.... in feeling it's a bit eeerrrgghh to discuss money with little children?

[welliemum]

dd1 is 3 and has a little friend (let's call her Susan).

Susan's just turned 3. I was chatting to her about her birthday presents. She said "mummy bought me this, and daddy bought me that, and granny bought me that, and auntie bought me..." etc etc.

Whereas dd1 would have said "mummy and daddy/gran/ auntie gave me this".

Susan's standard response on being shown a possession of dd1's is "Who bought it?"

Susan's mum's standard response on being shown a possession of dd1's is "Was it expensive?"

This just makes me squirm. Am I right in thinking that little children should learn to appreciate things for what they are, rather than because they cost money? Or am I just being "a bit English about this" as DH would say?

shes not really old enough to understand whats shes saying but is obviously copying her mums way of speaking.
ds1 asked me this week how much i earnt a week! (hes 9) and i told him its none of his buisness, he doesnt need to know such things yet, but his friend was talking about how much hid dad earns, apparently thousands (he a postman so not as much as ds1's friend was telling everyone though!!)

i think their only children they dont need to know about money just yet do they?
they will pick it all up as they get older.

DS (age 5) asks "who bought me this" when referring to specific things (Christmas presents/treats etc) and so I tell him and then, next time he sees them - he thanks them under his own steam; even if it is the fifth or more time!

I like the fact that he asks and acknowledges that it takes money to have things (most things) and he understands that I have no "pennies" to buy this or that depending on whatever it is or I say "well, we will need to save up for it".

I personally don't think there is anything wrong with kids learning about money and how to use it (or realising that money buys things that people give us); I think it sets kids up for a good-with-money attitude really.

I don't get the "was it expensive" thing though - that seems a bit odd. It doesn't matter if it was expensive or not, surely (unless she is just a snobby type?)

I disagree - if my mum hadn't been so open with me and my DB about money (my dad never was with anyone - terribly "english" in his way of thinking and it nearly ended up with us being homeless and bankrupt) then I don't think I would have appreciated the value of things/money management etc like I do.

OK I'm not great at doing it - but I understand how it should be.

I'm fairly open with the DS's (especially DS1 who's 7) about money as I do think it's important to learn about it early.

Although I must admit the "how expensive" thing about gifts is rather - a gift is a gift IYKWIM.

What's eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeugh about it? If my DS wants to know how much something costs and/ or how much I earn, why on earth should I withhold that information? I tell him how babies are made too.

Agree it's incredibly vulgar to focus on the cost rather than the pleasure of the gift though.

i wonder if this was maybe a bit misinterpreted some children of the many i have cared for refer to toys and possesions as "expensive" if it means they are to be careful and look after it .....for example i might myself say to matt aged 7 we cant go to the park right now cos youve got on your best expensive trainers on but we can put your play ones on and go later?or i might say he cant have playmobil out when theres more than 3 other children here as its too expensive to lose all over the house... -could this be the case? or am i as dh suggests- just too nice??

Don't have a problem with Susan copying her mother's speech patterns, "bought" rather than "gave", but her mum's standard response is weird.

Children do need to learn value though, and DS gets a £1 a week which he saves for small toys. And we tell him if he can't afford certain ones. But if I told DS I earned £1000 a year working full time, he'd be "wow, that's soooo much". So still doesn't have that much perspective on money. Which is just fine at 6.

I'm torn really - the whole "was it expensive" thing makes me very uncomfortable. Susan's mum is very money focused in a way that I'm not.

On the other hand I would hate my children to grow up thinking that we have a money tree (we don't!) because obviously I want them to be sensible about money when they're older.

But I do find myself avoiding talking about money with dd1 (whilst perfectly happy to have endless discussions about babies coming out of people's bottoms) and I think maybe I'm being too squeamish about this.

You don't have to be like Susan's mum though with regards to discussing it - she is just weird, tbh!

Does your DD ask about money? Does she get rides whilst out shopping or sweets ever? Could you give her the money to pay and then get change if necessary - this is an easy, early lesson for her; ie, that 10p will only buy a small pack of haribo, not a bar of chocolate so you can either save it for another day (or scout round the floor like my DS looking for dropped coins ) or spend it now and have the sweets now..?

It is that sort of thing I do with DS - it "teaches" that money is needed to get things but at this age they don't have a clue about proper values (for example - DS found a penny the other day and said "ooo that will buy me a ride" - which it won't, so I said he will have to get some more coins from his money-pig (don't ask!) to do that if he wants, or he can just add it to the collection.)

Sorry for the waffle...!

wHILST reading this it reminds me of dd. When she was small, dh and I were having one of them through gritted teath arguments, about money, more specifically the mortgage. From then on dd would say to EVERYONE I'm not allowed ice cream .. we have a mortgage. .. I had in fact been saying to dh I didn't think we could afford a new motorbike as we do have a mortgage you know.
10 years later and that still makes me squirm.

ROFL @ "I'm not allowed ice-cream, we have a mortgage" LOL LOL!!

My DS (7) has always been very interested in money - I htink because he loves numbers.
He wanted to know how much do postmen earn the other day, and thought it was just fabulous that you could be PAID for RIDING A BIKE !
I do think children need to understand £ doesn't grow on trees, and that you have to work for it, and save up for things etc. Also if Grannie sends a big cheque for his birthday I'd rather just put it away instead of buying yet more plastic tat. He used to love coming to the "Building Site" to pay money into his own account.

I grew up feeling ashamed of being poor by the way and would much rather just be honest about what you can and can't afford, but I felt really embarrassed when he told me he'd been comparing notes in the playground about how much his friends had in their savings. Tried to explain that it's not good manners because some people could be sad if they've not got as much as others.

Bit of a long post..I am wittering aren't I?

That sounds really good, LewisFan - I think I might try this.

dd1 doesn't really ask about money - she obviously sees me paying for things in shops but doesn't know how it all works. She knows she can't automatically have anything she wants but I tend not to relate it to money, eg saying "No, we don't need that right now" or "We have enough food now".

When I was a child my parents never talked about money - I'm in my late 30s and I still have no idea what my parents earn - and I don't think this was a good thing at all, because I grew up completely unable to budget and had to learn fast when I left home (and made lots of avoidable mistakes).

LOL at the mortgage/icecream dilemma!

That's a good point choccypig - I guess another thing holding me back from discussing money is that whatever I say about our finances will be relayed by dd1 to everyone she meets [cringes]

You can do money-awareness without details though. I just say "sorry - got no more pennies" (as in actual, physical coins in my purse) for whichever thing it is at the moment DS asks for; however he doesn't know that I budget/live on a knife-edge money wise. I feel I have to do this though because I'm on benefits; I feel that DS needs to know I don't have the monies available to get a DS lite/Wii/whatever "like so n so at school".

Another good idea is to play "shops" - you don't even need pretend money (bits of paper work well I found!).

I think part of you knows money-awareness is important (when you say about avoidable mistakes) but because you never got told about it / discussed it, it seems odd to do so?

I would have a problem with a child who seemed to value possessions (or friends) according to mercenary values.

But I've never had a problem with discussing simple everyday money decisions with my children. As long as you can do it calmly and on a reasonably happy note. They've had pocket money since the age of 6 and we've played Pop-to-the-shops more times than I care to remember.

I guess it's like sex, you'll feel uncomfortable in discussing it with your los in proportion to how hung up you are about it yourself. Personally I have no problem in explaining to my dcs that we can't have the same holidays or do quite the same thing as their cousin or some of their friends because we earn less than their parents- because it's not something I feel terribly upset about myself. I want them to know that there is a wide gap between having-everything-you-dream-of and being destitute. It's one thing that really annoys me about the Harry Potter books: how the otherwise sensible Weasley parents cringe and apologise to their children because they're not rich. I like to think I am a bit more robust!

I do also try to focus on the positive things you can do with money, how money well spent can help other people and change the world for better.

understand what you mean
but I think we read more into it than necesary

I was slightly horrified when ds was visiting Father Christmas and he said
"so what shall I BUY you for xmas"
ds didn't pick up on it

I agree with LF that it is the attitude not the words that matter.

When ds1 was 2 his grandma made him a really beautiful toy that took a huge amount of her time so I explained that she had made it. This meant that I needed to explain that other presents had been bought not made. I think that this was a really useful distinction for him to learn.

welliemum- I have the exact same concerns about my little nephew (6) and niece (4)- exact same terminology. Makes me cringe inwardly every time they say as well. I know that it comes from their parents (much as I love my sister, and I know she does not do it deliberately and is not horribly materialistic) though, and I'm imagining that it's the same for "Susan".

i think in some families it is only prudent to make children realise that mummy and daddy cant aford everything they see on the adverts

my children certainly appreciated things they used to get when we wuz poor and never asked for much.

There is a horrible Flashman type boy in my ds's class who declared once "My house is worth £2 million." When I met his parents had to surpress a snigger.

(I couldn t help looking it up on the class address list and he's probably right, but imagine that being his family breakfast table discussion)

i should think if my house was worth that much it would be worth much discussion.

your all snobs

I do agree, but I have noticed lots of people get 'brought' and 'bought' mixed up.

I agree with LF - I don't avoid the money issue with ds cos I want him to understand that money has to be earned and is not in constant supply, on the other hand I don't want him to be materialistic so we try to encourage him to value things irrespective of their monetary worth.

I do believe in having my children grow up with a knowledge of money because my parents never taught me or my brothers the value of money. We were never given a allowance or allowed to work (they believed that our jobs were simply to study). As a result, none of us have balanced a checkbook, and my youngest brother is a spendthrift who earns little, but will blow what he has (or doesn't have) on luxury items like caviar and cashmere jumpers.

I have explained what "expensive" is to DS (4), because I want him to understand that there is a cost to things, and some things cost more than others, which means that one has to work longer/harder to acquire those things, and thus should treat them with respect. I don't want him to be materialistic, just responsible.

I also have explained what "expensive" is to ds (3 and a half yo) so that he doesn't destroy things that are! In our house that isn't much