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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To care that my children’s great grandparents were first cousins?

303 replies

Antipoodean · 21/05/2022 21:12

Not particularly unusual perhaps, but I come from a very diverse gene pool myself (different hemispheres). I only learnt that my MIL’s parents were first cousins after we had children. Would this bother you? My dcs are healthy and I am not worried about them, I’d have had them
with the knowledge, it’s just a bit disconcerting.

OP posts:
Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 17:47

Mrpunchisagit · 22/05/2022 17:40

Op can no small part of you comprehend that nearly a century ago this was quite common, cars didn’t exist, people didn’t travel, it was not seen as wrong. That today the world is different? However it’s still legal today and actually very common in some cultures.

is there no part of you that can comprehend it didn’t happen today, it happened nearly a century ago and the world was different then?

it feels like you can’t.

I can comprehend it, sure. I can definitely see how it happened and still happens. I’ve not been in the position of my dc and dh’s ancestors, I’ve no idea what it was like for them. Im still allowed to be slightly grossed out by the idea. I don’t think it’s any reflection on my children, husband or MIL, but I still think the relationship between MIL’s parents was a bit yuck. I don’t blame her mother either, I think she was likely preyed upon. From the little I know about their relationship he was an abusive husband and father. I feel sorry for them.

OP posts:
coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/05/2022 17:47

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 17:42

No: why would I? They aren’t siblings. I know plenty of people who married the ‘boy next door’ they were raised with abs no one thinks that’s ‘ick’ so why is that different just because they happen to share a grandparent? It makes no sense logically.

Because you're related to your cousin and not your next door neighbour?

Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 17:48

Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 17:47

I can comprehend it, sure. I can definitely see how it happened and still happens. I’ve not been in the position of my dc and dh’s ancestors, I’ve no idea what it was like for them. Im still allowed to be slightly grossed out by the idea. I don’t think it’s any reflection on my children, husband or MIL, but I still think the relationship between MIL’s parents was a bit yuck. I don’t blame her mother either, I think she was likely preyed upon. From the little I know about their relationship he was an abusive husband and father. I feel sorry for them.

To add again, MIL’s father absolutely did travel.

OP posts:
TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 17:50

MurderAtTheBeautyPageant · 21/05/2022 23:09

are the 'why it it ick?' people okay with the thought of their kid marrying their sibling's kid??

Why wouldn’t I be?

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 17:52

mathanxiety · 22/05/2022 00:44

It wasn't normal or common and it didn't often happen unless your ancestors were members of the aristocracy.

By the 1960s only about 1 in 25,000 London area middle class marriages were between first cousins. In some UK South Asian populations it is much more common than among what is termed white British/white other populations.
newhumanist.org.uk/articles/2133/kissing-cousins

The RC church banned consanguinity in varying degrees beginning around 500 CE, and continues to ban direct line marriages (people directly descended from each other) as well as collateral marriages within four degrees, so no first cousin marriage.

@Antipoodean I share your feeling of ick.

There are some interesting ideas around consanguinity here -
news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2019/11/roman-catholic-church-ban-in-the-middle-ages-loosened-family-ties/
basically suggesting that the RC ban had a psychological effect that spurred the development of the western frame of mind.

Ah yes, because ‘London area middle class’ covers the demographic of everyone in the U.K…🫤

Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 17:52

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 17:50

Why wouldn’t I be?

Do you not accept that this is an unusual mindset? I think marriage between cousins (particularly in western culture) is generally taboo. I would be really interested to know where you live.

OP posts:
Mrpunchisagit · 22/05/2022 17:55

Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 17:52

Do you not accept that this is an unusual mindset? I think marriage between cousins (particularly in western culture) is generally taboo. I would be really interested to know where you live.

Oh my, you really don’t comprehend it, and it’s one hundred percent guaranteed in your lineage rhe same thing occured. It was not taboo a century about. And in may cultures it’s still not taboo today, although it is in many others. But it wasn’t a century ago, and you will have the same your side. Guaranteed.

willstarttomorrow · 22/05/2022 17:56

Quite normal back then, marriage historically was about maintaing or adding to wealth/status, but a romantic concept. European royals for example. In the city next to mine, it is quite usual for some parts of the Pakistani community and this has put a huge strain on health care- although if is a difficult subject to breach. I worked in the regional paediatric haematology and oncology unit for a while and certain conditions were very prevalent. However, I must stress that this a limited population from certain villages- not community wide.

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:00

Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 17:52

Do you not accept that this is an unusual mindset? I think marriage between cousins (particularly in western culture) is generally taboo. I would be really interested to know where you live.

No. I don’t think it’s particularly unusual. I think it’s more unusual to be very concerned about it. I don’t think most people would feel strongly either way.
I live in the U.K.

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:01

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/05/2022 17:47

Because you're related to your cousin and not your next door neighbour?

But if the issue is because you are raised with your cousins like siblings, then that same ‘ick’ should occur for anyone you were raised with like siblings. Otherwise it makes no sense.

MurderAtTheBeautyPageant · 22/05/2022 18:05

I think it’s more unusual to be very concerned about it. I don’t think most people would feel strongly either way.

I really don't agree with this. Most people would have a visceral reaction against it, even if they kept that reaction to themselves.

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/05/2022 18:06

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:01

But if the issue is because you are raised with your cousins like siblings, then that same ‘ick’ should occur for anyone you were raised with like siblings. Otherwise it makes no sense.

No, the ick is because you're related!

DaisyWaldron · 22/05/2022 18:07

My grandparents were first cousins. They grew up on different continents and met at a family wedding in their twenties. My dad and uncle have a genetic illness, but as one in five people from their country carry the gene, it's not particularly unusual for everyone.

OhCrumbsWhereNow · 22/05/2022 18:32

LicoricePizza · 22/05/2022 01:23

But I'm wondering if people who think it's fine would be so accepting of it in the next generation i.e their children

Me too @MurderAtTheBeautyPageant

Genuine question - anyone?

It wouldn't worry me at all from a 'ick' point of view - but then I've only met most of my own first cousins about 5 times in my lifetime, and my DD only sees one cousin regularly as both DH and my family are all spread all over the world.

Possibly it's different if you are close to your siblings and so know your nephews and nieces well.

However, we were told it would be a very bad idea for any further inter-marriage.

FWIW, the genetic condition we saw counsellors for is an autosomal dominant one that was inherited by DH from his maternal line... which is the only one with absolutely zero intermarriage back until at least the 1600s (no records available before them). DD didn't inherit the condition, so it has now died out for any future generations.

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:37

MurderAtTheBeautyPageant · 22/05/2022 18:05

I think it’s more unusual to be very concerned about it. I don’t think most people would feel strongly either way.

I really don't agree with this. Most people would have a visceral reaction against it, even if they kept that reaction to themselves.

This post seems to suggest differently. Most people I know wouldn’t care about it.

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:38

coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/05/2022 18:06

No, the ick is because you're related!

If that’s the ick for you, then fine. But many of the replies here have mentioned it being ‘like a sibling’ and that’s who I’m talking about.

MurderAtTheBeautyPageant · 22/05/2022 18:38

Canvas their opinions then. I suspect you'd find you're mistaken.

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:43

LicoricePizza · 22/05/2022 01:23

But I'm wondering if people who think it's fine would be so accepting of it in the next generation i.e their children

Me too @MurderAtTheBeautyPageant

Genuine question - anyone?

I wouldn’t be bothered by it. Not at all. I have 10 siblings, we each have a minimum of 2 children. Some of them I’ve never met. The only issue would be my one of my brothers children and that’s because he’s deeply unpleasant and I wouldn’t want him inflicted on my child.

RichardOsmansXraySpecs · 22/05/2022 18:54

Mrpunchisagit · 22/05/2022 17:55

Oh my, you really don’t comprehend it, and it’s one hundred percent guaranteed in your lineage rhe same thing occured. It was not taboo a century about. And in may cultures it’s still not taboo today, although it is in many others. But it wasn’t a century ago, and you will have the same your side. Guaranteed.

Of course if you go back long enough we’re all related to each other but it’s not true to say this 100% happened in everyone’s family only a century ago. Granted it was more common especially in smaller communities but it’s not a guarantee, what nonsense.

Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 19:05

RichardOsmansXraySpecs · 22/05/2022 18:54

Of course if you go back long enough we’re all related to each other but it’s not true to say this 100% happened in everyone’s family only a century ago. Granted it was more common especially in smaller communities but it’s not a guarantee, what nonsense.

Yeah, this. I‘m probably very unusual in this, but my parents were from different countries and each of their parents and grandparents were also form different countries, so regardless
of societal norms, it would be going a long way back for me.

OP posts:
RichardOsmansXraySpecs · 22/05/2022 19:08

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:01

But if the issue is because you are raised with your cousins like siblings, then that same ‘ick’ should occur for anyone you were raised with like siblings. Otherwise it makes no sense.

It makes perfect sense. You have the same blood running through your veins. Presumably the boy next door isn’t related and doesn’t share the same dna. It is healthy to widen the gene pool, genetic defects get watered down etc. That’s why opposites attract and why you don’t fancy blokes who look like your brother 🤮
Cousins are still too similar. My niece looks like me and my DS looks like my brother and his DS, It’s just too close.

Antipoodean · 22/05/2022 19:12

RichardOsmansXraySpecs · 22/05/2022 19:08

It makes perfect sense. You have the same blood running through your veins. Presumably the boy next door isn’t related and doesn’t share the same dna. It is healthy to widen the gene pool, genetic defects get watered down etc. That’s why opposites attract and why you don’t fancy blokes who look like your brother 🤮
Cousins are still too similar. My niece looks like me and my DS looks like my brother and his DS, It’s just too close.

That’s it. My cousins look so much like me (on my mum’s side- I have none on my dads side), even given my diverse gene pool there is absolutely no mistaking a genetic connection.

OP posts:
coffeecupsandfairylights · 22/05/2022 19:14

TheOriginalEmu · 22/05/2022 18:38

If that’s the ick for you, then fine. But many of the replies here have mentioned it being ‘like a sibling’ and that’s who I’m talking about.

But the reason people have said it's "like a sibling" is because they mean "I'd never marry a relative" - it's not to do with being raised in close proximity to each other and growing up together.

For most people, the idea of marrying your cousin is no different to the idea of marrying your sibling. You may not be as closely related to your cousin, but the idea is the same - you know you're related and so it's a bit gross.

Whereas you know you're not related to your neighbour so that taboo just doesn't exist.

Mrpunchisagit · 22/05/2022 21:13

Yeah, this. I‘m probably very unusual in this, but my parents were from different countries and each of their parents and grandparents were also form different countries, so regardless of societal norms, it would be going a long way back for me

that is very unusual that all your great grandparents were all from different countries to their spouse. What’s that sixteen of them? All from different countries to the other?

doesn’t matter if it’s going back a long way though, you will also have it in your blood line so I assume you’re jist as Icked put by your own grandparent line?

onlythreenow · 22/05/2022 21:21

Do you not accept that this is an unusual mindset? I think marriage between cousins (particularly in western culture) is generally taboo. I would be really interested to know where you live.

I live in NZ and know of at least two sets of cousin marriages. It really isn't taboo. If it was so terrible then it wouldn't be legal.