'Distance reiki' - quack or what?

[mackthepony]

Mate has started doing reiki.

She's now offering 'distance reiki' - same as normal reiki but feels your energy online. And yes, there's a charge for it.

🙄

Is it just me? Wtf?

Well, I’ll just say my reiki power comes down a direct line from the original reiki master (apparently), so I wouldn’t mess with that kind of clout if I was you!

However, I can send you a level up for a reasonable donation of £850, or just £199.99 if you can get 5 other suckers students to sign up to my course.

It not narrow minded to assume these things don’t offer any benefit, beyond a placebo, when they have been extensively studied and proven not to. It’s like being open minded as to whether or not the earth is flat.

The placebo effect does, of course, do some good so you could argue that there is some benefit as a complimentary therapy. Two issues with that:

1. it means that Reiki is as of much benefit as any other alternative therapy somebody could make up on the spot (Penn and Teller once did a good bit on this, where they arranged for people to have various therapies that were made up for their show, like having toilet plungers used on their back under cover of mysticism - sure enough the patients felt a benefit); and
2. sometimes people eschew actual, proven treatments in favour of ‘alternative’ (nonsense) ones, which can of course be very dangerous.

I also think it’s immoral to lie about the efficacy of a treatment in exchange for money, but I suppose you’d justify that with reference to the placebo effect.

I’ve just seen you can distance learn reiki these days too, which is weird, because it used to be that they had to draw a symbol on your back to pass the power to you 🤔

There was a really good Darren brown show on this. He pretended he was running a drug trial and gave participants a sugar pill. He gave each group a different story about what the pill would fix - stop smoking, improve skin conditions, help concentration etc. The impact was incredible, people’s skin conditions completely went away purely because of the placebo effect. It’s a powerful thing.

That's what gets me about this whole thing. You have the placebo effect, which is genuinely proven to be incredibly powerful and fascinating and still substantially unexplained. And people prefer to believe some boring, stupid, soft-brained bilge about mystical energy. Honestly.

Quack on surely? 😁

@DrippyLongstocking of course it is dangerous to ignore proven treatments and just participate in complementary therapies. On the other hand it is narrow minded to think that modern medicine and therapies are the only things that work. Like I said, I find reiki relaxing and I am very chilled out afterwards, and when I was having chemotherapy it was the only thing that helped me sleep (more so that the “proven” sleeping pills the hospital gave me), maybe being in a chilled out environment with someone guiding me to relax was all the impact, but when you aren’t sleeping because of the amount of drugs in you then you’ll take whatever works without question. I’m also not disputing that there are studies that show it doesn’t work, although I haven’t seen any as it’s not the kind of thing I would look up. If people get benefit, placebo effect or not, then does it matter if they believe it works? It’s not preying on the vulnerable like a psychic might, it’s offered as a complementary therapy.
And on the bright side, apart from a lighter wallet, if it doesn’t work there can’t be any harmful side effects.

It’s very narrow minded to suppose that these things don’t do anything if you haven’t tried them
**
That's just name calling to avoid thinking about the topic.

Real narrow mindedness is ignoring objective data because it clashes with your prejudices. Real narrow mindedness is thinking your feelings are more valid than anything else. Real narrow mindedness is not being arsed to learn the Scientific Method, so you can understand your own limitations.

Can I ask the practitioners if they use their wondrous gift of healing when they are out and about and they spy perhaps an elderly woman walking with a limp and then using their third eye or whatever it is that gives them the power to heal from afar and they concentrate on healing the old lady as she shuffles slowly along?

Do you then marvel at her sudden cure as she breaks into a run and you watch her canter off down the road?

Excellent question!

I mean, if these people can heal others from a distance, surely they can just heal anyone, anywhere? So are they choosing to not do so or is there some explanation that they can give is for why they can heal people but won't?

If people get benefit, placebo effect or not, then does it matter if they believe it works?

For one thing, believing in arrant nonsense makes your brain go all soggy.

For another, "alternative" practitioners frequently prey on people who are having a difficult time with medicine and their health, and frequently actively encourage them to withdraw from medical treatment and focus only on "alternatives".

Medicine no longer gives out placebos while pretending they're something else, despite the fact that placebo treatment can produce spectacular results, because it's universally considered to be unethical.

What are you talking about? Most “alternative” practitioners usually do not prey on people who are struggling with medicine and their health. It’s frequently the other way round. It’s people who make an informed choice to personally seek out these alternative therapies, as a last resort or in conjunction with traditional medical care, or some times just for the fun it.

Secondly, i have never met an alternative therapies practitioner who has discouraged me or any other people that I know, using these therapies, to stop using traditional medical treatments. Never. That’s just nonsense. In fact, it has always been
the opposite. If there are any potential medical issues I have been encouraged to always seek out medical help from a doctor. It’s a given, with any practitioner. Please stop making sweeping statements like this.

At the bottom of the last paragraph I meant to say that “It’s a given, with any decent practitioner”.

It’s not preying on the vulnerable like a psychic might, it’s offered as a complementary therapy.

What's the difference? Both are unproven, but might work as a placebo.

There are studies, done by those medical types. The biggest correlate with using "alternative" therapies is having had a difficult time with "conventional" medicine, and there are many documented instances of practitioners encouraging their "clients" to avoid or decline medical care.

"On the other hand it is narrow minded to think that modern medicine and therapies are the only things that work.*

Do you know what they call alternative medicines that work? Medicine!

Yes, that’s why they independently seek out alternative complimentary therapies. Again, these are informed choices made by the individual. I have personally never been duped into going into any alternative therapy - it was my choice completely. I researched the process and absolutely understood what I was undertaking. Just because it’s not science does not mean that people can’t make their own informed choices.

And of course you get a so called practitioners who may discourage their clients from continuing proper medical treatments. These are for sure charlatans and should be called out. But then you get charlatans in all kinds of jobs, in all industries. Any alternative therapies practitioner worth their salt will never ever advise their clients not to seek medical treatment.

Secondly, i have never met an alternative therapies practitioner who has discouraged me or any other people that I know, using these therapies, to stop using traditional medical treatments. Never. That’s just nonsense. In fact, it has always been the opposite

Oh dear, you're one of those "that never happened to me therefore it never happens to anyone". How very closed minded of you. Willing to accept reiki but not common sense. How surprising!

Again, these are informed choices made by the individual. I have personally never been duped into going into any alternative therapy - it was my choice completely. I researched the process and absolutely understood what I was undertaking. Just because it’s not science does not mean that people can’t make their own informed choices

Most choices aren't very informed. Many people don't have the will or the capability to independently research, and even some that do don't really understand. To many "research" is the top few sites on Google.

I mean, the fact that you say you thoroughly researched the process and understood is fully is a case in point: there is NO serious actual research that explains the process of reiki and how it works. OR that it does work. So how, exactly, did you understand it?

I know someone doing an online dog training course. They don’t even have a dog, their Nan has a dog, which can’t be let off a lead because it has no recall ( sight hound) but they don’t live with their Nan . Apparently the trainer teaching the course says they are very good. As far as I can see they have taught the dog to give a paw, which I am pretty sure it did anyway if you waved a treat. Personally I am thinking of doing an online cookery course , entering Masterchef , winning,setting up my own restaurant , writing a cookery book and getting the Saturday morning kitchen gig. Can’t see any problems with my plan. The online reiki sounds a lot easier tbh.

Thanks for being so belittling and patronising. Good debating skills. If someone doesn’t fall into your line of thinking you insult them.

Again, these are informed choices made by the individual. I have personally never been duped into going into any alternative therapy - it was my choice completely.

The word duped means to be tricked, conned or grifted. Of course you think you have made your own informed choice otherwise you would have been robbed with menaces.

Presumably the people who send money to Nigerian princes are making informed choices too?

You're confused: I'm not debating with you. Your point was worthy of being belittled, you don't think things happen if they haven't happened to you, a very silly way of thinking.

Thanks for being so belittling and patronising. Good debating skills. If someone doesn’t fall into your line of thinking you insult them.

The 'how very closed minded of you' by that poster was because a PP said anyone who doesn't believe in woo is closed minded. It was ironic.

The rest was trying to point out the problems with your critical thinking which have left you vulnerable to being tricked. It may feel bad to confront you errors but it's how we grow.

The people engaging and trying to explain are being kind, even if it doesn't always feel that way.

It’s hard to make ‘informed choices’ on how to spend money, energy and time when experiencing, for example, pain, fertility issues, cancer, bereavement.