shoes - oh ok it was just one hole in one pair.............but you get the picture. I am very glad I knew about this. I would not have wanted her to keep it to herself. I grew up worrying about money to an extent (though I knew there were far more important things than money) but it made me determined to live in our own property. That security was vitally important to me and I think that worry propelled me to ensure I would not be in the same trapped situation as my mum.

PSML at VS's "wonder what happened to the change"

I am always prepared to be wrong

I do agree they have a responsibility to let parents know what they need and I can see why ll was happy to know whether dad was giving money or not...

as I say I am happy to be wrong but I just can't help feeling that there is another way other than telling the child direct "I wish he'd give us money for food shopping" resulting in them immediately offering to kind of mediate.....I dunno.

I say that we have to earn money before we can spend it and that we have to work to earn it. I have explained that everything we have is worked for. I explain that adverts are basically requests for cash. But then I don't want to bring another consumer into the world or someone who thinks everything comes on a plate. We also make homemade gifts, she baked biscuits for all her friends at xmas and made cards.

Hmm... difficult one. I agree it's not nice to see a little child being materialistic, on the other hand it's never too young to have a healthy appreciation of budgets and a realistic approach to spending.

I hate it when parents feel they have to give into their child's every whim for Xmas and birthdays because saying "it's too expensive" is simply not an option.

Honoria - it's complicated, I grant you.

However, I think that where parents are separated/divorced, children have more of a responsibility to let parents know what they need. It is so easy for children of separated parents to live in a situation where each parent assumes the other is doing things for the children - and in fact neither parent is, and the child loses out.

And, in the world we live in, many things need paying for - and so it does come down to asking for money.

As a stepmother, I am used to looking at my stepsons and wondering why such-and-such hasn't been done... Hey ho, their mother is finally taking them to the dentist today .

robin3 ditto

DS and I were having a conversation about our holiday, and we were talking about the chips - DS said did the chips come from England. I said no, it was too expensive to fly potatoes from England to Morrocco, so they would have been grown there. Then DS said, when I grow up I'll have an aeroplane that will be very cheap to go on and take things to poor countries for not much money. Forget all about the practicalities, I thought it was very noble of him!

on a lighter note, a friend was out shopping with her husband and six-year-old the other day. Her husband was fingering an x-box and the six-year-old piped up "stop that daddy, it's too expensive for us"

welliemum- YABU. Susan will have learned that things come from different people/places and is just practicing saying this. My dd just 2 said in the car as we drove past Homebase 'my bought my penguin there!' Not quite grammatically correct but she was practicing using the past tense. Children need to be aware that things do not magically appear and that they cost money. My dd at 2 goes into a shop and if we buy something hands the money to the shop assistant and collects the change. At three it is a great way to learn numbers and counting.
Answer, you are being English!

custardo I don't think it's a question of poverty. Parents need to say no to childrens requests and whims for very good reasons not because there is no cash in the bank. There comes a point when they will have to stand on their own two feet.

Honoria, there are many many more issues with the access/maintenace thing and it was at a point where she was starting to find out the truth about what he is actually like so I can see your point, but it really wasn't a conversation that I took lightly, DD is 7 and thinks logically, so when she realised her dad wasn't paying towards her but DP was (he likes to slag off DP and tell DD 'he's not your dad' etc) she thought it was wrong of her dad to not pay, and said she'd give the money to us so we could pay for things, she was immediately told, not to worry, it was fine and that we had plenty of money for things.

In one way she is very aware of money (she sells her old toys on ebay if she doesnt want them rather than throw away so she can use the money to buy other stuff) but she is also unaware at the same time (she doesnt have a clue about how much singular things cost or what that actually means, just that money isnt as freeflowing as she may sometimes assume).

My DD uses the term bought very frequently.

We have taught her that in order to get something from a shop it has to be paid for with money. Although she is only 2.5 when she goes to the shop and wants a apple for example, I will give her the 20p and she gives it to the cashier along with her apple. She will then say to DP 'Daddy I bought this apple'.

I wanted her to understand that things don't just come from nowhere but that they need to be paid for. So now if we go into a shop or she sees an advert on the tv we can explain to her that we don't have enough money at the moment and have to save for things, which she accepts quite happily.

So when she is given something by somebody she will say 'Mummy x bought this for me'.

WRT peopel 'buying' presents, I like DD to know that the person who gave her it actually worked to earn the money to pay for that present, I think it makes her more appreciative. (Goodness knows what she actually thinks people do at work though!)

Sherby - yes, my daughter (3.2) talks about "having to buy x" very often. Ever since she was tiny I have given her notes to hand over to pay for things, and helped her count the change, and we talk about going to work and earning money.

my dd says she'll go to work and get some money if I say no so I have more explaining to do..

OK, VS I totally see where you're coming from.

I am over-sensitive and picky on the subject because I spent a long time working with separated families some of whom really cynically and shamelessly used the children and I saw the stress and damage to the children through experiencing that.

CLEARLY this is not you and your family, just trying to explain why I'm so sensitive on the subject. I guess I pick up on things I shouldn't.

Sorry- quick aside- TheYoungVisiter- I love your name. I used to love the idea of that book when I was 12 and dreaming of being a writer.