Employee stealing from a food bank

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NC'd for this. I run a food bank. I have a (paid) assistant Mary, along with lots of volunteers. My assistant used to be a volunteer, for context, but this is now her first proper job. She's on the autistic spectrum but very high-functioning. She is due to leave at the end of this month (travel, then uni). She's 19.

Anyway - I'm pretty sure she's stealing stock. Not donations from the public, but corporate type donations - bulk packs of biscuits, crisps etc. Always treat-y things rather than the (many) more mundane foods we have. Eg we receive two boxes of Dairy Milk at 2pm on Monday, I see them on the shelf, I head off at 3.30 and leave Mary there to finish whatever task - and when I come back in at 7 the next morning, one of the boxes is open and two large bars are missing. That sort of thing, again and again. On some of these occasions other people are in too, but the common denominator is Mary (and she'd always be the one in last/locking up). It's also extended to leaving the wrappers lying around on occasion, which is both dumb and infuriating.

Lives at home in a very well-off house, no expenses/money issues, no shortage of food - I'm quite certain. It feels, instinctively, like "teenage bottomless pit" type behaviour.

So:
Catch her out definitively?
Give her a vague but pointed chat about our stock and what it's for?
Say something before I wave her off at the end of the month?
Ignore?
Some other thing?

I don't think the value of what she's stealing is any great shakes, but a) really, who the hell steals from a food bank? b) theft is theft c) I trained her up and gave her a brilliant opportunity with this job, so I find it quite hurtful. I also would rather she learn her lesson now rather than when she's, I dunno, Chancellor of the Exchequer.

I don't have any other managers etc to bounce this off. I have trustees, who I suspect will leave it with me to make a decision as I see fit. WWYD?

I'm sorry, but this is painfully ableist. It really is.

'High functioning' autism doesn't mean you're less autistic. It means you're able to do more things more independently. The issues with not understanding social cues and nuance are still there. The challenges are still there. Just because an autistic person is able to mask very well and come across almost the same as an NT doesn't mean their brain works the same way.

Passing exams for school and uni has absolutely fuck all to do with 'reading signals'. Academic intelligence and social skills are not the same thing. I got straight As in everything at school. I had a degree and a Master's and I didn't realise it wasn't OK to help yourself to stock from your job. How would I know that? It's not information you learn from a book, is it? It's one of those things NTs just instinctively 'know'.

Explaining something is not treating someone like a child. That's, once again, your ableism coming out. Telling someone, in a calm neutral tone, that it's actually not OK to eat the stock from work, is not treating someone like a child.

I have to agree with pixie5121. It's highly possible she has no idea she;s doing worng. Explain before your condemn. If she does it again after that, different story.

@goldfinchonthelawn it’s clear she knows as from the OP she does it in secret and denies when confronted. It will hurt her more to ignore it and pretend she’s gotten away with it - some people with autism need these things clearly spelled out, as they do not always feel the implicit social pressure that NT people do.

‘Tiptoeing’ was in reference to {mention: pixie5121} insisting that the girl was being punished for being ND.
Which is quite the opposite. She hasn’t been fired straightaway as an NT person would have been, especially as she’s already been caught out lying about other mistakes that she made.

Which is why the OP is probably asking what other steps she can take. Of course the first step should be to talk to her, but if she says no, and you can’t exactly set up cameras etc what else is left to do?

For the record I have ADHD, partner is autistic and there are loads of ND people in my field. It then becomes a question of how behaviour impacts other people in general. Not a question of ‘NT vs ND’ which is always the soundbite it boils down to on forums like these

Op would be hard pushed to fire anyone without a policy in place, sounds like any expectations are implicit and not written.

In any case, the thread and my examples still stand as crappy attitudes no matter how you try and justify it.

Exactly.

OP is put out because she thinks it's obvious that you don't eat food donated to a foodbank and is taking it almost as a personal insult (talking about how much effort she put into training the girl).

It's not really relevant that she gave her the opportunity or trained her up. OP has admitted Mary has been a very good employee and is conscientious. That isn't negated by her eating a few bars of chocolate because she didn't realise it wasn't OK.

I made silly little mistakes like these when I first started working and the reactions to them absolutely destroyed my confidence. I ended up going fully freelance by my late twenties because I couldn't handle this shit from people who expected me to read their minds. I felt so betrayed when meetings were called with several attendees about a trivial matter that could have been cleared up with a simple chat. It was alien to me that they would assume the worst and talk to me as if I'd purposely done something wrong.

This is exactly the kind of thing that keeps many autistic people out of employment. It genuinely is.

It's not really relevant that she gave her the opportunity or trained her up. OP has admitted Mary has been a very good employee and is conscientious. That isn't negated by her eating a few bars of chocolate because she didn't realise it wasn't OK.

I haven’t “admitted” anything; it isn’t the Vardy trial. I’ve written, possibly twice but at least once, that she was very conscientious etc but in the last few months (in the same timeframe as the theft) has needed talking to about being late, being on her phone for ages etc. Which are also things she didn’t used to do.

Another point which is worth remembering is that autistic children and young people lag behind their NT peers when it comes to emotional maturity. So intellectually she may be on a par with her peers but in terms of her social skills, she's probably way behind.

I do actually have some grasp of how this mother has parented her child and I also understand to a degree about masking.

One of my cousin's is also high functioning autistic/Aspergers combined and again, I know he masks his autism sometimes, but I haven't grown up closely with him. However, he's also performing with his music and living in Berlin (is from UK/NZ).

I never said that OP shouldn't explain the right and wrong to this young woman. Indeed I've actually been quite understanding of both her and the young woman in question.

What I and other posters were more concerned about was the fact that some people she may encounter may be less understanding than OP and from what my friend has told me with her son, you can explain things to him and he will understand, but obviously in his own way. I think there are lots of nuances for a non NT. And sadly, if you are autistic then of course you'll jump down the throat of anyone NT if you feel got at.

Everything you've mentioned a NT teen/young adult could do in their first job, e.g. be late, talk on the phone a lot. It's not specific to autistic (whether high functioning or not) teens/adults.

Lots of people make silly little mistakes like you've done at work who are NT. Do you not realise that?!

In my views, people should be treated the same but yes, you should take an autistic person's (high functioning etc) health issues on board and act accordingly too. Where have I said not to do that?

There's a bit of supposition here too re this young woman's eating disorders which she may or may not have, without asking her (and then risking upsetting her further). All OP is upset about and rightly so is the theft!

OP - I hope you get things sorted out and the Trustees can be of some support. I'm a bit staggered that there's no Employee Handbook! And that you help/speak to the young woman in question in a supportive way.

If anything this is a really salient point for:

• Organisations (charities?) like food banks to maybe have employee manuals/HR depts (do they or don't they and if so why/why not?
• For volunteers/employers of volunteers to be open about their health conditions so that people they work with can be understanding and accommodate them.
• It should not have to be up to OP to deal with a passing remark that her employee is 'on the spectrum' and then deal with the fall out from this.

In a non charity company obviously there are policies in place and presumably the above doesn't happen as it leaves them open to rightly all sorts of legal challenges.

And sadly, if you are autistic then of course you'll jump down the throat of anyone NT if you feel got at.

Could you be any more patronising? Everything you right is barely disguised dislike and dismissal of the needs of autistic people. Paying lip service with oh my friend's aunt's brother in law has asd so I'm an expert.

*write

This entire thread is a perfect example of the disgusting ableism we face on a daily basis.

It all comes down to expecting autistic people to function like neurotypicals. We don't. All of the thinly veiled 'tough love' and 'teaching her a lesson' stuff doesn't work with autistics. All it does is traumatise people.

There is literally only one way to deal with this fairly - talk to Mary calmly and ask her if she ate the chocolate bars. If she says yes, ask why, and then explain calmly but firmly why that isn't OK. That's literally it. If there's no manual that says you can't eat snacks, she genuinely might not know.

All this shit about 'catching her out', 'vaguely pointing out what the stock is for' is manipulative NT nonsense. We don't work like NTs. All that will achieve is making Mary feel targeted and bullied (and IMO, rightly so) and ensuring she no longer feels safe working with others in a regular job. That's exactly what happened to me, and it's exactly why so many of us don't work at all.

And what if Mary lies and says no?

Exactly, Donkey - this is what the OP herself said about it a couple of days ago:

'I don't think asking straight out will work, because in the past when I've asked her straight out about mistakes she has clearly made, she makes up a dumb rabbit-in-headlights lie. So I suspect I'd get "Oh, the chocolate? How strange. No, I have no idea" - even if she was the only one in at the time. And then what?'

Sorry if I have missed this, but have you actually clearly told her the food shouldn't be eaten? I know it may seem obvious, but I can see how a teenage brain might think free food is free food. After all, nobody needs chocolate for survival.. and she could walk in off the street, without proving anything about her neediness and be given it, right?

Just talk to her - "heh just to make clear, the food should never be eaten. I'm telling everybody because I'm noticing that the odd chocolate bar/ biscuit is regularly getting taken, and that's not acceptable. Please pass it around and remember yourself. It's something if I see keeps happening I would be very unhappy about'. "

How does OP know she's lying? Maybe she didn't realise what she'd done.

It's not as if this is a long term employee and OP is going to have to get rid of her. She's leaving anyway. It's a total non-issue. Imagine trying to ruin someone's life over a few chocolate bars. Bizarre.

And BTW, OP, try to avoid using gross ableist slurs like 'dumb' and perhaps go on some sort of disability awareness course. You could probably use one.

Doesn’t answer the question though, what if Mary says no? How should OP handle it appropriately then? Because people do lie, and Mary may well be lying and carry on with this behaviour, which cannot carry on as this is a food bank and it’s theft!

I'd ask her directly, and only if she denies helping herself would I raise it to the staff as a whole. I don't like dragging things out to become everyone's problem or trying to embarrass people into public confessions - you're fairly sure it's her, so have the decency to ask her privately.

Wasn't my answer implicit?

So what if she lies? She's leaving in about a week. If OP is convinced it is her, then what good would asking the entire team do? Why is she even making such a mountain out of a molehill because someone ate a few chocolate bars?

If it was Mary, it'll stop in a week when she leaves. If it isn't Mary, that will soon become apparent.

If OP's concern is genuinely that she doesn't realise she's stealing and she'll get into hot water for it at a future job, then she can, you know, just tell her that. It's not complicated, is it?

Please stop being so aggressive in your posts.

To me, Mary sounds like a complete PITA (work performance drops off, doesn't take responsibility for her performance, appears to lie to her boss, prime suspect in the disappearance of both stock & shared employee food). OP has tried to do the right thing & do it sensitively.