To expect a landlord to have told us this before signing lease?

[Lexi334]

Moved into a rental a couple of months ago. Let through a large local letting agent.
We viewed the property with the agent, submitted our application then the landlord requested to meet us herself so we came for a second viewing at the property with the landlord. We were here for an hour while she showed us a round and generally chatted about the property.
We got the keys a couple of weeks later and came into the property to find a “handbook” with all kinds of requests to do with the house:

• which garden plans should be watered on which days, and when each particular plant should be pruned


• under what circumstances we can/can’t use the outdoor access to our back garden (mid terrace) - allowed to walk round the side once per week to take bin out and once to take bin back. No other access for any reason!


• boiler pressure needs to be topped up every 5/6 days - it’s in the attic 🙄

Pretty annoying and odd but it is what it is.

I arrived home from work a couple of weeks ago to find a Gardner in cutting the grass in the back garden. When I asked him what he was doing there he said the landlord asked him to continue doing the front and back gardens - grass cut, borders tidied and weeded, pots maintained - at a cost of £40 per fortnight “to be paid in cash or by bank transfer by tenant” is what she’s emailed him.

Not long after I’ve had a window cleaner put a note through the door saying the windows were cleaned and we now owe 2 payments. It’s £12 per fortnight. Again, contacted them and the landlord has requested it. Again, to be paid by the tenant.

Ive spoken to the letting agent who contacted her (this process takes about 10 days to get a reply back 🙄) and she says this is regarded as “general upkeep” that we need to do on the property and she prefers it done to her standard by a “trusted professional”. So on top of the rent that I’m paying (which is already very high for the area), she expects over £100 a month to be paid in “general upkeep” too.

Surely this should have been disclosed before entering into a lease? Obviously I planned on maintaining the windows/garden etc but surely it should be my choice as to whether I do that myself or pay someone else to do it?

Just checking - you’ve read your lease? If it’s not in the lease that you need to use certain tradespeople or about access/boiler etc then you’re not required to do that. The boiler is going too far - she needs to get a local plumber/heating technician in to take a look and fix it if broken.

I wonder what the legal situation would be for accessing the back alley way?
Would limited use of this access be in the deeds for the owner occupier too or is this a sort of casual agreement she’s made with the other houses to keep them on side as she’s renting out her house ?

double check the contract but you are under no obligation (normally) to pay this. She clearly sees this as “her house” it’s your house. She’s a crazy LL.

My windows are cleaned twice a year and are absolutely fine. My boiler very rarely needs topped up.
She's taking the mick. Tell her you will not be paying for window cleaners or gardeners on her terms. Could you get a letter from a gas service engineer saying a boiler should never need topped up that often and use it as evidence as to why you won't be doing this. She might then be forced to fix it rather than risk worse damage.

Perhaps your LL has a right of way to use the path for bins or maintenance. Similarly we have a narrow path behind our old terrace houses for access which dates back 3 centuries. No-one uses it and it would be intrusive to do so as you can see into the kitchens, it's raised steps to front door, and from the back to the garden

sorry image not that clear but I think this is what OP means the properties are obviously built on steep incline hence all the steps
the fact that the back gardens are enclosed and fenced beyond the access path suggests to me it is a permanent access to back doors as you are not actually going through gardens and as blocked between houses 2 and 3 it is not there as a loop for all and sundry so access for bins and furniture etc to save carrying up 11+ steps to front door so possibly reasonable to use for pram

Exactly. Just this.

The gardener and the window cleaner are not required, but I did once let out my house when I went away for a year for work. Please keep the garden maintained. My tenants didn’t ever rake the leaves, and left them on top of the lawn. This killed the lawn in patches and it never recovered. A number of other plants were basically killed. Essentially, it would probably be challenging to enforce getting the garden back in the exact same way as it was left, but it was heartbreaking to see the apocalypse that they visited upon mine.

The terraces near me have a right of access along the back of the houses for bins. Impossible because they've been fenced off for years, but someone wanting to enforce it could be a right PITA. (And they all have access to an alley at the bottom of their gardens)

@TeacupDrama I’m surprised reading back my description that anyone managed to get what I was talking about 😅 but yes, you’re very accurate 😊 properties built on a slope, hence all the stairs. The access path where all the bins are kept is obviously technically part of your garden but actually runs below the garden. If you were relaxing in your garden you’d never know anything about anyone walking along the access unless they were being particularly loud 😊
Thanks for all the replies everyone. I’ll talk to the neighbour when I next see him.

@Lexi334 much better to talk to your neighbour but if it is like that with no fences or gates between front path and back door, i would assume legally that the path is for use any time you want while I would be considerate, do not allow neighbour to say you can't do something you legally can,

Having your outside windows cleaned every 2 weeks is a bit much no matter who pays. I have mine done every month or 6 weeks in winter.
All those rules should have been in the tenancy agreement when you signed it and it's illegal for her to force payments on you which were not disclosed to you or agreed with you before you signed the paperwork.
So...inform the letting agents that you are not paying those bills and will get legal advice if the landlord pursues the matter. YOU are right and she is absolutely wrong.

The watering and upkeep of plants is entirely up the the landlord IF they insist on a certain regime and in that case they have to pay for it to be done.
They can't tell you how to live your life.

It's likely I'm the deeds as a covenant. Very, very common in terraces. OP could easily access the deeds to check.

Oh my days. No way. What a CF.
Very strong letter back is any of this in your AST

Your ll sounds batshit. Clearly she knows she's batshit, or she would have mentioned this manual and all the rules when you met her.

I'd be concerned about the boiler thing. How are you topping up the pressure? Why does that need to be done? I've never heard of that, and I'd be concerned that the boiler was faulty or that me fiddling it would break it or invalidate its insurance.

Any extra costs should be in the contract and should have been agreed on sign up, I don't think I would be too bothered about the watering or pruning but then I live in a terrace so would be a 5 minute job for me but to me that comes under maintenance of property same as cleaning, don't know how big your garden is, dictating how and when you use your garden is daft wondering if there has been problems with previous tenants disturbing the neighbours. Access should also be in contract and already agreed again wondering if been issues with other tenants disturbing the neighbours. The loft part for adjusting pressure seems mad, how does she know you are able to even access it, I have osteo arthritis with bouts of siatica and unsafe for me to use ladders, if that was me I wouldn't be going up to do it. To look at me people wouldn't know and I wouldn't think to mention it, I just get on with it. How does she know you'd even be safe to do that???

We had one of those LL. Although they never hired a gardener we did get a note showed through the door if the tiny patch of grass out the front hadn't been mowed for a couple of weeks

They also used to turn up asking for their mail and constantly needed to go up in the loft to get stuff out.

Didn't stay there long

If she really wants this stuff done, she needs to pay for it herself and include the costs in the rental price.

Fair enough to ask you to water certain plants but she should have done this in person and only at your convenience. It sounds like she loves her garden, so should have tried to find a Tammany willing to take it on.

As for the boiler, she needs to sort out the leak on the system.

It sounds like she’s very personally invested in the property and it’s not really set up for rental.

tennant, what’s a Tammany? 😆

Wow this is madness. I’ve rented many many times and never had anything like this. I hope you get it sorted but I have a feeling your LL isn’t going to be reasonable. Although the fact they didn’t tell you till after you signed suggests they have some awareness of how crazy they are being.

I thought this, too. This is not acceptable. She needs to have this investigated and corrected. There are also valves which can be added to a boiler system to automatically top up, although I’m not sure these are recommended as long term solutions. Having a boiler in the attic is odd in itself.

Given the other things and her general attitude, I’d examine the contract to see how can get out of this place.

I’m a LL. This is not a normal way to behave.

Restrictions to use of garden etc should. Be explicitly pointed out to a potential tenant ahead of signing. A tenant should be able to expect to have full use if all facilities unless expressly pointed out as an unusual arrangement.

The trouble is that this LL is batshit. The list of unreasonable and unmentioned aspects means that even if some of these are awkwardly resolved, this isn’t going to be a smooth tenancy. Unfortunately, I would expect that you will need to move because it won’t be tolerable and other irritating and unreasonable things will emerge to make your life difficult. Top up the boiler fortnightly! Water plants to a schedule! Only use the garden on certain days! These are not requests made by a LL who is allowing their paying tenant quiet enjoyment of the property that has become their home.

It is an enormous fag after you’ve moved in and all the aggravation involved, but I would actually be looking to speak to the LL and tell them that the property has been mis-sold with all these requests becoming evident after the let happened, never pointed out and unreasonable and that it means that the relationship between you is broken - that you would never have signed with a LL who made such requests or considered it reasonable. I would ask to be released from the contract. Otherwise, assuming you have a 6 month AST, give notice onto day before rent day of month 4 and plan to be gone before 6 months are up.. this Will not be a relaxing place to live and sooner you go the better.

It is not acceptable to make specific gardening/watering or very specific cleaning requirements. A general requirement to keep the garden tidy and the house clean is fine, and an expectation that these are in good. Order at the end of the tenancy is fine, but weekly requirements are not acceptable in terms of watering plants etc…

Being a LL only works if you are able to back off from the property and allow the paying tenant to have the home they have paid for and live in it in the way they choose within the realms of sensible.  This means making their own choices about cutting the grass, washing the curtains etc before the end of the tenancy approaches.  LLs are not school boarding house parents directing and controlling their tenants.  They need to back off and let the tenant live their life and have quiet enoyment if the property they pay handsomely for.

If there is a requirement to have a cleaner, Gardner, window cleaner etc this must be explicit in the contract and payment method, frequency and responsibility laid out. Any sensible agent or LL would also verbally point out such clauses with extra payment requirements to a potential tenant to ensure they understand. Of course any sensible tenant insists in a contract and reads it carefully and queries anything unclear in advance of signing.

Yes definitely a leak with the boiler or something faulty inside that needs replacing. Ours did this and we had to top up every day - plumber came and replaced a part inside the boiler. My Landlord would never expect us to just live with it. It's not acceptable to have to top it up that regularly.